More Confused than Ever and ready to Buy

RickeyL · Jun 15, 2003

Have 7 acres, 3/4 acres of lawn and the rest woods and ravines. I plan on mostly cleaning out the groves of trees, putting in some trails to the river that is about 3/4 miles away, (mostly on someone elses property, they don't care), lots of leveling, landscaping, moving dirt around, snow removal on 350 foot frive, site prep for a few buildings and a small dam some day in one of the ravines.
I've narrowed my search to Kioti CK-20, Kubota B-7500 and the PT-422 or 425. Attatched is a spreadsheet I did to give me an idea of what was important to me in regards to picking the right tractor for me. ( I know a bigger tractor would be better for some of these projects but feel more comfoprtable with the size of those I've chosen, and they are more maneuverable among the trees and things.
Anyhow, the spreadsheet has done nothing but confuse me more...... I'm ready to toss a coin...... obviously, price and financing are ranking up there in my current financial situation but could scrape together funds if I thought the long term investment warranted the decision.........
I NEED HELP.......... any suggestions or thoughts guys?

RickeyL · Jun 15, 2003

The Excell spreadsheet in text form is a little confusing to read but basically what I did was assign each of the factors that were important to me a number from 1 to 5 (one being poor and 5 being excellent) and then I factored in a percentage of importance to each of the factors......... all said and done..... they all were almost exactly the same. Wasn't much of a help for this analytical brain......... I shop way too much..... think the answer is to just buy locally and be done with it......

MossRoad · Jun 15, 2003

Could you possibly post the Excel spread sheet? I think TBN will take one. It loses something in the translation to text.

Sounds like you are in a dilemma. Hang in there, step back and take a deep breath. If you can't decide, go test drive some more. Sometimes that helps. Above all, take as much time as you need to make a comfortable decision. All of the units that you mentioned are very capable tractors so it will be about impossible for you to make a "bad" decision.

smartguyz · Jun 15, 2003

Hi Rick -

I was in your shoes about 2 weeks ago. I was trying to decide which Kubota to buy, basically. If the dealer had brought a BX2200 by 2 weeks ago, I probably would have it in the garage right now.

However, the last 2 weeks have made a huge difference. I had never seen the PTs. Being an engineer, I was also very analytical - it drives my poor wife crazy, but she puts up with me. /forums/images/graemlins/laugh.gif The guys on this forum have been spectacular in answering questions, often in great detail. Thanks, guys!

At this point, I am committed to purchasing a PT. I have had several of my engineer friends look over the 'traditional' design tractors vs. the PT (425), and every time the PT wins the fight. I think the biggest factor is the sheer flexibility, coupled with what I perceive to be much much easier servicing and use. MossRoad's website is a gem, and helped a lot. Some of his reasoning echos my own - I prefer gas - diesel tends to make me nauseous, although the newer models are much improved over the old ones from 20 years ago.

I have what is commonly considered one of the very best garden tractors ever made - a Deere 318, (I also looked at the new 2210 - very aggressive pricing and financing). I really like my local Deere dealer - great guys. In the end, having owned a Deere, and having torn the thing down to the frame and restored it, I believe that the Deere is very well built - I believe the Kubota is as well.

However, the final analysis (for me) comes down to superior design. The concept of a rugged engine, mounted to a thick steel chassis, driving NOTHING but hydraulics, is a compelling concept for me. NO transmission. NO differentials. NO transaxel. NO steering rack. A LOT less to break down (I think) is compelling to me. Being able to purchase attachments at such a low price point is compelling for me. Being able to stay with a gas engine is compelling for me. Being able to fix things without too much fuss and bother (assuming PT stays around) myself is compelling. Having attachments that you can't get on any other tractor is compelling to me (forks, a brush hog that you can place at almost any angle, a mini-hoe that is under a K-buck). Being able to pick up any attachment to clean it is compelling to me (I dread having to clean the bottom of my 318's 50" deck - getting it off takes a lot of grunting, and then moving it to the side of the lawn and flipping it upside down is a colossal pain - the concept of just having the lift arms flip it up and let me hose if down is HUGE, in my eyes - ditto the brush hog). Making my own attachments. I could go on.

The things that hold me back?
Shipping Costs. Single Sourced. No test drive. Manufacturer is 3500 miles away. No financing.

Anyway - I'm close to buying one based on my assessments. Look at what you need to do. Would you need some of the other implements? For example, I am planning to buy a power brush. Sure, Deere STILL makes one for my 17 year old 318, but it costs substantially more than the one from PT, and it looks like a huge pain to hook up and take off. The thought of actually having one that can go on and off in seconds is very very compelling.

OK, it's late, and I've rambled enough. Good luck in your decision. /forums/images/graemlins/tongue.gif

jol1269 · Jun 15, 2003

ok im pretty well sold on gettng the pt 425 .and if by chance pt god forbid that happening would any of the pt owners still have accesss to things like wheel motors from another supplier and if so how would you know exactley which componet to get as im not a hydr. expert or even a novice yet . the other question i have is replacement parts have any of you guys ever bent the lift arms on your machine as in the pic they look kinda narrow to me ..i havent seen one yet so it may be different in person also would changing the tire size to one with a higher side wall give you higher lift capacity . in readin the other post i saw that the kohler site has the engine that is used on the 425 ..id like to see those specs as well what motor model is this on the 425 ......wainting on the call from pt so i can get mine /forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif

MossRoad · Jun 15, 2003

Man if you bent the loader arms you would also probably have bent your teeth on the steering wheel. Those things are tough. Very thick plate steel. I imagine if you put a very tremendous side load on them you might be able to bend them, but I believe the tractor would scoot sideways before the arms bent.

If you changed the tire size to larger, you would decrease the torque but raise the top sped. I doubt you could get much additional lift out of it.

Charlie_Iliff · Jun 16, 2003

I imagine if you put a very tremendous side load on them you might be able to bend them, but I believe the tractor would scoot sideways before the arms bent.


I think it would have to be a collision. Although my 1845 is bigger, and the arms scaled up, Terry Estep suggested an interesting test when I was trying to identify a steering squeak. To confirm that the steering circuit was working with design authority, he suggested wedging the bucket or other attachment into a pile of snow, with the tires on dry pavement, and then turning back and forth. If the steering had sufficient authority to slide the front wheels, it was working properly. It did so easily, with no visible deflection of the lift arms. Vertically, in the larger dimension of the arms, it is routine to pick up the rear of the machine - again without visible deflection.
They're stout.

MossRoad · Jun 16, 2003

To confirm that the steering circuit was working with design authority, he suggested wedging the bucket or other attachment into a pile of snow, with the tires on dry pavement, and then turning back and forth. If the steering had sufficient authority to slide the front wheels, it was working properly. 

Well, there you have it! /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif

Sedgewood · Jun 16, 2003

If the steering had sufficient authority to slide the front wheels, it was working properly. It did so easily, with no visible deflection of the lift arms. Vertically, in the larger dimension of the arms, it is routine to pick up the rear of the machine - again without visible deflection.


I'll second the above.

Sedgewood

Anonymous Poster · Jun 16, 2003

With the backhoe on the front of the 1845 I could swing fully to either side and begin digging and when I hooked into something really big it would drag the machine - (as opposed to bend the arms) and this is a direct side load on the arms - Bending the arms would not be high on my list of worries