Scag vs Bad Boy

[Matt95684]

Hi everyone I'm in the very early stages of pricing a commercial grade zero turn mower (admittedly for home use on about 1.5 acres) and was just curious if anyone had opinions one way or the other. I have talked to dealers of both the Bad Boy dealer is about 15-20 miles from my place, and just talked with the Scag dealer today and he said that he is working on opening a new place that as it turns out will be like 1.5 miles from my house (he told me where before I told him where I live).

The reason for the commercial grade is I want something that is going to last, and my wife and I have ambitions to own a bigger property someday. Currently my 1.5 acres is a very rough mow. I have tried rolling it without much luck and so am looking for a mower that can withstand that, give me a smooth ride, and get the job done in a timely manner.

The mowers that I'm looking at are the Bad Boy Outlaw XP because I can put an air ride seat on it and it has what they call ez ride suspension which is supposed to help over rough terrain. The Scag model will most likely be the Cheetah because it is pretty close in price to the next step down which is the Tiger Cat.

Scag dealer told me that when they get up and running in my area I could demo their product and even at my own house because its so close. Haven't asked Bad Boy about demo yet. Price points are around $9000 for the Bad Boy Outlaw Xp (with air ride seat and ez ride suspension) but not sure what deck size and $10,200 for a Scag Cheetah with 61" deck (although was told there is some wiggle room on the price of the Cheetah).

So my questions...would you go with a 52" or 61" deck? I have quite a few trees none that I think a 61" couldn't get around and a slight incline on one side of the house. Secondly any differences in quality between the brands and is the ez ride suspension all it cracked it up to be.

Thanks in advance!

My time frame is probably next year at the soonest.

 

[Chef Pa]

Can't comment on the Scag or Bad Boy from experience but they both have pretty good reputations. If not in a rush demo both and see what you think. For the price points you're looking at, a Ferris might also be worth a look. I just purchased a Ferris this spring and the suspension is great. You still know the bumps are there, but much more tolerable. Also have to admit I only looked at/demo'd the Ferris due to freindship with dealer.

 

[milligjg]

Scag:thumbsup:

 

[EddieWalker]

After looking at a lot of different mowers I went with Scag. I like that they have the Kawasaki water cooled engine, how heavy and thick the metal is and that the didn't cut any corners in building it. The only Bad Boy that I saw where the ones at Tractor Supply. The where not in the same class as the Scag, or most of the other commercial mowers that I looked at. Much thinner metal and overall their hydraulics just looked smaller to me. Most of all, Bad Boy was only available at Tractor Supply and there is no way that I would ever want to deal with a big box store for parts or repairs. I have no idea is Scag is the best mower out there, but it's easily one of the top ones to choose from.

Eddie

 

[MoKelly]

I have the Bad Boy Outlaw XP. I have about 400 hours on the machine over 3 plus years. I also have the air ride seat.

It is a mowing machine. It is fast and cuts fantastically. I have some rather bumpy areas and the seat helps tremendously. I would highly recommend the mower.

There is a big difference between the Bad Boy you can buy at a Big Box store and the commercial units you get from a dealer. Much as the Deere mowers sold at Lowes vs. those sold at a dealer.

I have had only two "problems" so far --- the mower blade belt broke and the spring providing tension to the hydro drive belt broke. I got th eparts from th edealer and they were reasonable -- the belt was $50 and the spring was $10. More importantly, they were easy to install and get back running.

I have never owned a Scag so I cannot comment.

Good luck.

MoKelly

 

[coobie]

Can't comment on the Scag or Bad Boy from experience but they both have pretty good reputations. If not in a rush demo both and see what you think. For the price points you're looking at, a Ferris might also be worth a look. I just purchased a Ferris this spring and the suspension is great. You still know the bumps are there, but much more tolerable. Also have to admit I only looked at/demo'd the Ferris due to freindship with dealer.

++ 1 on the ferris ZTR.With that said scag would be my choice verses the bad boy.

 

[travlitt]

I would make sure the one I bought did not have the integrated drive system. Much better with 2 pumps and individual wheel motors. My :2cents:

My choice is Scags. One tough machine.

