Tractor Buying Sanity Check

[dmccarty]

I need a TractorByNet Tractor Buying Sanity check!

I'm VERY close to getting a JD 4700 MFWD, 4nl FEL, rotary cutter, and box blade.

I need a sanity check by The Great Minds Of TractorByNetLand to make sure I'm buying what I need to get my chores done.

I have 54 acres of land some of which was selectively cut. No major complaints on the logging but I have lots of slash to cleanup at my house site, 6 acres or so of stumps, and the wood piles located where the deck machine sat. I also have 450 feet of drive way PLUS 1800 feet of gravel road to maintain. The skidder trails have to be cleaned up and maintained as walking/riding trails in the future. At some point the 6 acres has to be turned into pasture which will have to be maintained and fenced.

The 1800 foot of road was abandoned for about 15 years and I cleared it with a chainsaw and a Stihl weed eater with a rotary blade. The roots from saplings, five inches and smaller, now have to be taken taken out of the roadbed. The saplings themselves have to be picked up as well. This seems like a good use of the 4n1 bucket and the boxblade.

The hurricanes over the last couple of years have also downed quite a few trees, especially on the house lot, that have to be cleaned up. Most of these I have already attacked with the chainsaw but I still have upended stumps to attended to. I'm assuming/hoping that the tractor can push/pull these around at least enough to move them out of the way for my driveway.

I'm having a heck of a time finding good contractors to build my driveway and septic system. I'm almost done pricing materials, i.e., ABC(crush and run), colverts, and trucking to build my driveway. It sure seems like I can build a driveway a heck of alot cheaper than I'm being qouted. The driveway is going to require a four stumps to get removed. I think I can pull/dig one 6-8 inch stump. The others are going to be work. But I figure if a team of mules could stump a farm field I can do it with the tractor. Its just going to take slow, careful, hard work.

My septic system is going to be expensive, the soil does not perc real well. So we have to add fill to build up the soil for the system. This is a major expense. Again, I'm pricing the materials and it sure seems like I can place and till the fill soil saving lots of money.

My question is, can the equipment do the job?

Thanks...
Dan McCarty

 

[Doctor]

Did you check into a Kubota in similar size. You'd be much happier i'm sure. Smoother running, more economical, user friendly. Ride and drive to see for yourself.
Doctor

 

[Bird]

Sounds like you're taking on a really big job, and like you said, if a team of mules could do it, so can that 4700; just remember that the guys who used those mules did a lot of hand digging, chopping, etc. I supposed getting stumps out is one of the hardest jobs for a tractor, especially if you are not getting a backhoe. You might want to consider renting a dozer or hiring someone to do that. Once they're out of the ground, you can move them with the tractor just fine. To repeat what I've said in the past, buy the biggest tractor you can afford and have room to maneuver. However, the smaller tractor can do the work; it just takes longer.

Now being a Kubota owner, I agree with Doctor, but you really ought to look at Kubota, John Deere, and New Holland and go for the one you like best.

And if you have soil that doesn't perk well, have you considered an aerobic system instead of a septic system? In some circumstances, they can be cheaper and there's less worry about overloading them. I've had mine now for over 3 years and wouldn't want to go back to a septic system.

Bird

 

[Thomas]

Dan,
By the sounds your going to be busy.
If you have the time the JD can do the work and you might want to consider a backhoe for those stumps etc..,but a dozer for a couple of days can make quick work of your list. /w3tcompact/icons/wink.gif

I was wondering why you are leaning towards a JD,and have you check out the other tractors.

I don't think you need a sanity check,what you need is that JD equipment deliver. /w3tcompact/icons/smile.gif

Take care and have fun.

Thomas..NH /w3tcompact/icons/wink.gif

 

[Billc]

As to the size of tractor to buy, I'll agree with Bird, bigger is better, you'll never wish you bought smaller. As to brand, I have a Kubota 5400 but think the brand is strickly a person choice. The main brands all seem to be great tractors. The brand you like best is the one for you.

As to clearing land, we're in similar situations. I've been clearing and building for the past year to develop a nice, small horse/cattle ranch. At first I thought I'd do it all myself with the aid of my tractor. When you get your tractor just try taking down one nice size tree and you'll realize how slow going it is. I ended up hiring a guy with a CAT tracked frontend loader with a 4-1 bucket at $55 per hour. He was able to accomplish so much more, so much faster, that he was well worth the money. I had him clear about 4 acres, clear a 15 foot wide path around my perimeter, and roughly grade an area for a couple of pole barns I built. He pushed the trees and brush from the cleared acrerage to 7 big burn piles. The trees and brush he knocked over clearing the perimeter he left for me to clean up. This system worked well. It took him 43 hours of work, it would have taken me several months and I am sure I would have broken my tractor several times trying to get stump out of the ground. The CAT guy said that when clearing land it's best to use the right tool for the right job. To clear land you need a tracked hoe, frontend loader, or bull dozier...or all three. A farm tractor will only tear up trying to get trees and stumps out of the ground, they're not designed for that. But once the trees and stumps are up, a tractor can drag the debris to the burn piles, fill in the stump holes, and level the ground.

