Sizing a hydraulic motor

   / Sizing a hydraulic motor #1  

dlc2cg5

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Nov 28, 2010
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Toro Groundsmaster
Last year I got a JD 666 snow blower which has a 24" fan and I redesigned it to be a front mount driven by hydraulic motor. I have it on a 14gal/min. tractor and I put on a Charlynn 104-1061 motor. The problem with it is when I load the blower 3/4 or more full it stops. Should I buy a second motor with more capacity or give up on the idea?
 
   / Sizing a hydraulic motor #2  
I don't think 14 gpm is optimal for blowing snow with a hydraulic motor. I run 27 gpm on my Toolcat and sometimes that is marginal in really deep snow with 66" blower. If you go with a motor that has more torque, you will loose rpm and that could be an issue with chute plugging or not throwing snow far enough.
 
   / Sizing a hydraulic motor #3  
Would that be a 104-1016? I don't have information on a 104-1061. The 104-1016 is 6.0 cu. in. motor that would yield 539 RPM at 14 GPM. I assume the blower is a 540 so you have the desired RPM. The only way to get more power out of that motor is to up the pressure. My book shows that motor rated @ 3500 PSI. You could check your tractors PSI output (to the tractors specs.) and adjust if its low and maybe cheat up a little. If the valve you are running this on has its own relief valve, make sure it is at or above the tractors relief setting, provided the valve and your hoses are rated for at least that pressure. A larger displacement motor will give you more power at a sacrifice of RPM.

Kim
 
   / Sizing a hydraulic motor #4  
Surplus Center lists a 104-1061:

4.9 cu in CHAR-LYNN 104-1061 HYD MOTOR

14 gpm with the 4.9 cu in motor that you have will yield 660 rpm - so you have plenty of top-end speed ..... but not so much torque ....

What KWentling says makes sense to me - go with a larger displacement motor of around 6 cu in - which should yield more power/torque ... at the sacrifice of some top speed (rpm)
 
   / Sizing a hydraulic motor
  • Thread Starter
#5  
Yes I agree with you guys but didn't want to hear it though lol. I guess I had better put the 3pt. back on and chaulk it up to experience. Thanks guys!
 
   / Sizing a hydraulic motor
  • Thread Starter
#6  
KWentling
What does your book say about a 104-1062 and if I used my other machine with 16gpm? Would it be worth a try or are we spliting frog hairs now?
 
   / Sizing a hydraulic motor #7  
4.9 cu in motor @ 2500 psi = 1951 in lbs of torque (or 162.5 ft lbs)

6.0 cu in motor @ 2500 psi = 2389 in lbs of torque (or 199 ft lbs)
 
   / Sizing a hydraulic motor #8  
What does your book say about a 104-1062
Specs listed here on Suplus Center's website:

6.2 cu in CHAR-LYNN 104-1062 HYD MOTOR

and if I used my other machine with 16gpm?
6.2 cu in motor flowing 16 gpm = 596 rpm

6.2 cu in motor @ 2500 psi = 2468 in lbs of torque (or 205 ft lbs)

Would it be worth a try or are we spliting frog hairs now?
I would say that the above numbers are a best case scenario ...

Here's some stuff to consider:

1. Are you really sure that you actually have all that flow available ? (What kind of "machines" are these .... and are the flows you've mentioned a total, with some of it being robbed for stuff like HST and power-steering ?)

2. What kind of system pressure do you really have .... and how much does it take just to freewheel the blower when it's under no load ? (Would be nice to stick a pressure gauge inline and get a reading)
 
   / Sizing a hydraulic motor #9  
Couple of comments:

I don't think 14 gpm is optimal for blowing snow with a hydraulic motor.
I's agree - it probably isn't optimal - but it must be at least workable (see below)

I would guess it would depend on several things:

1. Size of the blower

2. Size of the hydraulic motor

3. Type of transmission (HST being more ideal in terms of controlling ground speed)

4. And probably most important: System pressure (since pressure is what develops force/torque)

Allied/Buhler does make hydraulically-driven snowblowers for commercial use - at the low end, their specs list 13 gpm (@ 2000 psi) as the minimum for a 60" blower:

Farm King Commercial Blower Specs

In the above application they use a motor with a displacement of 6.2 cu in (for units that flow 13 to 17 gpm) - and, in fact, they list the "Eaton Part No." of the motor as being 104-1062 :D

Larger flows get a larger displacement motor - covered at the bottom of page 19 of the manual located here:

Operator and Parts Manual

I run 27 gpm on my Toolcat and sometimes that is marginal in really deep snow with 66" blower.
Dunno .... maybe an issue with correct sizing of various components in the system (too little displacement on the motor maybe ?) ... or it just may be the nature of the beast ?

If you go with a motor that has more torque, you will loose rpm and that could be an issue with chute plugging or not throwing snow far enough.
True, I would think.

Allied/Buhler handles the plugging issue by restricting flow to the auger, diverting more to the fan - once the fan clears flow is restored to the auger.

From page 13 of the above manual:

"Hydraulic Control Block

Non-stalling fan feature:

The hydraulic snowblower has a unique modulating element that keeps the blower fan from stalling in an overloaded condition. This is accomplished by starving the hydraulic flow to the front auger motor (which then stops feeding the fan) and diverts all of the flow (and energy) to the main fan motor. As the fan clears itself, and the pressure drops, the auger again begins feeding according to load. When the system is set up properly the fan motor should not stall or plug up."
 

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