Livestock question. Babies or no babies?

   / Livestock question. Babies or no babies? #1  

EddieWalker

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May 26, 2003
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Location
Tyler, Texas
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Several, all used and abused.
I'm still clearing my fence line, so this is just pure research. My original plan was to raise livestock by having one or two males, and the rest females for the maximum stocking rate that I can get on my land. A client runs 20 heifers on his 60 acres and one bull, but rotates the bull and had two bulls when I was there last. Almost all of his cows had babies. A few didn't a few did, but they died, and a few had twins.

This is just me thinking here, and I know there are some holes in my though process. But this is what I'm working on.

So lets say he had 20 cows give birth to 20 babies. He sells all those babies for $400 and makes $8,000.

Now if one person bought all 20 babies and paid the $8,000, would it be reasonable to expect that person to be able to sell them for $1,000 each in a year for $12,000 profit and not have to deal with birthing cattle?

That's not what I want to do, but it's what got me to thinking about what I really want to do, and that's raise exotic deer.

I can buy does for $400 each and depending on the age of the buck, get them for that price on up. A year later I could have 20 babies that are worth $400 each, but if I keep them longer, their value increases. Now with deer, I can have more per ace then cattle. How many more is also part of the equation that I'm unsure of breeders that stock ten per acre and feed them seven days a week. Others are about half that. I'm thinking less then two per acre, or about 100 on my land.

If those deer have 20 babies, and they are split half boys, half girls. The girls will always be worth $400 each no matter how old they get, so it's best to keep the breeders and get rid of the extra. That leave ten more males to feed. Every year they go up in value with age five being where the big money is. After five years, I should be able to sell ten girls, and ten mature males. Males that old sell for $2,000 quickly, and something exceptional can sell for twice that, but for simple math, I'll stick with $2,000 each. So that's $24,000 per year once I get to year five. This would mean stocking close to 100 deer on 60 acres

Now this is where I get confused. What if I just bought 20 boys every year. In five years, I would have 20 mature boys to sell at $40,000. My feed bill should be the same either way. I wouldn't be dealing with birthing, and predator loss would decrees significantly. Deducting the cost of $8,000 to buy those 20 per year, my profit after feeding and everything else still seems significantly higher then it would be if I was breeding the deer and raising babies.

Does this make sense? Why doesn't everyone do this if it makes sense? If I'm correct in my thinking, would it make sense to raise a more expensive animals that sells for $2,000 as a baby, but sells for $8,000 in five years?
 
   / Livestock question. Babies or no babies? #2  
Sounds to me like you need some of that there "math" that has all them letters in it.

I'm not your guy.

Day 32,536 without having to do ALGEBRA!

:laughing:
 
   / Livestock question. Babies or no babies? #3  
Eddie the math sounds good and reminds me of a successful rancher . With his wife being a school teacher and he had a good job at gas company and the ranch covered several acres . of low land where the grass was reliable each year.
So the wife needing a new vehicle. he gathered up his finical papers . and contacted a his banker to borrow the money. at the bank the loan officer looked over the papers and asked what type of auto did the wife want.?
His reply was a midrange Chevrolet. and the banker suggested a Cadillac and the young ranch replied want didn't want that expensive auto the chev. would be good. and the banker said it would of been easier to deny the loan and not going to loan for the car either.

Your figures if were Peaches and cream . would be nice. if so every one would already be doing it.
Just keep your day job for a few more years.
ken
 
   / Livestock question. Babies or no babies? #4  
Feed, marketing, vet costs, morbidity/mortality, overheads, etc, to name a few will cut into those profits. Also consider, that if you are thinking of it, others are also, and so by the time your business matures, the market might be saturated, driving prices down.

Make sure you buy in good genetics - good disease resistance, lungs, and legs. Nothing will suck more than having sickly offspring.
 
   / Livestock question. Babies or no babies? #6  
I know around here a calf does not go for close to that, but I am talking a common beef cow. Not with special genetics. Are you making you own hay??? Around here hay can be $3 a bale and our cows can be inside eating for 5 months easy. At minimal 1/2 bale a day per cows we often go through 700 bales a winter for around 10 cows. We sell 2 or 3 a year for beef at 3.50$ a pound and NEVER EVER make a profit even making our own hay. Grain , gas and the butcher bill for our beef negates any profits. The overhead and time involved is more than you think.
 
   / Livestock question. Babies or no babies? #7  
Not a whole lot of beef around here, but people who raise pigs, goats or chickens seem to specialize either in breeding or raising. So one guy will specializing in producing weaned piglets and another guy will buy weaned piglets and raise them for slaughter. My limited experience leads me to believe that you need facilities for breeding, birthing and weaning, and that if you have those facilities you want to get as much use out of them as you can. So it's more profitable to increase your number of breeders and sell the offspring than to devote the space to raising the offspring.

The age-old problem of small herds is maintaining genetic diversity. From what I've read you need a minimum of 100 individuals to maintain diversity, otherwise they're all going to end up related to each other and inbred. For a smaller herd you need to bring in a new male each season. Keeping a male year-round that only serves a few females is an expensive proposition too. It's a lot easier if you live in an area with lots of other people raising the same animal so it's easy to find a stud and trade around with your neighbors.
 
   / Livestock question. Babies or no babies? #8  
The other question in my mind is, male cattle get ornery. With handlers, and other males. Would that not also be the case with deer? You are already irritated with ornery horses...why would you want to willingly compound your problems?

If raising for meat, there are ways to address that issue, but not if you are raising to use or sell as breeding stock.

Just another variable to add into your algebra...
 
   / Livestock question. Babies or no babies?
  • Thread Starter
#9  
Thank you for your replies. From what you have said, I failed miserably in my explanation. Good thing this is just part of the thinking process, and I have plenty of time to work out all the details.
 
   / Livestock question. Babies or no babies? #10  
Eddie,

Texas A&M is a great resource.* Here's a link to A&M's cow-calf and stocker enterprise budgets -- Budgets by Commodity | Extension Agricultural Economics.


http://publications.tamu.edu/FORAGE/PUB_Forage Management for Non-Native Deer Farming.pdf provides info on forage management for non-native deer. It also references Non-Native Deer Farming Symposium Proceedings, but a brief search failed to turn up that publication online.

I advise you to contact your local Cooperative Extension agent. He/she should be able to put you in contact with an Extension specialist who can answer your questions about exotic deer.


Steve

* In addition, it's the basis for Aggie jokes, some of which (the really good ones) cannot be told in polite society. :)
 
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