Ploughing with Case 885 (req: hints & tips)

[daz]

Following on from my oil leak question I've also been tasked with ploughing our field which is something I've never done before so I'm after some general advice on how I should go about it. I'm quite happy with topping, mowing, baling etc but as I say this is a first...

For a bit of background the field in question is about 6-7 acre's in size, roughly square and with a slight even downhill slope. Its currently got short grass on it and the ground is a minimum 12" of decent topsoil on top of a layer of clay and stone. The reason for ploughing is mostly that this year we got caught out by the unseasonal rain here in the UK which ruined the hay crop on the half of the field we were making, which we've had to abandon and leave laying. Also the grass is very patchy thanks to how the previous owner worked the field then seeded the bits he'd worked so we'd like to basically start again from scratch with a grass variety more suited to hay/our horses needs.

We've got a manually reversable two furrow plough (for which I will rig something up into the cab so I can flip it) and I figure our 885XL should be man enough for the job, but I have the following questions:

- I've been told we will need weights on the front, I've found somewhere that can supply some locally at a reasonable price but how much would I need? (I don't yet have the operators manual if its in there)

- Given the above field condition What sort of gear/speed should I be looking at doing the job? Bearing in mind I don't have a working tach so should I be looking at say low ratio first/second gear or high ratio first gear and at approximately what revs, torque boost on or off... ?

- A friend tells me that when I drop down into the previous furrow I should engage the diff lock otherwise the wheels will just spin, is he right?

- What sort of depth should I be looking at ploughing in?

- From looking around the web I've figured that with the reversable plough I need to start at one side of the field and work my way across. Now whilst I say the field is roughly square it isn't quite, stood at the top looking down it in the far left corner about 3/4 the way down a stream cuts into the field and then back towards the hedge. Like wise the right side has a gateway & hedge jutting in half way down. So should I try and keep the furrows straight so if I start at the left side when I hit the jutting out stream stop ploughing and pickup on the other side or should I just steer round the jut in which case I'll have a swerve in the furrows that will carry across the field? Maybe this shining display of my art skills will give you an idea of what I mean...

Any help is gratefully appreciated!!

Cheers

Daz

 

[Grrrr]

Following on from my oil leak question I've also been tasked with ploughing our field which is something I've never done before so I'm after some general advice on how I should go about it. I'm quite happy with topping, mowing, baling etc but as I say this is a first...

For a bit of background the field in question is about 6-7 acre's in size, roughly square and with a slight even downhill slope. Its currently got short grass on it and the ground is a minimum 12" of decent topsoil on top of a layer of clay and stone. The reason for ploughing is mostly that this year we got caught out by the unseasonal rain here in the UK which ruined the hay crop on the half of the field we were making, which we've had to abandon and leave laying. Also the grass is very patchy thanks to how the previous owner worked the field then seeded the bits he'd worked so we'd like to basically start again from scratch with a grass variety more suited to hay/our horses needs.

We've got a manually reversable two furrow plough (for which I will rig something up into the cab so I can flip it) and I figure our 885XL should be man enough for the job, but I have the following questions:

- I've been told we will need weights on the front, I've found somewhere that can supply some locally at a reasonable price but how much would I need? (I don't yet have the operators manual if its in there)

- Given the above field condition What sort of gear/speed should I be looking at doing the job? Bearing in mind I don't have a working tach so should I be looking at say low ratio first/second gear or high ratio first gear and at approximately what revs, torque boost on or off... ?

- A friend tells me that when I drop down into the previous furrow I should engage the diff lock otherwise the wheels will just spin, is he right?

- What sort of depth should I be looking at ploughing in?

- From looking around the web I've figured that with the reversable plough I need to start at one side of the field and work my way across. Now whilst I say the field is roughly square it isn't quite, stood at the top looking down it in the far left corner about 3/4 the way down a stream cuts into the field and then back towards the hedge. Like wise the right side has a gateway & hedge jutting in half way down. So should I try and keep the furrows straight so if I start at the left side when I hit the jutting out stream stop ploughing and pickup on the other side or should I just steer round the jut in which case I'll have a swerve in the furrows that will carry across the field? Maybe this shining display of my art skills will give you an idea of what I mean...

