Squealing noise from the hydraulic system?

CBox · Oct 28, 2005

My DX33 has 270 hours and I have put 145 of them on it. I serviced and changed every filter at 230 hours and have had no problems. (I LOVE this machine! It sleeps in my heated garage when not in use.)

Wednesday I spread new stone in my drive and the tractor ran great. Thrusday I pulled some 1st-graders on a hay ride (wife is school teacher) and the tractor developed a wobbling-squeal when RPM's were above 1800 and the hydro-pedal was more than half-way. (Tractor ran and functioned fine)

Friday morning all fluids checked okay. Started the tractor, and still had the same squeal under the same parameters. I drove the tractor to my in-laws to take a pull-type mower to the barn for winter. When I returned home (about 1.5 hours total run time) the squeal is now noticeable when sitting still at idle. (Tractor still runs and functions fine) It is hard to tell where it is coming from, but it sounds like it is from the left side (when in drivers seat) of the tractor. I grabbed the hydraulic line going to the oil cooler, and you can feel it twitch. The other line coming from the cooler to the HST filter is not as noticeable.

I'm getting worried, any thoughts before I go to the CASE dealer?
By the way, this site is AWESOME!
Thanks, CBox /forums/images/graemlins/confused.gif

thcri · Oct 29, 2005

Does the squieling go away after the tractor gets good and warm or does it stay. The New Hollands and I am sure the Case's had some problems with the squeling noise but it went away after the tractor warmed up. You can change oil to the New Holland 200 oil and the noise will go away also. On your 270 hours has the hydraulic fluid ever been changed??

murph

CBox · Oct 29, 2005

murph,

The squealing noise does not stop after the tractor gets warm. In fact, it seems to be getting worse over the last 3 or so hours of operating time. I just assumed that there is something going bad, because I have never noticed the noise before.

I bought the tractor from a dealer in Michigan in April of 04 and it had 125 hours. The dealer serviced the machine before I picked it up, but I don't believe they changed the hydraulic oil. I have never changed it either. In may of this year I had the local Case dealer install a set of rear remotes. At the time, they checked the system pressure and found it to be down 100psi, so they changed the hydraulic filter. According to their notes, the system pressure then checked fine. (after the $50 cost of the filter!)

My manual recommends Hy-Tran Ultra hydraulic oil, is that the same for the New Hollands? What is the 200 oil? Is it just a different weight?

Any other thoughts or ideas?
Thanks, CBox

hazmat · Oct 29, 2005

The 200 is a synthetic oil $$$

There was a thread somewhere about noisy hydraulics on class 2 boomers, but I can't find it. Spend a few minutes with the search function. You may also want to check out the threads regarding the bursting hydraulic hoses at the oil cooler.

PS - welcome to tbn.

MikeBurr · Oct 29, 2005

You may want to try adding a little more hyrdo fluid, seem that when I had my 33d that the fluid had to be right at the top line or it would make more noise.

CBox · Oct 30, 2005

Hazmat,

Thanks for the welcome, I've been a reader of TBN for a while, but just never took the time to register and figure out how to post. Since I developed this "problem" I jumped at the opportunity for some good advice. This site is great!

Anyhow, i have been checking the old posts and can't seem to find any regarding hydraulic noise. I'll keep looking.

I take it by the $$$, the 200 oil must be expensive? If I go to this, I will probably have to change the hydraulic filter again, right?

As for the elbows at the cooler, I was reading about them a month or so ago. I went to my dealer and he said that he did not know of any problem with them!! However, he said there might have been some issue, because he actually had one in stock, which meant that he has sold them before. I bought the one and have it in my toolbox. I need to order another one, or three.

Thanks,
CBox

jinman · Oct 30, 2005

</font><font color="blue" class="small">( ...developed a wobbling-squeal when RPM's were above 1800 and the hydro-pedal was more than half-way. (Tractor ran and functioned fine)

Friday morning all fluids checked okay. Started the tractor, and still had the same squeal under the same parameters. I drove the tractor to my in-laws to take a pull-type mower to the barn for winter. When I returned home (about 1.5 hours total run time) the squeal is now noticeable when sitting still at idle. (Tractor still runs and functions fine) It is hard to tell where it is coming from, but it sounds like it is from the left side (when in drivers seat) of the tractor. I grabbed the hydraulic line going to the oil cooler, and you can feel it twitch. The other line coming from the cooler to the HST filter is not as noticeable.
)</font>

I've read and thought about your post quite a bit and there are a couple of things you can do to help isolate the problem. Since you described the problem as a "wobbling-squeal," I'm going to assume it's not the normal hydrostatic transmission whine we are all familiar with. Here is what I'd do to try to check a couple of things:

1. Since your tractor has a clutch, it's possible your throw-out bearing is going bad. That can normally be isolated by putting light pressure on the clutch pedal to see if it directly affects the sound of the squeal or makes it go away completely. I'm talking about enough pressure to take up any slack, but not enough to fully disengage the clutch. That way you pretty much isolate the movement to the throw-out bearing and clutch pedal linkage.

