PHD tried to dig to China and take my tractor with it...

[KeithInSpace]

Is it supposed to do that? Maybe the PHD was just trying to get home?

Was using it for the first time at a neighbor's house (we barter favors back and forth...they watch my dogs once in a while). I have a 9" auger bit. First 18" went pretty good, then it bit into something and just went STRAIGHT down like a drywall screw. The ground is a pretty heavy, red, compacted clay, but I had the drop rate of the 3PH choked WAY down on the dial. It was dropping perhaps 2" a minute at the bit. I was running about 1/3 throttle or a smidge more.

I tried lifting it out, but I couldn't get enough lift force on that long boom arm.

Through a bit of manual labor, I was able to remove the bit, but it wasn't too much fun.

Is this one of those freak things that happens once in a while? Or is something I need to be specifically aware of to avoid? There were no rocks obvious in the hole or in the spoils. The only thing was a small bit of half-petrified tree root matter, but they amounted to twigs that weren't over 1/2" in diameter. The area was a fill slope adjacent to his house.

Just trying to get a read on this so I can perhaps modify my method before doing more holes. It was no fun extracting that auger bit by hand.

 

[big bubba]

It's probably common, doing what it's designed to do. I have read on the PHD manuals not to try to uplift the hydraulics too much if in a bind. hopefully shear pins would do what they're supposed to. On mine, I just ease the hyd. lever downward (going up & down) slowly rather than all at once, and keep the engine just above idle, rather than 540 pto rpm. bb

 

[jinman]

Go as quickly as you can to the nearest Kubota dealer and buy a bigger tractor. Something in the neighborhood of 50 hp will stop this problem from ever happening again.

Seriously, more power and weight on the tractor helps a lot, but every now and then, when that bit takes a grip and heads "south" your only hope is to get the PTO shut off before the auger buries itself. A smallish tractor just can't stop it.

 

[acohen100]

Keith, whenever I am digging holes I have the bucket loaded full with the heaviest stuff I can find to counterbalance the pull of the digger, otherwise I found it will pull down fast.

 

[ChuckinNH]

Keith, I don't have much experience with a PHD either, but I was told to dig in little bites, pull the bit out often to clear the accumulated dirt, and whatever. I'm sure other's with more experience will chime in here.

 

[Barryh]

Is it supposed to do that? Maybe the PHD was just trying to get home?

Was using it for the first time at a neighbor's house (we barter favors back and forth...they watch my dogs once in a while). I have a 9" auger bit. First 18" went pretty good, then it bit into something and just went STRAIGHT down like a drywall screw. The ground is a pretty heavy, red, compacted clay, but I had the drop rate of the 3PH choked WAY down on the dial. It was dropping perhaps 2" a minute at the bit. I was running about 1/3 throttle or a smidge more.

I tried lifting it out, but I couldn't get enough lift force on that long boom arm.

Through a bit of manual labor, I was able to remove the bit, but it wasn't too much fun.

Is this one of those freak things that happens once in a while? Or is something I need to be specifically aware of to avoid? There were no rocks obvious in the hole or in the spoils. The only thing was a small bit of half-petrified tree root matter, but they amounted to twigs that weren't over 1/2" in diameter. The area was a fill slope adjacent to his house.

Just trying to get a read on this so I can perhaps modify my method before doing more holes. It was no fun extracting that auger bit by hand.

Hmmmm haven't got around to hooking mine up yet. Doesn't sound like much fun once it bites. I have the JR with a 9 inch augar. Same red clay rock and dirt Be interesting to watch your progress on this topic.

 

[KeithInSpace]

...pull the bit out often to clear the accumulated dirt...

Something I was NOT doing. I'm sure that weight could add up quickly.

Go as quickly as you can to the nearest Kubota dealer and buy a bigger tractor

Yea, well...

I fully concede the point that this application is probably stretching the limits of a BX tractor a little. Trying to raise the loaded and stuck bit by the PTO was probably a silly thought. The 6' long boom arm KILLS all mechanical advantage and makes the effective lift at the bit very small. I'd have to do the calculations, but I'd say my residual lift after taking the weight of the gearbox and auger into consideration is probably in the under-100# range. Pretty darn small.

I tried rocking the tractor back and forth while lifting the 3PH as my first method of extracation. It still lifts and the auger bit is still straight, so I don't think I messed anything up.

Through this experience, I've come to realize the difference between my PHD and the "Junior" model they make specifically for SCUTs. The "JR" as they call it (like Mr. Barryh mentioned) has a boom that is 1 foot shorter. At first account, this is a negative...more is better, right? But I'm starting to think that the shorter boom would assist slightly in the limited 3PH capacity of a SCUT tractor. SURE, it FITS, but does it WORK...

Good point about loading the bucket, too. If it doesn't START to bite and takes off smaller chunks instead, that may help a bit. The problem really started when it found SOMETHING and jerked so hard as to buck the front of the tractor and overwhelm the PTO hydraulics. If it didn't have that first "buck", maybe that would help. Then also having the valve closed and letting it down a bit at a time (moving the lever back and forth) would make it so as to not "get" the hydraulic fluid it wants when it grabs like that.

Sorta scared to dig another hole just right now. I'll try again in a few weeks at my Dad's place. It's all sand and topsoil out there...

 

[ampsucker]

i'm in the "lift often and clear the dirt as you go" camp. we have a lot of clay and rocks. lifting the auger out gives it a chance to spin all the accumulated debris out around the top of the hole like drilling with a drill bit into wet wood.

usually our problem is the opposite. it won't go down. then raising it and lowering it so it hits the bottom of the hole with some force sometimes allows it to break through small rocks, etc. once it does start digging, though, look out!

i, too, prefer to dig at slow engine rpms. i've never seen much advantage to spinning the bit faster. it either digs good or it doesn't. and going faster makes it a LOT more dangerous. that's when things and people break. i've heard countless tales of folks climbing up on their auger frame to give it more downward force and something getting caught in a moving part. NOT good. i would much rather bog the engine down at slow rpms than risk an accident.

amp

 

[Tom_H]

Dig a foot or two, pull and clear spoils, repeat. That is exactly what I have to do.

 

[MFL]

Hey Keith,

Drywall screw is a good comparison. This happened to me twice when I was fencing my pastures. Both times I got too close to the root ball of a tree and the auger caught the edge of a thick root. The screw worked just like it's supposed to. It ran along the edge of the root and sucked itself down to the gear box QUICK! I also had to disconnect the auger from the PHD, and using a piece of rebar, unscrew the auger by HAND! Believe me, not as fun as it sounds!

After mentioning this to folks more experienced than I at the time, I found out this isn't that rare. If you find an immovable object and it fits the track of your auger, GOODBYE!

Only three things I can think of that would help. Weight, HP, and a hydraulic PHD similar to the units used by skid-steers. If you can't pull the auger out with brute force, you can at least turn the auger in the opposite direction and screw it out!