Any help is gratefully appreciated!!

Cheers

Daz

One thing I must start of by saying is you have an excellent UK ploughing tractor

Second, Welcome to TBN!

The tractor could handle a much bigger plough.

But, it will easily pull the one you are talking about.

- I've been told we will need weights on the front, I've found somewhere that can supply some locally at a reasonable price but how much would I need? (I don't yet have the operators manual if its in there)

You might need weights if you were using a much bigger heavier plough. But, with your relatively small plough, I would try it out first before you splash out on weights.

- Given the above field condition What sort of gear/speed should I be looking at doing the job? Bearing in mind I don't have a working tach so should I be looking at say low ratio first/second gear or high ratio first gear and at approximately what revs, torque boost on or off... ?

Only you can tell how fast you can go. I have ploughed in modern tractors with a bit more power than yours but with a bigger plough at 6 - 8 mph.
The easiest way to work out the gears and speed is to start in say Low Second and pull the revs up. You don't want the engine screaming but you don't want it labouring either. If you find it pulls easily, shift up. If it struggles, go down a gear or more revs. If you have 4WD you want it in engaged. I don't know what Torque Boost is?

- A friend tells me that when I drop down into the previous furrow I should engage the diff lock otherwise the wheels will just spin, is he right?

Yes, you will want the diff lock. But you will not want it when you are trying to turn around at the end or a furrow

- What sort of depth should I be looking at ploughing in?

Without knowing much about your land, I would say 10" - 12"

- From looking around the web I've figured that with the reversable plough I need to start at one side of the field and work my way across. Now whilst I say the field is roughly square it isn't quite, stood at the top looking down it in the far left corner about 3/4 the way down a stream cuts into the field and then back towards the hedge. Like wise the right side has a gateway & hedge jutting in half way down. So should I try and keep the furrows straight so if I start at the left side when I hit the jutting out stream stop ploughing and pickup on the other side or should I just steer round the jut in which case I'll have a swerve in the furrows that will carry across the field? Maybe this shining display of my art skills will give you an idea of what I mean...

If i was you and it was my first time ploughing I would start of by ploughing a furrow straight down the middle of the field. Leave a reasnably large headland at each end. Then come back down the other way. Continue like this untill you can make no further full pases.

Then, go and plough the left over bits as best you can. They will not look as nice.

Lastly, go and plough the headlands, going at 90 degrees to all the other furrows.

Just looking at your diagram, I would plough going the other way to what you drew on there. That way you would have a more square field which is easier to plough.

You want to keep the furrows as straight as possible to make driving it easier.

I borrowed your diagram and edited it slightly (you can click on it to make it larger)



The numbers at the top dictate what you would plough first.

A really good book that I can recomend for UK people is The Tractor Ploughing Manual

 

[Harold_J]

Following on from my oil leak question I've also been tasked with ploughing our field which is something I've never done before so I'm after some general advice on how I should go about it. I'm quite happy with topping, mowing, baling etc but as I say this is a first...

For a bit of background the field in question is about 6-7 acre's in size, roughly square and with a slight even downhill slope. Its currently got short grass on it and the ground is a minimum 12" of decent topsoil on top of a layer of clay and stone. The reason for ploughing is mostly that this year we got caught out by the unseasonal rain here in the UK which ruined the hay crop on the half of the field we were making, which we've had to abandon and leave laying. Also the grass is very patchy thanks to how the previous owner worked the field then seeded the bits he'd worked so we'd like to basically start again from scratch with a grass variety more suited to hay/our horses needs.

We've got a manually reversable two furrow plough (for which I will rig something up into the cab so I can flip it) and I figure our 885XL should be man enough for the job, but I have the following questions:

- I've been told we will need weights on the front, I've found somewhere that can supply some locally at a reasonable price but how much would I need? (I don't yet have the operators manual if its in there)

- Given the above field condition What sort of gear/speed should I be looking at doing the job? Bearing in mind I don't have a working tach so should I be looking at say low ratio first/second gear or high ratio first gear and at approximately what revs, torque boost on or off... ?

- A friend tells me that when I drop down into the previous furrow I should engage the diff lock otherwise the wheels will just spin, is he right?

