LED bulbs in enclosed fixtures?

RobA · Feb 27, 2019

I have ceiling mounted jelly jar lights in our horse stalls with compact fluorescent bulbs in them. The units are similar to this:

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B000A7UQES/ref=ask_ql_qh_dp_hza

I wanted to put LED bulbs in them but not sure if they would be OK due to the heat produced. The lights say 150 watts max. Some sources say you can do this, some say you can't. Woods sells 2 versions - 1 for incandescent and 1 for LED so there seems to be a difference in how they're made.

Gem99ultra · Feb 27, 2019

I have that exact same fixture overhanging one of our ponds. Absolutely no problem with it. I'm using a 100 watt equivalent bulb in mine.

gsganzer · Feb 27, 2019

I'm not certain, but I think the incandescent versus LED models has to do with whether they have a built in transformer or not. If your LED bulbs have the incandescent bases (screw base), then the transformer is built into the bulb and I would think they would work. Maybe someone can shed some light:laughing:

RNeumann · Feb 27, 2019

Buy a few and try them. I get why some would say it would be tough because of overheating. But the LEDs seem to get better everyday. If it was my place I’d try it.

CobyRupert · Feb 27, 2019

What heat? .....or technically: Watt heat?
Watts is watts! What? :confused3:

Between 85% and 98% of all the wattage of ANY light is turned into heat. A 10 watt LED can only make around 10% of the heat that a 100 watt incandescent can.

If I could somehow use 80%-90% less energy with LED's yet get the same heat off them as their 100Watt incandescent equivalent, I'd heat my house with them! And the neighbors! And the world! I'd be the next Elon Musk, Bill Gates, etc... because I'd just invented a perpetual motion machine!

Low heat output can be a problem with LED traffic lights when they don't melt the snow off themselves.

LS Tractor Owner · Feb 27, 2019

I have them in a few of the 'jelly jar' lights, no problems at all. Just don't exceed the rated watts on the fixture.

CMV · Feb 27, 2019

Answer is - it depends. If they are not suitable for an enclosed fixture they will carry that warning/blurb on the packaging (or in description if getting from Amazon or wherever). Many are just fine, but some get too hot.

Another consideration is the environment. I noticed the Sylvania (or Phillips? forget but some common brand name in an orange & light gray box) ones that are pretty inexpensive at WM were great indoors, in any fixture without a dimmer. No flicker, last a long time (none have failed except on a dimmer even though it stayed on full), and was happy with them. However, in our outdoor lights, they fail pretty quick (about a year or less) - esp over winter. They seem to dislike the cold since none failed in warmer months. So unless you want a floodlight shape bulb, might have a hard time finding one rated for enclosure AND outdoor. Might not be an issue - I don't know how much climate control a horse barn has, nor if other brands aren't cold-sensitive like the inexpensive ones I got.

Just make sure it is 14W or more if you want a 100W or higher equivalent. You will see a lot (esp on amazon) advertised as 100W equivalent but are 9-12W - will be more like a 60-75W incandescent in that case leading to disappointment due to misleading advertising.

PILOON · Feb 27, 2019

Very little heat will be radiated, in fact probably 80-90% less.
Go for it!
One plus is less dead flys will accumulate, not hot enough!

CMV · Feb 27, 2019

Saw the 2 above mine after posting....

Rated watts on fixture - that's for an incandescent bulb. If you have a 40W rated fixture for a small table lamp you could put a 150W equivalent LED in it - it the actual watts, not the "equivalent" for an LED bulb.

Heat - it is an issue with many of them, but not the diode itself. Early adopters really faced this challenge - remember when they had fins & little heatsinks? The transformer generates heat. But you are very correct that a 10W LED itself isn't generating much heat on it's own. But the transformers do heat up. That's why a lot of older ones you could only install pointing "up" or "sideways" but installed "upside down" they'd overheat and fail. Also why some today say they are not for enclosed fixtures - they can get too hot and fail early without some way for the heat to escape. That is becoming less common and fewer cannot tolerate being mounted in any fixture, any direction, but they are still out there. Many more cannot tolerate a dimmer at all. Even on full all the time - I'm not smart enough to explain why (you'd think a dimmer set on full and never touched would be same as no dimmer at all?) - but if not rated for a dimmer, it will have a short life if one in the mix.

EddieWalker · Feb 27, 2019

If you already have compact florescent bulbs in there, then switching to LED would give you a lot less heat then you are already dealing with. Compact florescent bulbs are not supposed to be used upside down on a ceiling, they will last a long time when used upright, but when upside down, they create a lot of heat and fail fairly quickly.

homesteader13 · Feb 27, 2019

RobA said:
I have ceiling mounted jelly jar lights in our horse stalls with compact fluorescent bulbs in them. The units are similar to this:

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B000A7UQES/ref=ask_ql_qh_dp_hza

I wanted to put LED bulbs in them but not sure if they would be OK due to the heat produced. The lights say 150 watts max. Some sources say you can do this, some say you can't. Woods sells 2 versions - 1 for incandescent and 1 for LED so there seems to be a difference in how they're made.

I have these fixtures in my walk-in cooler and freezer and have had LED bulbs in them for years with no issues.

shooterdon · Feb 27, 2019

If in doubt, a call/email to the manufacturer is the best bet. Common sense tells me what others have said...heat is heat. I would install LED's.

dmccarty · Feb 27, 2019

I have been putting LEDs, either "normal" or R30/R40 bulbs in our ceiling can fixtures without a problem. Some of the ceiling can fixtures are in the bathroom and have a glass "lens" over the can opening to comply with building code.

The can fixtures are insulation contact rated and at least 100w if not 150w.

Later,
Dan

bunyip · Feb 27, 2019

Not all use a transformer, a lot use capacitors for voltage drop as I discovered when a few exploded because the caps were rated at 100v yet sold to us as AU compliant, we are 220v.
Also no relatioship with watts to lumens output with LED like the incandescant light.
We have downlights at work which utilise switchmode transformers but these are in line and part of the assembly.

atsah · Feb 27, 2019

It use to be the "CREE" LED was okay inside an enclosed fixture but today IDK..

Industrial Toys · Feb 27, 2019

I do the same. I like not having to change the fixtures, only the screw in bulbs. There is going to be a lot of junk in the garbage when so many of these new LED fixtures fail.

My biggest issue is that the LED screw in bulbs do not shut off totally when controlling them with an Electronic switch.

Diggin It · Feb 27, 2019

On the flip side, what I've been doing in some cases is using recessed conversion LED units. The jelly jar fixture would be removed completely. The new unit fits inside the 4" recessed ceiling box that the jelly jar fixture is wired to. An integrated trim ring covers the mess. The light output and dispersal pattern is equal to or better.

dieselscout80 · Feb 27, 2019

I've had one or two where the outer globe of the LED (makes it look like a incandescent bulb) come loose in enclosed interior lights in the house. I glued them back in place and they still work.

Trillium Farm · Feb 27, 2019

RobA said:
I have ceiling mounted jelly jar lights in our horse stalls with compact fluorescent bulbs in them. The units are similar to this:

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B000A7UQES/ref=ask_ql_qh_dp_hza

I wanted to put LED bulbs in them but not sure if they would be OK due to the heat produced. The lights say 150 watts max. Some sources say you can do this, some say you can't. Woods sells 2 versions - 1 for incandescent and 1 for LED so there seems to be a difference in how they're made.

Those covers were there to prevent hay dust or any dust settling on the bulb to ignite and cause a barn fire. LED do not produce heat, you are confusing halogen with LED. If you do have LED i'd not worry about heat.