Supplying water to outbuildings

[rswyan]

I'm in the process of getting water hooked up to a couple of outbuildings and have a question about installing a check valve.

Here's the setup:

The source is our home water supply, and I believe we have a 1" line coming into the house from the well pump. That is plumbed into a pressure tank which is in the mechanical room in the basement. The line size drops to 3/4" (copper) off the manifold of the pressure tank, which then runs through a filter and into the water softener. 1/2" and 3/4" copper is used throughout the house for distribution.

The outbuildings were previously supplied directly off the pressure tank using 3/4" copper (unfiltered and unsoftened water) but I plan to install valves so that the water supply to the outbuildings can be switched to either softened or unsoftened water as needs dictate.

Ideally, I would have liked to plumb all the way through the filter (possible) and softener (not possible because the inlet and outlet appear to be 3/4") with 1" PVC pipe, so as to not introduce a restriction.

Current plan is to replace the 3/4 supply line inside the house for the outbuildings with 1" PVC to the point where it is about to exit the house through the foundation wall (which is poured, solid concrete) and then switch over to 1" copper.

The (outdoor) supply line to building "A" is 1" poly (100 psi I think) which is buried (at least) 48" and bedded in clean sand. Building "A" is lower than the basement of the house and I'd guess the change in elevation is on the order of 10' to 15'. Length of run (outside of house) is probably 130'.

The (outdoor) supply line to building "B" was put in by Dad. Don't really know all that much about it other than it is 3/4 poly. Probably is not bedded in sand ... but it was functional at one point (10 or so years ago) Don't really know what I'm dealing with on this one until I get it hooked back up and can test it. Building "B" is higher than the basement of the house and I'd guess the change in elevation is on the order of 10' to 20'. Length of run outside the house is probably 300' to 400'.

Plan is to sweat on 1" and 3/4" female pipe fittings onto the (short) piece of 1" copper that passes through the foundation wall and then use brass hose barbs with stainless steel, worm-drive band clamps to secure the poly lines to the buildings to the hose barbs. This "manifold" will be connected and then buried.

I picked up a 1" brass check valve from Tractor Supply to prevent any water from coming back inside the house once it leaves. The valve uses a spring-loaded plunger with a rubber seal to prevent backflow. It came with no instructions.

Since it came from the well section at TSC I'm guessing that it might have been meant to be used with a submersible pump that is placed down into a well.

In that case - in a vertical orientation - the weight of the water in the pipe above would aid (the spring, which is fairly light) in maintaining the seal and preventing any backflow.

My problem is this: I have no real good location to orient it vertically, where the weight of the water above the valve would act to keep it closed ... it's either a horizontal orientation ... or a vertical orientation where the weight of the water above would actually act to hold the valve open.

Been to manufacturer's website (watersourceusa.com) and don't see anything that pertains to the acceptable orientations of the valve.

I suppose the question is: Is installing the check valve in a horizontal orientation acceptable ?

Next question is: Where do I install it ? (inside or out ?)

Seems to me that inside, about 4' away from where the supply pipe to the outbuildings exits the house, would probably be best just in terms of possibly having to service and/or replace it in the future.

Thoughts ?

 

[Tractor Seabee]

What will you be doing in the out buildings? A standard check valve is not a sanitary backflow preventer. They fail to close or leak a little. All outdoor hydrants, lawn sprinklers, stock tanks, processes of mixing fertilizers.pesticides, etc, require what is called a "double check valve". Expensive, yes- Safety for your family, Yes. If you were on municipal water it would be required along with a mandatory test and certification annually. Their interest is their whole system. They need to be accessible and not subject to freezing and ahead o9f any line feeding the above functions. TSC may not have them, the big box stores either stock or can order them.

Ron

Ron

 

[rswyan]

Ron,

What will you be doing in the out buildings?

One outbuilding is mainly a shop currently where I do repairs, fabrication, etc. ... the other is currently storage (tractor and implements) ... their uses could change in the future.

So water use could vary from hosing off a dirty tractor and implements ... to watering the garden ... to whatever ...

A standard check valve is not a sanitary backflow preventer. They fail to close or leak a little. All outdoor hydrants, lawn sprinklers, stock tanks, processes of mixing fertilizers.pesticides, etc, require what is called a "double check valve".

Excellent ... that's exactly the kind of input I was hoping for.

Thanks for sharing your knowledge and expertise.

Expensive, yes- Safety for your family, Yes.

Yeah ... looks like they aren't giving them away ... but not all that bad in the big scheme of things.

If you were on municipal water it would be required along with a mandatory test and certification annually. Their interest is their whole system.

Right.

They need to be accessible and not subject to freezing and ahead of any line feeding the above functions.

Got it.

I'll place it inside the house, just before the supply line to the outbuildings exits.

TSC may not have them, the big box stores either stock or can order them.

Good deal.

Thanks again :thumbsup:

 

[Walkin Horse]

A spring check can go horizontal or vertical. A swing check goes vertical with the flow going up.

 

[Tractor Seabee]

Swing check valves can also be installed installed horizontal. The operation of swing checks is based on pressure difference across the valve. When the incoming pressure is less than the leaving pressure the valve closes. The greater the differential the tighter it closes. Spring Checks require enough extra inlet pressure to overcome the spring pressure as well as the pressure difference. The internet is full of info on this subject.

Ron

 

[Walkin Horse]

Yes you could install a swing check horizontal. You could even install it backwards or upside down but you would be changing it. In real world practice swings go vertical. When the pump cuts off they slam shut. I have never seen a case where an engineer would allow them in the horizontal.