- What sort of depth should I be looking at ploughing in?

- From looking around the web I've figured that with the reversable plough I need to start at one side of the field and work my way across. Now whilst I say the field is roughly square it isn't quite, stood at the top looking down it in the far left corner about 3/4 the way down a stream cuts into the field and then back towards the hedge. Like wise the right side has a gateway & hedge jutting in half way down. So should I try and keep the furrows straight so if I start at the left side when I hit the jutting out stream stop ploughing and pickup on the other side or should I just steer round the jut in which case I'll have a swerve in the furrows that will carry across the field? Maybe this shining display of my art skills will give you an idea of what I mean...

Any help is gratefully appreciated!!

Cheers

Daz

Your 885 is WAY powerful and heavy enough for that plough. However, just for information what are the size of the bottoms? You can determine this by measuring between the midpoints of the two plough beams.

I don't think you'll need weights on the front for a two botom plough on that tractor, and if you did it should only be 100-200 lbs. I would try it without the weights and see how it goes. You can always add later.

Try to plough it at approx 3-4 mph, slower is better than faster when learning or in heavy trash conditions. As far as gear selection I'm not too familiar with that tractor; probably the lowest gear in high range, or one of the higher gears in low range. Same for the torque boost; usual wisdom is to start with it off so that you can drop down when encountering a tough spot or uphill. That tractor should be so overpowered for the plough that it may not matter, just take it slow at first. I'm assuming this is a conventional plough and not a "new ground" or breaking plough. Also for the diff lock, I don't think you'll need it. Are the rear wheels weighted or cast-iron centers? Even if not I don't think you'll spin the tires unless you hit an obstruction (which could be a good thing).

I wouldn't plough too deep, you don't want to be bringing up any gravel or clay. A rule of thumb is to plough at a depth of 1/2 the moldboard size or just a little deeper. 8-10" should be fine for a pasture seedbed. You'll want the soil to be flowing near the top edge of the moldboards.

Your plan for ploughing the field shown in the left-hand picture is good. I wouldn't start in the center as that would leave a hump there. Also, don't even think about trying to swerve around the obstruction. Start on the side that has the largest protrussion, that way you will be driving more on unploughed ground to get around it. If you want to avoid driving on ploughed ground as much as possible you could just finish up the odd pieces by backing the tractor down the furrow and taking another swipe; you don't say how much the stream/hedges/gates protrude but you can get a neater job by backing down the furrows for the odd pieces. That way you can also get the plough closer to the obstruction by backing the plough up to it instead of heading the nose of the tractor into it.

Pay attention to the wheel spacing on the tractor, if you have the book for the plough it will tell you. Most 2-bottom reversible ploughs call for the inner edge of the rear tire to be about 27" from the centerpoint of the tractor for a plough with 16" moldboards; so a wheel spacing about 64". I have used 68" and it's still OK.

There should be some kind of leveling adjustment on the plough itself, one for each set of bottoms; the adjustment can vary depending on the depth of ploughing. If it wasn't a 2-way you would level with the tractor links but for a reversible the tractor links should be equal, unless one tire is a little more worn than the other.

The only reason to plough across the hill vs. up/down would be to try and prevent erosion if leaving the newly ploughed soil lay over winter. In that case you would want to turn furrows uphill. I assume you plan is to just work up and down the hill. Take it slow, be sure the plough shares are in good condition and good luck.

 

[D7E]