2. If the clutch throw-out test doesn't produce significant change, then the next check is to see if the hydrostatic transmission can be isolated. Put the transmission in neutral and bring the engine up to the rpm where the noise begins. Now, depress the clutch completely. This will stop the rotation of the input pilot shaft to the transmission. If the noise is still there, then the problem is forward of the transmission. If the problem goes away, it is probably from the transmission charge pump or the internal hydro transmission. You can also engage and disengage the PTO to see if that makes a change.

3. There is a remote chance that the noise could also be the normal engine mounted hydraulic pump that supplies pressure to your FEL and 3PH. Vibration has a way of travelling down metal hydraulic lines and making sounds that are not necessarily close to the source. As a matter of fact, you should check all your hydraulic lines to make sure no rubber grommets have fallen out of clamps nor any of the lines are touching each other. This can set up noise just from normal vibration.

I sure hope you find the source of the noise is something simple. Nobody wants to have to split a tractor to replace a noisy bearing or seal. Having a possible problem and not knowing the source takes a lot of fun out of tractoring. /forums/images/graemlins/tongue.gif /forums/images/graemlins/frown.gif

CBox · Oct 31, 2005

Jinman,

Thanks for the reply, and the tips. I'll try those out today and let you know what I find. Hopefully, I can narrow it down some.

I wish I could describe the noise a little better, but it is not a constant whine. It is more of a "chirping" sound, that's why I tried to describe it as a "wobbling-squeal".

I am also going to call my dealer today and see if they have another elbow for the oil cooler lines. In reading TBN a month or so ago, it brought my attention to these elbows. I called my dealer and they advised me that they knew of no problem with these lines. However, they did have one elbow in stock, so I bought it. Hopefully they will have another one by now, and I will change them both.

Thanks again,
CBox

djradz · Oct 31, 2005

The 200 trans fluid is a multi-viscosity fluid vs. the single weight, 134 fluid. In your area however, at the temperatures we've been experiencing lately, I would not think that would make any difference. The 200 fluid shines most when it gets truly COLD. Did you check the fluid level?

CBox · Nov 1, 2005

Just wanted to let everyone know that I THINK my hydraulic noise has stopped! The only problem is, I'm not real sure what stopped it.

Jinman, I followed your steps like you said, and I determined that it was not the throw-out bearing ,it was something in the hydraulics.

Anyhow, this is what I did. Yesterday I went to my dealer to get another elbow for the oil cooler. While I was there, I stopped in the Service Managers office and described my problem to him. He thought that air was getting into the system. He checked the "ASSIST" program in their network and it listed 5 things to check under hydraulic noise. He was nice enough to share them with me, so I'll see if I can remember them all.

1. Fill hydraulic fluid to top mark
2. Tighten HST filter and Hydraulic filter with a filter wrench (for a better seal to keep system from sucking air)
3. Tighten a rubber "T" connection at the engine driven hydraulic pump (I think this was on the class III tractors?)
4. Check for defect in the HST filter head housing (Dealer Fix)
5. Grease the FWA drive shaft on class II tractors until grease is showing at both ends of the shaft (mimics the squealing noise of the hydraulic system)
I think that is all of them.

Anyhow, this is what I did. I replaced both elbows at the oil cooler, and I'm glad I did, I think they were about to blow! I then filled the hydraulic fluid to the top mark on the dipstick. I tightened the HST filter and the hydraulic filter with a wrench (but not too tight). I also adjusted the left front side cover mount, as it was rubbing one of the solid lines going to the oil cooler. Finally, I greased the FWA drive shaft (even though I don't think this was my problem).

Like I said, I'm not sure which one of these solved my problem, but the noise has STOPPED as far as I can tell!! I meant to check for the noise after each step so I could narrow it down, but by the time I finally got to work on the tractor, it was raining. I did take a wet test ride when I was finished, and NO NOISE. I also drove the tractor around a little tonight when I got home and NO SQUEALING tonight either!

I just wanted to say thanks to everyone for the thoughts and ideas. Hopefully this info will help someone else too.

By the way, did I say this site is AWESOME!
Thanks
CBox