Actually, the 30K budget is just a place holder. If I have to go more, I will. The ToolCat is #1 so far, on paper, on my list. It seems to have all the functionality I need. My concerns with it are the fact that it has wheels rather than a track (like one model of the BobCat itself) and how those wheels will act in hard winter weather. I suspect that if I go the ToolCat path I will need to put chains on it. And the second is the HP. At 8000+ feet how much of a HP hit will it take and will what's left be enough.
Novice with 36 acres
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bam747
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The Toolcat 5600 has a 48 HP Kubota engine. Using the 3% per 1000 feet rule of thumb for HP loss versus your 8000' altitude (discussed a lot on TBN), that ends up being effectively 36.5 HP (48 * (1 - (.03 * 8))).
The Toolcat 5600 Turbo has a 58 HP Kubota turbocharged engine. Turbo motors loose very little HP versus altitude, so this means you actually get most of that 56 HP.
Since by definition you will be pushing any snow removal implement ahead of the Toolcat, its tires will not have to dig through deep snow. If you look at the Bobcat website, you can find a lot of information and articles on using Bobcat equipment, and specifically the Toolcat, for snow removal.
Also, the Toolcat 5600 Turbo weighs 4820 lbs with no attachments. In the case of moving snow, weight is your ally. Still, I'd have a set of 4 chains around. At least the Toolcat's tires are relatively small so the chains will be fairly inexpensive. Note that the down side to using chains is that if you run them on paved or concrete driveways, they can mark up the surface, especially if you spin the tires.
BTW, with your annual 180" (or 15 FEET!) of snow fall, I'm thinking you'll really want to use the high flow (I believe the 5600 Turbo Toolcat includes the high flow option) snow blower attachment so you don't have to worry about where to pile up all that snow for the whole winter. And at 8000' in Colorado, that snow will be around all winter.
The Toolcat 5600 Turbo has a 58 HP Kubota turbocharged engine. Turbo motors loose very little HP versus altitude, so this means you actually get most of that 56 HP.
Since by definition you will be pushing any snow removal implement ahead of the Toolcat, its tires will not have to dig through deep snow. If you look at the Bobcat website, you can find a lot of information and articles on using Bobcat equipment, and specifically the Toolcat, for snow removal.
Also, the Toolcat 5600 Turbo weighs 4820 lbs with no attachments. In the case of moving snow, weight is your ally. Still, I'd have a set of 4 chains around. At least the Toolcat's tires are relatively small so the chains will be fairly inexpensive. Note that the down side to using chains is that if you run them on paved or concrete driveways, they can mark up the surface, especially if you spin the tires.
BTW, with your annual 180" (or 15 FEET!) of snow fall, I'm thinking you'll really want to use the high flow (I believe the 5600 Turbo Toolcat includes the high flow option) snow blower attachment so you don't have to worry about where to pile up all that snow for the whole winter. And at 8000' in Colorado, that snow will be around all winter.
I agree with what you have said. It is my intention to get a snow thrower attachment regardless of what I go with. Sometimes we will get measured snowfall of over 4 feet and I wouldn't want to be pushing that snow. Talk about needed HP! The drive will be gravel so chains wouldn't be an issue.
Kyle_in_Tex
Super Star Member
I guess if you can afford it, it will sure save a bunch of neck- craning! Which in turn can save on chiropractic bills. /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif
bam747
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Clearing a 4 foot dump in one pass? Ouch! /forums/images/graemlins/shocked.gif
Well, there are blowers that can eat that up all in one shot. See the big single or double or triple(!) auger Loftness snow blowers at this site. I have their brochure and they show some pretty impressive capabilities of their bigger blowers. You can download their brochure and pricing if you're interested. They also have an interesting video if you've got a broadband connection.
'Course, you'll need a 105+ PTO HP tractor to power the larger "standard duty" blowers. Plan on 150+ PTO HP for the "heavy duty" double auger models. You'll need 180+ PTO HP for the really big boy triple auger "industrial duty" 72" cutting height model! I'm thinking that'll be just a "tad" outside of a $30K budget! /forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif
Meanwhile, back in the real world, using a Toolcat Turbo with a high flow blower, you'd have to get out in the 4' storm and keep ahead of it a foot or two at a time. With the nice enclosed and heated Toolcat cab, that shouldn't be a big deal. And, up at your altitude in Colorado, the snow should normally be the light powdery stuff that will blow really well.
Well, there are blowers that can eat that up all in one shot. See the big single or double or triple(!) auger Loftness snow blowers at this site. I have their brochure and they show some pretty impressive capabilities of their bigger blowers. You can download their brochure and pricing if you're interested. They also have an interesting video if you've got a broadband connection.
'Course, you'll need a 105+ PTO HP tractor to power the larger "standard duty" blowers. Plan on 150+ PTO HP for the "heavy duty" double auger models. You'll need 180+ PTO HP for the really big boy triple auger "industrial duty" 72" cutting height model! I'm thinking that'll be just a "tad" outside of a $30K budget! /forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif
Meanwhile, back in the real world, using a Toolcat Turbo with a high flow blower, you'd have to get out in the 4' storm and keep ahead of it a foot or two at a time. With the nice enclosed and heated Toolcat cab, that shouldn't be a big deal. And, up at your altitude in Colorado, the snow should normally be the light powdery stuff that will blow really well.
bam747
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By the way, given that the snow blower on a Toolcat is mounted out front on its loader and it has a hydrostatic drive, you can always eat your way through some pretty deep snow if you think "vertical" in stead of "horizontal".
For example, drive the blower a foot or two into 4+ feet of snow, then curl the blower back and lift it up to carve its way vertically through the deep snow. Bring the blower back down to the ground, level it, and do it all again.
It might take a while, but I don't see any fundamental reason, given time, that you couldn't deal with some pretty deep snow or snow drifts that way. 'Course, I wouldn't want to clear out a half mile or more of 4' deep snow that way! Hence the keep ahead of it technique.
For example, drive the blower a foot or two into 4+ feet of snow, then curl the blower back and lift it up to carve its way vertically through the deep snow. Bring the blower back down to the ground, level it, and do it all again.
It might take a while, but I don't see any fundamental reason, given time, that you couldn't deal with some pretty deep snow or snow drifts that way. 'Course, I wouldn't want to clear out a half mile or more of 4' deep snow that way! Hence the keep ahead of it technique.
I appreciate all the information. I used to live in Monument Colorado for over 7 years. I ate through that blizzard of about 7-8 years ago that dumped over 4' of snow on us with a Sears snowthrower (albet a large one!) So I have to believe that the snow thrower attachement that goes with either the ToolCat or BobCat will be enough. You're right. You just have to eat away a little at a time. /forums/images/graemlins/smirk.gif
bam747
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Just curious...
Made any decisions yet? Won't be too much longer before it starts snowing up there at 8000 feet in Colorado! /forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif
FYI, it would appear that Bobcat has extended the free cab enclosure with HVAC through the end of October 2005.
Made any decisions yet? Won't be too much longer before it starts snowing up there at 8000 feet in Colorado! /forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif
FYI, it would appear that Bobcat has extended the free cab enclosure with HVAC through the end of October 2005.