I'm an ex brit so i know a little aout your area . The IH's are great plowing tractors , 885's are a favourite in match plowing , Excellent grip and draught control and good steering lock . You have nothing to worry about that tractor would take a 4 furrow reversible but a 3 would be right for it (depending on brand and style) If it is a manual turn-over it's obviously an old plough (probably a ransomes)and has no auto-reset so is light and little plow like that should need no weights or diff-lock ,I used to match plow with a 2 furrow ransomes reversible on a fordson major , We used to plow 000's of acres for cereals and spuds and depending on depth of good top soil cereals would be 7-9 inches and spuds 13-15 inches deep . If you have a ransomes look on the back of the board for numbers .LCN is a shallow or match board UCN is a general purpose that will work at most depths SCN is a "DIGGER" for sugar beet ,potatoes and other deep crops and can make a mess if shallower than 6 inches , Old ransomes "V shaped" points would tip plough onto it's back if worn and not penetrate properly because these points change shape as they wear ransomes are "soft" wearing parts and wear quickly and does'nt take much thay can look ok. Ploughing should not be hard work and about 4th gear low range or 1st high at about 1500-1600 rps is what i remember of these tractors and keep it in 2wd because that tractor could bend that little plow all to s@#t if you catch a stone in 4wd (shear bolts don't always break) .Check wheel widths because that tractor is probably on 68in centres and an old plow like that will probably be set for much narrower so your front furrow will not reach your last so set it with plow adjust ment don,t try to pull plow accross with check chains on tractor And obviously "DRAUGHT" control , Check chains loose and set plough level on concrete and go from there .

PS ...Where are you ?...Exactly....I'm an EX Monmouthshire/Herefordshire boy .

 

[daz]

Thanks for all the tips, unfortunately I'm just not getting the hang of this at all...

It is a Ransomes TS82 (found the id plate!) and like much of our equipment has been bought up on the cheap from old boys leaving the business. That invariably means no manuals and the kit has been subjected to the elements and is generally slightly worse for wear (and this plough is no exception). It transpires that the owner used it as a single sided plough due to the rotate mechanism not working reliably (ie it wouldn't go all the way round by itself) and this is borne out by the boards on the one sign (flipping right when viewed from behind) showing a lot more wear than those on the top (which flip left). We've spent many hours this week using brute force, harsh language and can's of WD40 to loosen up most of the adjusting parts on the plough. The boards are also SCN I think.

Now from what I can gather the width of our tractors inner tyre edge to the centre line is 26.5" (so pretty much the 27" mentioned) but the other dimension I'm not sure how you measure that. The centre of the rear tyre to the same opposite is 64" - is that right? (also how do you measure the mouldboards size?)

To start with I had a go using the reversable as it was setup but found that it was leaving roughly an 8 inch strip untouched between the last furrow and that you're on which obviously isn't ideal. We then tried just treating it as a single sided plough and using the plough adjustment to try and move it across (not sliding it on the crossbar) but that faired no better and was arguably worse causing the tractor to veer off badly.

Today we reset our previous adjustments and moved the plough on the crossbar to try and decrease the distance from the inside tyre wall to the first point and got it down to around 15" (the two points as they are are 14" apart on the plough). Annoyingly the outer furrow was doing a nice job flipping it over as it should but the inner furrow was still leaving this 8" strip and not flipping over fully, whilst frequently pushing the plough to the left (when viewed from behind) so that our efforts to close up the gap were wasted. It also happened that at one point the plough pushed itself right out of the ground and leftwards, no idea why that happened!

I also had problems in some areas when the left tyre (that on the untouched ground) hit areas of the hay left on the ground and spun out requiring the diff lock to get out of, as well as the hay getting caught and building up on the skimmer (I think its called - the small board for taking off the surface first ahead of each main board).

So, any ideas? I'm stuck - I just can't see how we can get the plough to stay in the right position and get rid of that left over strip, if we could I think we'd be cooking with gas. I'm inclined to think removing the skimmer might solve the buildup problem but I'm not sure about the rest. I've tried having the arm adjustments loose and tight (its set on low mount point, no sway anyway) so what else can I try?

@D7E: We're on the Shropshire/Staffordshire border (around Newport).

Cheers

 

[D7E]

Thanks for all the tips, unfortunately I'm just not getting the hang of this at all...

It is a Ransomes TS82 (found the id plate!) and like much of our equipment has been bought up on the cheap from old boys leaving the business. That invariably means no manuals and the kit has been subjected to the elements and is generally slightly worse for wear (and this plough is no exception). It transpires that the owner used it as a single sided plough due to the rotate mechanism not working reliably (ie it wouldn't go all the way round by itself) and this is borne out by the boards on the one sign (flipping right when viewed from behind) showing a lot more wear than those on the top (which flip left). We've spent many hours this week using brute force, harsh language and can's of WD40 to loosen up most of the adjusting parts on the plough. The boards are also SCN I think.

