Own an old 90s BCS 737...am I now locked into buying a future Grillo???

[jcraftenworth]

So I own an old BCS 737 and it's working pretty well for me (the only irritating thing is that while it seems to runs well, it is too hard to start by pull so I need a powerful cordless drill, socket adapter and 27mm socket to use as a redneck engine starting device). But, the pto system is the same type that Grillo uses today, and all my implements that I own are either native for my pto system, or have been converted to work with my pto system.

I own a combo BCS brushcutter mower, a BCS old style ~40" sickle bar mower, an old BCS 20" tiller, a modern 30" grillo tiller, Aldo Biagioli 36” Dozer/Snow Blade, and a Berta rotary plow. So I believe all of these implements will work with no trouble if in the future I buy a new Grillo tractor. If I get a BCS, it's going to cost me a lot of money to buy new quickhitch pto adapters (which I already own for nearly all of my implements), and everything except the combo mower would need the pto conversion to make grillo style implements work with the modern BCS pto, but I believe it's possible to convert things. So, if I wanted a new BCS, I think we are talking about some real money and hassle to switch my implements to work on BCS.

What do you guys think? Would you let your current suite of implements dictate what tractor you buy in the future? Or, since it is possible to make my implements work with a BCS, would you go the extra mile, spend the money to make it all work and still choose BCS? Frankly I'm not totally sold on this new style hydraulic clutch to be honest...but maybe by the time I'm ready to upgrade, it will already be a proven and durable design?

 

[Jens767]

Hi Jcraftenworth

If all your nice implements will fit a new Grillo tractor, I would go for one of those, and safe myself a lot of work. The right person to ask this question though, is for sure Joel at Earth Tools. He has a lot of knowledge in both brands, and will be able to give you first class advice.

You have probably read the thread about the PowerSafe clutch already? I have a 2011 model BCS 740 with the PowerSafe clutch, and I have used it for almost 200 hours now, and been very pleased with its performance.


Best regards

Jens

 

[freedomlives]

I guess the bigger question is, why do you need to upgrade? Other than these new clutches, what else would push you? Motors can always be replaced, also there should be spare parts in case you strip a gear-- I was able to get these for my 30 year old Goldoni without a problem.

 

[joecoin]

I agree with freedomlives, get a new engine if that's all that is wrong.

Another concern; Grillos will not engage the PTO when in reverse (at least my 107D does not), I believe the BCS will work in reverse?


On the other hand, Grillos are less costly pound for pound and seem to be well built. I abuse mine on a regular basis and it has held up very well.

 

[saxnbees]

I agree with Joe and Freedom. If the 737 still works fine except for the engine, just replace the engine. Joel at EarthtoolsBCS.com sells professional grade replacement engines and can make sure you get all of the proper fittings to make it work properly.

If you really have your heart set on a new machine, I can personally state that I love my Grillo G110. I have had it for several years now and use it at least as much as my Kioti NX4510. And, no, the PTO does not run in reverse, but some would say that is a safety feature especially if you have a tiller mounted. When I use the rotary mower I have not really found that to be an issue. I tend to only cut in forward anyway. I don't want to be backing up into brush to cut it. And, you still can cut a little in reverse because the blades continue to spin for a period of time and can still cut some lighter brush with the stored kinetic energy.

If you want a new machine, I'm sure Joel would be more than happy to help you out. I have been extremely satisfied with their customer service. Joel can help you pick out the machine that is right for you depending upon your needs.

 

[Maine Hills]

You could bolt a BCS new tractor - old attachment adapter to a new BCS tractor and use your old attachments. Leave the adapter on the tractor when you swap implements so only one adapter would be needed. BCS America

The PTO on BCS tractors stay engaged in reverse when the handlebars are over the engine and the attachment is in front of the tractor. However when the handlebars are over the attachment the PTO disengages when the tractor is shifted into reverse.

 

[saxnbees]

Actually, I want to amend my previous post.

My G110 actually will run the PTO in reverse if there is an implement on the front. But the PTO actually will turn in the opposite direction. I believe the BCS machines have gearing that causes the PTO to always turn in the same direction independent of the tractor direction. The implement makers work around this by building a ratchet mechanism into their devices. When the tractor is put into reverse, the PTO also reverses direction but the ratchet causes the implement to ignore that. Where I have seen an issue is with an implement like my BIO-90 chipper. It does not have a ratchet so I have to be cognizant of the direction the tractor is set to. If I forget the tractor direction is reverse (although the tractor drive is in neutral), the chipper will run in reverse and not chip. It's not a big deal. I just release the clutch, let the chipper stop spinning, change the direction, and re-engage the chipper. I do believe I read somewhere that the hay balers have a problem with the PTO direction but I don't envision a need for a baler.

If your implements are all BCS, they may not have the necessary ratchet mechanism and that may cause problems. I suggested to Joel that a ratchet in a PTO adapter might be nice. In this instance, it might actually be required to use your old implements. I have not heard anything further on this suggestion.

When an implement is on the back of my G110, there is a mechanism that actually kicks the PTO out of gear so that it will not run. If you slip up while in reverse, the tiller will not be turning so I would consider that a safety feature. For something like a roto-tiller, you will have to re-engage the PTO after backing up with the tractor. I do not know if all of the Grillos have this same design. I have not found this to be an issue. Unless I run into some sort of problem, I just continually run the tractor forward and spin it on a dime at the end of the row. That is where the differential really shines.

I am sure Joel can answer any question you have. Let him know your situation and ask his advice. In my dealings with Joel, I have perceived him to be open and honest. I have not seen him try to oversell. I believe he makes recommendations according to customer need and not a desire to sell the largest tractor or implement possible.

 

[jcraftenworth]

You could bolt a BCS new tractor - old attachment adapter to a new BCS tractor and use your old attachments. Leave the adapter on the tractor when you swap implements so only one adapter would be needed. BCS America

The PTO on BCS tractors stay engaged in reverse when the handlebars are over the engine and the attachment is in front of the tractor. However when the handlebars are over the attachment the PTO disengages when the tractor is shifted into reverse.

Yeah I was wondering if something like this was possible, just have one adapter and leave it on the tractor.

I Have a grillo tiller and grillo adapted (green painted and all) rotary plow, I don't know whether they have a ratchet mechanism in them but I do know they are rear mounted implements, and when in this tractor configuration on my BCS 737, the reverse is physically locked out if the pto is engaged I believe. As a safety mechanism.

Anyway I bought a chinese Yanmar clone engine, generally read positive comments on them on forums and youtube videos where people put them in old riding lawnmowers. So when I get some cash and time it is my plan to upgrade to this 10hp Yanmar clone on my BCS 737. I suppose unless something catastrophic happened on my BCS 737 I'd just stick with it. Oh yeah Joel said 10hp diesel is a bit above the power recommended to power my PTO system. I'm overruling that suggestion and will live dangerously. 10hp diesel can't be that much more than 10hp gas imo. The websites suggest it's equivalents to a 12 or 13 hp gas I guess.

 

[Maine Hills]

BCS tractors lock out the PTO when in reverse with the handlebars over the implement. If the PTO is engaged and the tractor is shifted into reverse with the handlebars over the implement the PTO disengages. Also if PTO is engage when the handlebars (actually the shifter control rod) are swung to the implement end the PTO disengages.

 

[jcraftenworth]

I'm not sure if my 737 works that way, it has a physical system to prevent the reverse handle from being pressed when the pto is turned on. Which makes me think the pto could be running while in reverse, if I removed that physical safety system off my machine.