Kubota MX 5800 or Deere 4066M

   / Kubota MX 5800 or Deere 4066M #1  

marksmand

Member
Joined
Oct 12, 2016
Messages
47
Location
woodstock NY
Tractor
Kubota L3301
Thinking of upgrading from my L3301. There are similarly priced Mx5800's and 4066M's around.
I think they are both great machines, and I am wondering what people have heard about each of
them. One thing I favor on the Kubota are the larger front tires as I am in mountainous conditions
here in the Catskills. Doing plowing , road maintenance (gravel),some land clearing and bush hogging
a couple of small fields. The l3301 is ok, but lacking the size/HP to do things around here.
Dealers are equally far away so no issue there.
Opinions?
 
   / Kubota MX 5800 or Deere 4066M #2  
The l3301 is ok, but lacking the size/HP to do things around here.

The fundamental importance of tractor weight eludes many tractor shoppers. As most of your applications involve ground contact, concentrate on bare tractor weight.

L3301 = 2,700 pounds bare tractor weight.

MX = 3,700 pounds bare tractor weight.

Deere 4066M = 3,750 pounds bare tractor weight.

All three tractors above are economy models.

It requires a 50% increase in bare tractor weight before you notice an increase in tractor capability. You will notice "some" increase in tractor capability moving up from 2,700 pounds to 3,700 pounds. If you want a "real" increase in tractor capability shop for a tractor with 5,000+ pounds bare tractor weight.





I have owned three tractors. The first a 1,900 pound subcompact "learner" without a Loader. The second a 2,200 pound bare tractor weight tractor-loader package. The third, my 3,600 pound bare weight Kubota L3560, is tractor nirvana in my north Florida conditions. Had I early read a thread philosophizing on tractor weight it would have stimulated tractor weight research and I would have omitted purchase of tractor #2, which proved too light for my applications. I purchased tractor #2 seduced by the allure of nearly double horsepower.

BUY ENOUGH TRACTOR​
 
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   / Kubota MX 5800 or Deere 4066M
  • Thread Starter
#3  
I see your point about weight, but in the conditions around here the MX and the 4066M are about as big as I can go and still be able to maneuver around the steep terrain here as well as squeeze down the old fire roads etc
 
   / Kubota MX 5800 or Deere 4066M #4  
You really couldn't find two more similar tractors of different colors to compare. Darn near identical specs, weight, lift capacities.

What I am saying is there will be very little to no real world difference. If one cannot do it, the other won't do it.

In your case, and similar price.....focus on which tractor fits you. Ergonomics, control locations, etc.

And I disagree with Jeff. Going from a L3301 to a mx5800 is a significant difference. I did the same thing only a generation of tractors prior. I went from a L3400 to a Mx5100.

I constantly felt the 3400 was too small and I was pushing it too hard. The MX is just right
 
   / Kubota MX 5800 or Deere 4066M #5  
Thinking of upgrading from my L3301. There are similarly priced Mx5800's and 4066M's around.
I think they are both great machines, and I am wondering what people have heard about each of
them. One thing I favor on the Kubota are the larger front tires as I am in mountainous conditions
here in the Catskills. Doing plowing , road maintenance (gravel),some land clearing and bush hogging
a couple of small fields. The l3301 is ok, but lacking the size/HP to do things around here.
Dealers are equally far away so no issue there.
Opinions?

You mention plowing, gravel road maintenance, land clearing, and bush hogging a couple of small fields and that the L3301 is too small. You probably want to go for a relatively heavier unit with filled ag tires as you are mentioning mostly ground-engaging tasks. Also you may do better with a gear transmission than a hydrostatic for all of these tasks as a gear transmission is better at "going the same speed all of the time" work such as bush hogging and also is more robust and efficient for doing ground-engaging work such as plowing. The Kubota MX5800/6000 are only available with a hydrostatic transmission so I would eliminate those models. The Deere 4M series and Kubota MX5400 however are available with gear transmissions. The Deere 4M line is available with the 4-speed/3-range PowrReverser hydraulic wet clutch reverser transmission, synchronized on all gears within a range. The Kubota MX5400 is available with a 4-speed/2-range dry clutch fully mechanical transmission which is synchronized only in 3rd and 4th gear. One thing of note for plowing is that the Deere 4 series is not available with draft control but it is an option on the Kubota MX line.