Now from what I can gather the width of our tractors inner tyre edge to the centre line is 26.5" (so pretty much the 27" mentioned) but the other dimension I'm not sure how you measure that. The centre of the rear tyre to the same opposite is 64" - is that right? (also how do you measure the mouldboards size?)

To start with I had a go using the reversable as it was setup but found that it was leaving roughly an 8 inch strip untouched between the last furrow and that you're on which obviously isn't ideal. We then tried just treating it as a single sided plough and using the plough adjustment to try and move it across (not sliding it on the crossbar) but that faired no better and was arguably worse causing the tractor to veer off badly.

Today we reset our previous adjustments and moved the plough on the crossbar to try and decrease the distance from the inside tyre wall to the first point and got it down to around 15" (the two points as they are are 14" apart on the plough). Annoyingly the outer furrow was doing a nice job flipping it over as it should but the inner furrow was still leaving this 8" strip and not flipping over fully, whilst frequently pushing the plough to the left (when viewed from behind) so that our efforts to close up the gap were wasted. It also happened that at one point the plough pushed itself right out of the ground and leftwards, no idea why that happened!

I also had problems in some areas when the left tyre (that on the untouched ground) hit areas of the hay left on the ground and spun out requiring the diff lock to get out of, as well as the hay getting caught and building up on the skimmer (I think its called - the small board for taking off the surface first ahead of each main board).

So, any ideas? I'm stuck - I just can't see how we can get the plough to stay in the right position and get rid of that left over strip, if we could I think we'd be cooking with gas. I'm inclined to think removing the skimmer might solve the buildup problem but I'm not sure about the rest. I've tried having the arm adjustments loose and tight (its set on low mount point, no sway anyway) so what else can I try?

@D7E: We're on the Shropshire/Staffordshire border (around Newport).

Cheers

They are old ploughs , scn boards are for slightly deeper work and i'm surprised you have then on an older plough LCN would be more common ,Don't worry about worn board tips it really does'nt affect much .Center tyre to center tyre 64/68 or 72 inches is right and point to point is your furrow width .
Leaving a strip this wide sounds like your wheels are too wide , depending on your tyre width you can narrower .
I would get the turnover working and try it the other way up first ,Maybe some idiot has set it to work one way on the other side .
If your skimmers are dragging trash you can take them off or sometimes deepen them a bit so the point is always in hard ground and not getting trash around the cutting edge . Are the points and wings (cutting edge on side of point ) good , How much metal is left if these are worn it will push away from the work and push out of the ground . Is there some way you could show a pic ?
ps are your boards shiny like this ...rusty boards don't help.

Sorry without looking at it i'm running out of thoughts can you get a local farmer or someone who knows ploughs to take alook . It will be something simple ? , I'm still sure your wheels are set too wide , Do you know what tractor it was used on before ?

 

[D7E]

Thanks for all the tips, unfortunately I'm just not getting the hang of this at all...

It is a Ransomes TS82 (found the id plate!) and like much of our equipment has been bought up on the cheap from old boys leaving the business. That invariably means no manuals and the kit has been subjected to the elements and is generally slightly worse for wear (and this plough is no exception). It transpires that the owner used it as a single sided plough due to the rotate mechanism not working reliably (ie it wouldn't go all the way round by itself) and this is borne out by the boards on the one sign (flipping right when viewed from behind) showing a lot more wear than those on the top (which flip left). We've spent many hours this week using brute force, harsh language and can's of WD40 to loosen up most of the adjusting parts on the plough. The boards are also SCN I think.

Now from what I can gather the width of our tractors inner tyre edge to the centre line is 26.5" (so pretty much the 27" mentioned) but the other dimension I'm not sure how you measure that. The centre of the rear tyre to the same opposite is 64" - is that right? (also how do you measure the mouldboards size?)

To start with I had a go using the reversable as it was setup but found that it was leaving roughly an 8 inch strip untouched between the last furrow and that you're on which obviously isn't ideal. We then tried just treating it as a single sided plough and using the plough adjustment to try and move it across (not sliding it on the crossbar) but that faired no better and was arguably worse causing the tractor to veer off badly.

