Oil & Fuel Ready to ditch the diesel?

[HoyeTractor]

Just found a great link for everyone that is fed up with diesel smoke and oil leaks. It appears all you really need is 12 Interstate batteries, a surplus aircraft starter, a Curtis 1204-001 controller?, an open account at your local machine shop, and a lot of spare time on your hands. Kinda neat but I think I'll stick with the diesel for now. http://www.austinev.org/evalbum/216.html
http:// [url]http://www.austinev.org/evalbum/216h.jpg [/url]

 

[Ozarker]

A lot of people out there are playing with electric powered equipment. My own thoughts on the subject would not eliminate the diesel engine but use it to produce power for electric powered implements. Imagine a small tractor such as my YM1500D with a direct drive generator attached to the PTO. It would produce the power to run my mower, brush hog, tiller, etc. It would allow me to pull larger implements, say an 8 ft mower instead of a 5 ft mower, and eliminate the problems caused by not having a live PTO.

Are you aware of the GE electric lawn tractors produced in the 70's? They could cut 2-3 acres on a charge but the public just wasn't ready for an electric lawn tractor back then.

http://www.econogics.com/ev/i5.jpg

<A target="_blank" HREF=http://www.mrsharkey.com/electrak.htm>http://www.mrsharkey.com/electrak.htm</A>

 

[Anonymous Poster]

I know where you can get a fantastic deal on a pair of GE electracs, one running and one for parts, with a snowblower and 2 mower decks in Western NY.

 

[Soundguy]

Just like deisel over electric on trains.

Interesting itea.

I looked at the electric 'yanmar' conversion above, and liked it.. but didn't like the togle switche controlled linear steering. I would have prefered at least a fake wheel that had contact switches on either side, so you could actually steer, to activate the switch.... Also, a small gasoling motor could be added to run a dynamo to charge the batteries. I've seen designs for some hybrid vehicles that employ this. The gasoline engine is set to run at maximum efficiency, both performance, and emission wise. Fairly neat setup. Along with possibly a solar cell, to get some free power. Kinda mad-max- road warrior ish. /w3tcompact/icons/smile.gif

Soundguy

 

[gbirky]

Ozarker,
I'm not sure how you figure that you could run larger equipment. You cannot make more electric power with the generator than the mechanical power you put into it. With a 15pto hp tractor like your YM1500D, you cannot produce more than the equivalent electric energy (about 12 kW) - in fact it would be less due to conversion losses (sound, heat, etc). Then of course you have the losses of conversion back to mechanical at the motors. It is true that it would eliminate the lack of live pto.

A possibly better solution is to get a hydraulic pump with capacity to drive some hydraulic motors. Hi speed pumps and motors are not as expensive as the lower speed ones.

Diesel over electric like locomotives: The heavy duty truck manufacturers have considered this. It is attractive because you can design the engine to run at a constant speed and load with lower emissions. Plus you use a 300hp engine to charge batteries, with a 600hp drive system. You can produce 600hp peak by using the 300engine hp + using battery energy. Of course you cannot sustain 600hp longer than the batteries can produce the extra energy. Then when load is lower than 300hp the engine charges the batteries. This solution is very expensive because a large bank of batteries is required.

Greg

 

[Egon]

I do beleive the Diesel electric setup on locomotives does not use batteries and is designed to take advantage of high startup torque of the electric motor. This enables the mile long freight train to get into motion. The steam locomotive also had maximum torque at zero rpm.
Egon

 

[rocky2]

I worked on Detroit Diesels in various applications years back. The EMD (Electo Motive Diesel) are nothing but big diesel/generator units. Diesel turns the generator making juice to run the electric motors that move the contraption. The biggest issue in that application is for the torque of pulling all that weight. Electric motors can wind from nothing to the required load smoothly without transmissions or torque converters. Then once moving, the diesel RPM reduces maintaining the needed electric current to keep it rolling after the initial power surge. The same as the diesel backup generators at coal fed power plants. And double clutching and speed shifting a 100 car locomotive would be a real trick.

 

[Ozarker]

The weight difference between a 5' finish mower and a 7' finish mower is not significant. My 1500 could pull either of them. But I can't use anything bigger than a 5' mower because of the power loss in the mechanical systems of the mower.

That power loss is eliminated if a generator is directly linked to the PTO and each blade has it's own electric motor directly driving the blade. A low amp 24 or 36 volt electric motor can do the same work of a 3 or 4 HP gas engine. Just look at the current crop of rechargable electric mowers.

And, if I am replacing the gear box and all mechanicals with direct drive electric motors, I can build a much lighter deck. Most of the bulk of a finishing mower is needed to mount the mechanicals so it all doesn't fall apart from twisting and vibration. You can fold the handles on many electric mowers and hang them on the garage wall. Try that with a 3.5HP Gas walk behind mower.

 

[gbirky]

I'm not familiar with the amount of mechanical loss from pto to blade on a mower. However, mechanical to electrical losses, and electrial to mechanical losses are substantial. Yes, electric motors can be made quite efficient, but the higher efficiency means higher price. Plus you are looking at low voltage systems. I wouldn't count on much more than 70-80% efficiency from pto to blade.

Greg

 

[Ozarker]

70 to 80 percent efficiency is probably more than I need. I don't now the actual loss through the gearbox and the pulleys but if you go buy a 5' mower with it's own engine to pull behind an ATV, it has a 12hp motor.

If it takes 12 hp to operate a 5' mower and I have 15hp at the PTO, I am working with 75% efficiency now and that 12hp motor is still going through pulleys to turn the blades. If I can get 70 to 80 efficiency directly to the blade, I should be able to turn a bigger blade.