If you want another unit to look at, the LS XR series (also rebranded as the New Holland Boomer and CaseIH Farmall) has a four-range, four-speed synchronized dry clutch gear transmission option. I don't recall if they have draft control (I don't remember seeing this on the one I ran) but they are solid unit as well. The CNH versions are quite pricey though and more along the lines of a Deere 4R in price but closer to a 4M in options. The LS version is more reasonable in price but their dealer network is much sparser.

@jeff9366
A 5000+ pound bare tractor weight would put the OP into a full sized utility tractor, such as a 3 cylinder Deere 5E or Kubota M60 series. I have spent seat time on 2WD and MFWD utility tractors as well as medium and large-framed compacts and will say that:

1) A large-framed compact such as a Deere 4M or Kubota MX will be a noticeable step up from a medium-framed compact L3301, particularly if the larger unit has filled ag tires and the smaller one had any other type of tire (air-filled ags, or any kind of industrial or turf tire.)

2) A 2WD utility tractor with filled ag tires is about the same size and maneuverability as an MFWD large-framed compact with filled tires but you sit about a foot higher and will weigh 1-2 tons more. The utility tractor gets better traction, handles loader loads better, and will in general grossly outwork the compact. The difference is roughly as much as between the medium-sized and the large compact. The real differences here is that the utility tractor will have a gear transmission, few to no electronic gewgaws, will be able to run noticeably larger implements such as standard hay equipment, and a much lower price tag. The compact has the option of a hydrostatic transmission and other electronic features at a much higher price. It often tends to be the transmission and electronics that steer people in their direction.

3) MFWD utility tractors are far less maneuverable than a large-framed compact or 2WD utility tractor as the straight front axle with planetary hubs require front wheels only slightly smaller than the rears on the compact to get any ground clearance under the front differential. This makes for a much wider turning radius. Plus, the loader needs to be located higher and further forward than on the compact or a 2WD unit to clear those front wheels, so the machine ends up being noticeably longer, taller, and more difficult to work with in close quarters. These machines have their uses for sure, but it isn't in a situation where somebody would be cross-shopping any kind of a compact.
 
   / Kubota MX 5800 or Deere 4066M
  • Thread Starter
#6  
I couldn't imagine 2WD around here. Sometimes it's tough getting around with 4WD. Steep hills ice etc.
I am also hesitant to go back to having a clutch again, although I guess they are synchro from forward and reverse. Will have to drive a few. There is a lightly used MX5200 gear drive available nearby
 
   / Kubota MX 5800 or Deere 4066M #7  
One thing of note for plowing is that the Deere 4 series is not available with draft control but it is an option on the Kubota MX line.
So I went and researched what you stated and it appears to be true :eek: I am really shocked at this. Why in the world would Deere not offer draft control on their 4 series tractors??

I have to say that John Deere just does some really dumb things sometimes. You wonder who was stupid enough to sign off on something like this.
 
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   / Kubota MX 5800 or Deere 4066M #8  
You mention plowing, gravel road maintenance, land clearing, and bush hogging a couple of small fields and that the L3301 is too small. You probably want to go for a relatively heavier unit with filled ag tires as you are mentioning mostly ground-engaging tasks. Also you may do better with a gear transmission than a hydrostatic for all of these tasks as a gear transmission is better at "going the same speed all of the time" work such as bush hogging and also is more robust and efficient for doing ground-engaging work such as plowing. The Kubota MX5800/6000 are only available with a hydrostatic transmission so I would eliminate those models. The Deere 4M series and Kubota MX5400 however are available with gear transmissions. The Deere 4M line is available with the 4-speed/3-range PowrReverser hydraulic wet clutch reverser transmission, synchronized on all gears within a range. The Kubota MX5400 is available with a 4-speed/2-range dry clutch fully mechanical transmission which is synchronized only in 3rd and 4th gear. One thing of note for plowing is that the Deere 4 series is not available with draft control but it is an option on the Kubota MX line.