 

[myyaz33]

I would agree with trying both of them on your property. If either dealers says no, then I think you have your answer.

I own a commercial Bad Boy, I wish I would have tried a Scag. Does that mean I am not happy, not exactly... But I don't know what a Scag cuts like!

 

[tman1020]

I have a bad boy pup commercial mower with a 48' deck. It is very solid and heavy duty. It even went through a tornado and I was able too repair it with out much trouble. I have only had minor problems with it and I believe most of them were due to the damage it received in the storm. It does not ride bad over the bumps. It is a very heavy machine so would not be a good choice if you mow soft wet ground.

 

[smstonypoint]

Another Bad Boy owner here -- I bought my 61" Outlaw in 2011. As mentioned above, the Bad Boys at TSC are "homeowner" models akin to the JDs at Lowes.

I have had two problems. A zerk broke off in one of the pillow blocks and a defective coil, but that's on Kawasaki, not Bad Boy.

I can't comment on the Scag, as I have never used one.

Steve

 

[TSO]

I would also agree ... If ride quality over rough terrain is the highest concern, I would think Ferris first. I have a Hustler commercial mower that I'm very happy with, but there are times that I think about what it might be like with the Ferris suspension platform.

That said... Between the two you mentioned, my buddy has a commercial Scag and is very happy with it.

Good luck

 

[Poopdeck Pappy]

I drove a Ferris IS2000 and another ZTR without suspension around a rough, bumpy gravel parking lot. The difference was amazing. The ride of the Ferris is in a different league.

For cutting performance, the ICD deck on the Ferris and Snapper Pro (Snapper owns Ferris) is supposed to really good. A lot of pros say the best decks for cutting in any condition, wet or dry, are the Scag Velocity Plus deck and the John Deere 7-Iron Pro (not the Mulch-On-Demand) deck.

 

[gladehound]

I would make sure the one I bought did not have the integrated drive system. Much better with 2 pumps and individual wheel motors. My :2cents:

View attachment 425875

There was a time when transaxles were light duty and separate pumps / motors were the only heavy duty option. But now the largest offering from hydro gear is quite beefy and the parker integrated pump / motors are outstanding. I'm partial to the Parker myself. I think Bad Boy Outlaw XP uses the Hydrogear 5400. This is a far cry from the transaxles in homeowner ZTRs . I don't know which separate pumps / motors Scag uses but I'd be surprised if they weren't good. I wouldn't be too concerned about having a beefy transaxle vs. separate pump / motors.

OP - see if you can demo both units.

 

[TSO]

There was a time when transaxles were light duty and separate pumps / motors were the only heavy duty option. But now the largest offering from hydro gear is quite beefy and the parker integrated pump / motors are outstanding. I'm partial to the Parker myself. I think Bad Boy Outlaw XP uses the Hydrogear 5400. This is a far cry from the transaxles in homeowner ZTRs . I don't know which separate pumps / motors Scag uses but I'd be surprised if they weren't good. I wouldn't be too concerned about having a beefy transaxle vs. separate pump / motors.

OP - see if you can demo both units.

My Z diesel uses Parker, I believe ... But I don't know what advantages or disadvantages that gives me compared to the other options out there. Does anyone know?

 

[coobie]

I drove a Ferris IS2000 and another ZTR without suspension around a rough, bumpy gravel parking lot. The difference was amazing. The ride of the Ferris is in a different league.

For cutting performance, the ICD deck on the Ferris and Snapper Pro (Snapper owns Ferris) is supposed to really good. A lot of pros say the best decks for cutting in any condition, wet or dry, are the Scag Velocity Plus deck and the John Deere 7-Iron Pro (not the Mulch-On-Demand) deck.

Pappy,not to correct you but I thought Briggs & stratton company(Basco)owned ferris,simplicity,snapper and a few others?

 

[Chef Pa]

Pappy,not to correct you but I thought Briggs & stratton company(Basco)owned ferris,simplicity,snapper and a few others?