I have another 17 acres to clear and I'll let the big equipment come and do what they're designed to do.

 

[roysallis]

The 4700 seems to be a very good choice. I think it is about 45 hp. I bought a 5210 earlier this year and the 4700 was not out then. If it was I probably would have bought it. You could go to a 5410 but if you got it with MFWD and PowrReverser it is going to be a lot more expensive than the 4700. In my opinion you definitely want to get a hydrostat or PowrReverser. The hydrostat is not available in the 5000 series. I don't think you will regret the 4700 unless you want to go with more hp.

 

[Anonymous Poster]

A few hours with a medium sized bulldozer can replace a few weeks worth of tractor time. And there is no substitute for a backhoe when building a septic system. You need to think about what your time is worth and strike the right balance between doing everything yourself and hiring experienced excavators to do the work.

Examples of work I hired out:

Build 500' driveway & parking area, clear house site; 1 day w/ dozer & 2 dump trucks.

Dig basement; 1 day with large excavator, dozer to move dirt.

Dig 500' x 2' wide trench for electric, gas & phone, install utilities in sand, backfill; 1 day with medium backhoe, 1 day with medium loader and dump truck to sand and backfill.

Septic system construction (septic & dosing tanks, sand filter, siphon, and final leach bed); 2 days w/ backhoe, dozer, dump trucks.

Break up and cover old house foundation; 1 hour with dozer already on site.

Grub out about 100 4" to 6" stumps; 1 hour with dozer already on site.

 

[dmccarty]

I'm really only concerned with a about 6 stumps that are in the path of a driveway. My acres are going to require a backhoe, explosives or bulldozer. Most likely the former or later depending on cost. For the six stumps I have to remove I'll just deal with them. I'm sure I'm going to have to expose the roots and cut them with the chainsaw. I have a chain with lots of hours on it and it likely does not have many more sharpenings left..... Chains are only $20.

The way I figure it, tractors are made to pull and with a FEL, lift small stuff. It ain't no dozer....

I've looked at green, orange and blue. The larger size Kubota's don't allow 3 SCVs which I need. So they are out. The 4610 would be comparable to the 4700 HP wise and the TC45 is just a bit under my 40 PTO HP requirement. Not enough to kick him out but its a minus. Crunching all the numbers and specs it seems like the JD 4700 was a bit ahead of the orange and blue. The big deal is I like the JD dealer. One orange/blue dealer I went to really ticked me off and I'm still waiting for a price. After I buy a tractor I'm writing that owner a letter... There is another orange/blue dealer in my area and I like them but the JD dealer was a bit ahead.

So at this point it looks like the JD 4700 is going to win by a nose.... But the race ain't over yet.

Grrrrr..... Septic systems. This is a real pain and sore spot. We have to have a modified low pressure pipe system with fill. Quotes are about 15,000. Mainly in fill dirt. When I talk about building the septic system with the tractor I'm ONLY thinking about moving and tilling the fill dirt on the septic field. Tank, pump and lines someone else is doing. I hope!

The price around here for an aerobic system is 20-30K. Which is outrageous. I just don't see the cost myself. Course I don't see 15K for a LLP system either. From what I have read on the aeorbic system's the effluent is being discharged in one heck of a clean state. Clear as city drinking water from one picture I saw. You don't want to drink it but it sure was clean looking. And I sure would like to use that system on my land and use the effluent to water shrubs and such but the rule and expense prevent this use.... 8-(

Thanks...
Dan McCarty

 

[dmccarty]

I priced the 5000 ten tractors but they were out of my price range and once we get some work done I think it is far more tractor than we have work for. I really liked the 5105/5205's but JD seems to have lowered the hydro capacities on the FEL to give the edge to the 4000's. The backhoe was $10,000-11,000 depending on the dealer! OUCH! I can buy a used backhoe for that price. The 5205 really seemed like a good price/performance buy except for the FEL issues and backhoe. 8-(

If I can get someone to clear the pasture areas for $55 an hour and they can get it done in a week the will get the job!

Initially the tractor is only going to be used to move around slash that is on the ground, trees that have been felled via Fran/Floyd, or Mr. Sthil. I danged well ain't pushing them over with the tractor.... But I do want to move the uprooted stumps and logs.

And I want to build my driveway and maybe do the fill work on the septic field. It looks like my material cost to build the driveway will be $2,400 including culverts. I'm getting bids between 5,000 and 6,000. Seems like I can save some money...

Thanks....
Dan McCarty

 

[ejb]

Dan,

I think you'll be happy with the deere...I went thru the same thing last fall, and ended up with the JD5410. (I also have a smaller tractor, so I could afford to have one that was too big for some things). Two things sold me on the deere over the orange..first, my dealer. Just got a much better feeling from my local JD dealer than my local Kubota dealer. I think that being happy with the dealer should (and does) count for a lot.

Second: once I got into the M series in the kubotas, it seemed like there wasn;t much comparision between the deeres and the kubotas. The Deeres just felt and sounded bigger, stronger, heavier more durable and more powerful (yes, and more expensive). I know plenty of people here are happy with their M Series tractors, but ultimately you should buy what feels best for you.

Good luck.