If you want another unit to look at, the LS XR series (also rebranded as the New Holland Boomer and CaseIH Farmall) has a four-range, four-speed synchronized dry clutch gear transmission option. I don't recall if they have draft control (I don't remember seeing this on the one I ran) but they are solid unit as well. The CNH versions are quite pricey though and more along the lines of a Deere 4R in price but closer to a 4M in options. The LS version is more reasonable in price but their dealer network is much sparser.

@jeff9366
A 5000+ pound bare tractor weight would put the OP into a full sized utility tractor, such as a 3 cylinder Deere 5E or Kubota M60 series. I have spent seat time on 2WD and MFWD utility tractors as well as medium and large-framed compacts and will say that:

1) A large-framed compact such as a Deere 4M or Kubota MX will be a noticeable step up from a medium-framed compact L3301, particularly if the larger unit has filled ag tires and the smaller one had any other type of tire (air-filled ags, or any kind of industrial or turf tire.)

2) A 2WD utility tractor with filled ag tires is about the same size and maneuverability as an MFWD large-framed compact with filled tires but you sit about a foot higher and will weigh 1-2 tons more. The utility tractor gets better traction, handles loader loads better, and will in general grossly outwork the compact. The difference is roughly as much as between the medium-sized and the large compact. The real differences here is that the utility tractor will have a gear transmission, few to no electronic gewgaws, will be able to run noticeably larger implements such as standard hay equipment, and a much lower price tag. The compact has the option of a hydrostatic transmission and other electronic features at a much higher price. It often tends to be the transmission and electronics that steer people in their direction.

3) MFWD utility tractors are far less maneuverable than a large-framed compact or 2WD utility tractor as the straight front axle with planetary hubs require front wheels only slightly smaller than the rears on the compact to get any ground clearance under the front differential. This makes for a much wider turning radius. Plus, the loader needs to be located higher and further forward than on the compact or a 2WD unit to clear those front wheels, so the machine ends up being noticeably longer, taller, and more difficult to work with in close quarters. These machines have their uses for sure, but it isn't in a situation where somebody would be cross-shopping any kind of a compact.
You make excellent points and I completely with what you're saying here. However, in Jeff's defense he is trying to drive home the point of weight to the OP. You may not realize how much the weight aspect eludes most tractor newbies. It took a long time before I finally got what Jeff was saying. However, I also think Jeff fails to take into account the sizing aspect at times which is where I appreciated you clearing this up for the OP.
 
   / Kubota MX 5800 or Deere 4066M #9  
So I went and researched what you stated and it appears to be true :eek: I am really shocked at this. Why in the world would Deere not offer draft control on their 4 series tractors??

I have to say that John Deere just does some really dumb things sometimes. You wonder who was stupid enough to sign off on something like this.

Quite a few compacts don't have draft control. I suspect it is not present on smaller tractors due to low demand. Generally people with compact tractors will use a rototiller rather than high draft tillage equipment.
 
   / Kubota MX 5800 or Deere 4066M #10  
Quite a few compacts don't have draft control. I suspect it is not present on smaller tractors due to low demand. Generally people with compact tractors will use a rototiller rather than high draft tillage equipment.
True for the US market. Everywhere else, most tractors come standard with draft control from 30hp and up. These smaller tractors are very handy to use on greenhouse and fruit farms. There are a couple brands offering on 25 hp tractors as well.
 

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