Not sure about other than Ferris, but they are owned by B&S. Only concern I had when looking at the Ferris was the Kaw motor wasn't available without a very extended lead time, and thought maybe it was a 'fabricated' lead time issue, maybe to sell more B&S engines. Dealer was pretty firm the Kaw lead time was legit, and his service history on the Vanguard Briggs was good. So far, happy with the Briggs, and more than happy overall. Prior to the Ferris I dread cutting grass, and how my back felt afterward; it was downright painful. Not so with the Ferris, think I could mow all day if I had to.

 

[Tomtint]

I own 2 Scags. They are built to last and deliver a nice quality cut. Also own a Walker GHS, that leaves a better looking stripe but is also more needy with maintence. Scag has both Kohler and Kawi options on many of their mowers. If the one you are looking at is available with the Kawi, get that one. We have one of each and the only issues ever, are with the Kohler.

 

[LD1]

You are debating between two very good mowers. My decision would be based on factors other than what the brand is. You need to go with a dealer you are comfortable with, and you need to demo each unit. Controls and ergonomics are different, you have to get one that you are comfortable riding on.

Good comparison is I have a scag wildcat 61" cut. Dad has a very similar bobcat 223. There are things I like better about mine, and things I like better about his. All my controls are on the left side, his are on the right. Just what you are used to. My scag has pretty heavy shocks on the control levers. So they have alot more resistance to moving. His take no effort. Easier on the arms, but more difficult to hold straight IMO. Mine has much wider front wheels. Thats a big plus in soft ground. And probably the largest difference is deck lift. Mine is foot operated, which I like cause I can feather it if ground is uneven. His is hand operated. But by design and mechanical an advantage, Mine is considerably more difficult to lift for a female.

I know these are two completely different mowers than you are looking at, but just giving you an idea of some of the ergo differences. You really need to try out both of them, and make a decision based on that and the dealer, rather than the brand of the machine.

And as far as 61" vs 54" deck. With only 1.5 acres, you should be able to have that done in 30 minutes, which is a reasonable demo time. Mow your whole yard with the 61. IF you have any problem areas or scalping issues, maybe try the 54" model of the other brand the following week. Then bick the brand you liked best, with the deck size you feel does better for YOUR property

 

[Oldgreybear]

After destroying 3 homeowner grade yard tractors and 1 home owner grade ztr in 5 years, I purchased a 61" Scag Cheetah with a rear (not side discharge deck). I now have about 350 hours on it. My yard area is about 8.5 acres with approx 175 plantings on it. I love the scag. I got it for the speed, and the fact it seems better built then the BadBoy + it has rear discharge. This enables me to mow up to plants and such on either side. As for ride, air down to 12 psi and good to go. Yes I considered an air ride seat, but as yet my 70 year old butt has not needed it.

 

[gladehound]

My Z diesel uses Parker, I believe ... But I don't know what advantages or disadvantages that gives me compared to the other options out there. Does anyone know?

Hydro-gear uses and integrated pump / motor / gear set to drive the wheel. A small fast motor spins faster than the wheel and gear reduction is used to get the necessary torque. They make 6 models that I know of from the cheapo transmissions in the home depot ZTRs to light commercial and heavy duty commercial units. I found this really nice illustration of how they work on their web site (see link). I believe hydro-gear started with the cheapo units and later expanded into heavier and heavier duty markets. So there was an initial (and probably correct) perception that you don't want a transaxle and separates are better. Just not sure that holds up anymore.

ZT-5400 Powertrain® Internal Components & Operation

Parker Integrated pump / motor transmissions are exactly that. Think of a separate motor and pump. Get rid of the hoses that connect them and bolt them directly together. Compared the hydro-gear, the motor is larger and spins slower. The motor spins the wheel directly with no gears. Because there are less moving parts, and no hoses adding resistance like with a separate pump / motor set up, these are the most efficient option. In theory, this leaves more power for your deck and saves fuel. In the real world, I don't know if it's a difference you can notice or not. The advantage that you definitely can feel is that they are supper smooth and controllable. They also have fewer leak points than separates.

I think Parker still makes separates as well as do others and I'm sure there are many that are good.