TO-20 rejoining problem

[rip5896]

I have a '48 Massey Ferguson TO-20. I split it to change the seal. I've made four attempts to join it together again but can't get it closer than 1/4" to 1". Any ideas what my problem is? I'm sure the spindle has made it in as I have gotten that close. Any ideas will be greatly appreciated.

 

[DJ54]

Would this be splitting it to replace the engine rear main seal..?? If so, did you get the clutch plate aligned..?? If so, sounds like your right there, all but going through the clutch disc, but just won't drop in the splines.

You can engage the PTO, and take either a 15" crescent/spanner wrench, or 1-1/4" open end wrench, and turn the PTO shaft to turn the transmission input shaft, to line up the splines. You can feel the spline alignment, through the wrench.

If you are that close, your bolts shoud be long enough to keep everything in line, so as to do some slight shaking, and pushing forward on both rear wheels.

Make sure you have an even gap at top and bottom of block and bell housing.

 

[rip5896]

Thank you for the info. I think the splines are aligned and the shaft is inserted because the two tractor halves were within 1/2" of touching. The alignment is good and plumb. I'll try turning it via the PTO just incase.

I'm not sure about the clutch plate being aligned. I figured since the bolt holes are aligned and the shaft is probably inserted, the clutch plate should be aligned.

I put a lot of force on the two halves, even used two ratchet come alongs to the point metal was groaning.

I guess it's off for a sixth attempt.

 

[Soundguy]

forcing an input shaft into a non aligned clutch is a SURE way to learn how to repalce a clutch and resplit!

if you didn't use an align tool.. or the input shaft when you changed the input shaft seal ( 3$ seal you sold ALWAYS repalce if the tractor is split ).. then th pto trick is the ticket... trans out of gear.. but pto engaged..

any clutch work done.. or flywheel. it.. new TOB or pilot?

 

[rip5896]

thanks. I'll let you know how it goes. Nothing else is being replaced, I have a serious time issue. This fall I'll either do it again properly or I'll sell it and buy better (9N?), this massey was not taken care of, I got it for under $1K.

 

[Soundguy]

a 9n would be a lateral move.

get a ford 660 or 860 and get a 1.5x or 2x upgrade!

 

[DJ54]

If you are that close, you may try releasing the clutch disc, via the clutch pedal. It may let it align itself, and let it in the pilot bearing/bushing.

I as also taught many moons ago to put just a dab of good bearing grease in the dimple of the input shaft. Just a smidge... Old school stuff... Something for next time... Take it for what it's worth.

 

[Soundguy]

didn't have lutch out didya? have a long and short side? swap it?

 

[rip5896]

I'll give it a shot, thanks!

 

[DJ54]

I'm thinking those little Continentals had a full circular rear seal. So in order to change, you have to drop the pressure plate, clutch & flywheel. Thought about the flat side of the disc too...

 

[rip5896]

Did that, that's the seal I replaced. Got it put back together (I think), just cant get the two halves of the tractor to mate. Someone else thought the clutch plate may be out of alignment. I think since I got it within 1/2" of bolting together the spindle is entering the hole.Tomorrow should be less than 100 degrees so I'll be able to spend more time on it.

 

[rip5896]

Thanks! The PTO trick did it. Something popped and it came right together. I appreciate the help in a big way.

 

[DJ54]

Glad it worked for you..!! Now hope the clutch center wasn't bent..

 

[Soundguy]

same here. it's obvious the disc wasn't in alignment...

 

[mxr618]

Hey, alll -- First post!

Let me start by thanking all of you. I lurk in these forums to learn how to maintain my hardware and learn how it operates. I wouldn't learn if all of you didn't post. So I say a heartfelt thank you to all those through the years who have helped me repair my tractor.

My Fergie to20 got swamped when the floods went roaring through South west Wisconsin last November. THe damage was too bad to the out building and their contents. The barn-style shed (and all we had in it)had a water line of 3 or 4 feet. All the power tools were shot but the biggest problem was the damage to the Fergie To20.

The electrics needed to be cleaned or replaced and once it fired up it wouldn't go into gear. I split the tractor, noticed nothing was really wrong with the clutch, cleaned everything, and began reassembly (which is why I was surfing this board.

After much hand wringing and wailing and gnashing of teeth, we got down to it. The bottle jack holding up the front end had allowed the engine to flop to one side. I didn't like that very much. But we hit on a solution that worked: we used longer bolts from the running boards to pass through the bell housing and bite into the threads of the matching holes in the edge of the transmission case. It had the effect of aligning the engine to the transmission. After carefully tightening down the bolts around the perimeter of the bell housing, we allowed the engine and the drive shaft to mate perfectly. There was a shudder and a small bang and we were there.

So if anyone wants to try this at home:
take the cover off the clutch box
get your halves of the tractor within 3 inches
eyeball te hights of the cases. Where will the pin on the motor go?
And when your bolts are installed, you should have 2" or so sitcking out of the motor. This is what the motor will glide on as it gets mated to the transmission.
Gently tighten down the bolts and sooner or later you will hear a bang. That means the splines are almost there.
Raise the jack under the center of the tractor. The gap between the motor and trans should be identical. Insert the remainder of the bolts.

You're there!

 

[Soundguy]

Be VERY VERY carefull pulling a tractor together with bolts.

more than a few clutches have been ruined by this!!

 

[CincyFlyer]

Be VERY VERY carefull pulling a tractor together with bolts.

more than a few clutches have been ruined by this!!

Yeah, I'm leery of any procedure that requires you to wait for the "bang"! Certainly, the splines must align.

 

[hawkeye08]

Helped a friend with his Ford pickup in my driveway 35 years ago... he was sure the torque converter flat was lined up properly in the transmission. Yep, you guessed it, it was not. The bang when it went together was the pump in front exploding. Another friend did a quicky rebuild on the transmission for him... my wife was not happy about the oil spots and length of time her driveway was blocked... lesson learned, pulling together with bolts for parts that should mate does not produce any bang.

 

[banjodunn]

Be VERY VERY carefull pulling a tractor together with bolts.

more than a few clutches have been ruined by this!!

Your right about that but not only clutches I have seen more than one input shaft pushed back into the front of the trans and a few cracked housings

Jon

 

[Soundguy]

yup.. seen that too!