Today we reset our previous adjustments and moved the plough on the crossbar to try and decrease the distance from the inside tyre wall to the first point and got it down to around 15" (the two points as they are are 14" apart on the plough). Annoyingly the outer furrow was doing a nice job flipping it over as it should but the inner furrow was still leaving this 8" strip and not flipping over fully, whilst frequently pushing the plough to the left (when viewed from behind) so that our efforts to close up the gap were wasted. It also happened that at one point the plough pushed itself right out of the ground and leftwards, no idea why that happened!

I also had problems in some areas when the left tyre (that on the untouched ground) hit areas of the hay left on the ground and spun out requiring the diff lock to get out of, as well as the hay getting caught and building up on the skimmer (I think its called - the small board for taking off the surface first ahead of each main board).

So, any ideas? I'm stuck - I just can't see how we can get the plough to stay in the right position and get rid of that left over strip, if we could I think we'd be cooking with gas. I'm inclined to think removing the skimmer might solve the buildup problem but I'm not sure about the rest. I've tried having the arm adjustments loose and tight (its set on low mount point, no sway anyway) so what else can I try?

@D7E: We're on the Shropshire/Staffordshire border (around Newport).

Cheers

They are old ploughs , scn boards are for slightly deeper work and i'm surprised you have then on an older plough LCN would be more common ,Don't worry about worn board tips it really does'nt affect much .Center tyre to center tyre 64/68 or 72 inches is right and point to point is your furrow width .
Leaving a strip this wide sounds like your wheels are too wide , depending on your tyre width you can narrower .
I would get the turnover working and try it the other way up first ,Maybe some idiot has set it to work one way on the other side .
If your skimmers are dragging trash you can take them off or sometimes deepen them a bit so the point is always in hard ground and not getting trash around the cutting edge . Are the points and wings (cutting edge on side of point ) good , How much metal is left if these are worn it will push away from the work and push out of the ground . Is there some way you could show a pic ?

 

[daz]

Dunno if these are what you're after...

Front lower:

Maybe a better one of the same...

Front lower right side:

Rear lower right side:

Mounting:

I've got some pics of the upper boards but as you can see from this picture they're a lot more worn... (I can upload them if you're interested tho')

As you can see from the mounting pic we've moved it across (right) but it was pretty much dead center before, it could be moved back easily enough tho'.

 

[Harold_J]

Dunno if these are what you're after...

Front lower:

Maybe a better one of the same...

Front lower right side:

Rear lower right side:

Mounting:

I've got some pics of the upper boards but as you can see from this picture they're a lot more worn... (I can upload them if you're interested tho')

As you can see from the mounting pic we've moved it across (right) but it was pretty much dead center before, it could be moved back easily enough tho'.

If you're going to operate it as a 2-way it would have to be set dead center.

Is the plough hitch CAT I or CAT II?

It may be that if this is a very early plough it might require the tractor to be set at 52-56"; that would just about get you back the 8".

I'll let someone else give an opinion about the condition of the points/shares. They don't look that great to me, kind of rounded and worn down especially the upper pair.

Harold

 

[D7E]

Dunno if these are what you're after...

Front lower:

Maybe a better one of the same...

Front lower right side:

Rear lower right side:

Mounting:

I've got some pics of the upper boards but as you can see from this picture they're a lot more worn... (I can upload them if you're interested tho')

As you can see from the mounting pic we've moved it across (right) but it was pretty much dead center before, it could be moved back easily enough tho'.

Wear on the board is bad but ok to work , Skimmers points are fine lots of meat there and you're skimmer boards are shot but that really has no affect on the work? ....But your points are shot ...If this type of point is good it will curl down a little " like an eagles beak" on the end , When they get straight like this they push out of the ground , And your wings are not too good , This does'nt help ? And the " landslide" the flat plate running back from the point on the side looks worn and in hard ground will also tip the plough on its back . All these things help but are not you're real problem i still think it's a wheel width issue mainly ?
I've not bought ransomes parts for many years but when i was using them Ford NH used keep some of this old stuff and it was cheap enough but some dowdswell ploughs use the same parts ,.....Good luck ?