Trade Offs and Priorites: Maddening

DAP · Aug 29, 2004

After posting my experience testing [sic] some new Kioti CK machines, the experience exacerbated an operational dillema I have where deciding the best class machine for my property. I've wrestled with this dillema for a good long while now and am no closer to resolving it than I was 2 years ago.

I have just under 7 acres that are parted as follows:

2-1/2 acres of equine paddock.

2-1/2 acres of finish lawn

2 acres of finish field (not a swamp or a pasture but not quite a lawn either) that is brush cut even though I sometimes take a 4ft finish mower to it.

2 acres of hardwood forest

access to 180 acres of hardwood forest

1600 foot rut as an easement to my property. (Actually I just had it resurfaced. I do NOT own the land this right of way exists on but am for the moment expected to 'maintain' it.

I have a HD JD mower for mowing and will continue to use it for same.

KICKER: I'd guess 40% of this property is on the wetlands map. It can get quite soft.

TIE-IN: 27-30hp class machine from a performance perspective would be the most suitable. I've been leaning to a Kubota B2710 first before the B7800 came out, obsoleting the B2710. So until yesterday, the B7800 had my name all over it.

I drove a Kioti CK30 and was VERY impressed.

Dillema: The CK30 is nearly twice the weight: over 3000 lbs to the 1700lbs for the B7800.

My property is in the submittal phase for a number of different historic designations, historic landscape architecture being one of them. Point being, rutting up the yards and areas around the barn will have to be kept to a bare minimum - YET - that blasted easement will need some nards to keep it passable.

This machine will grade the easement, and do a lot of loader chores(snow, manure, firewood, skidding), cut the field and maintain the paddocks.

REAL DILLEMA: Weight is traction. Traction is work. Work is time. Time is money.

Choosing between a 30 hp machine that weighs 1700 lbs (without loader) and one that weighs 3054lbs (without loader) makes me pause.

Then there's the other anomoly of the CK25 weighing the same as the CK30 but cheaper cause of shedding off 5 hp.

The savy know that HP is pure marketing for CUT and SUB-CUT class tractors.

Are the Kubota's TOO LIGHT? Are the Kioti's TOO HEAVY?

Shoot me now please.

/forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif

shvl73 · Aug 29, 2004

After subtracting the lawn (your keeping the JD mower), The pasture (maybe a small rake for the JD to level out the pasture pies), you're left with just a couple of acres to mow with a 4'-5' rotary cutter or finish mower & the 1600' right of way to mantain. The only part that requires any power is the right of way & that could be accomplished with the Kubota or a smaller CK series. Doesn't it just come down to how much $ you have to throw at it? Some people have the $ & a 30hp+ machine for a couple of acres is just what they want but, I would think for the average person, it's way too easy to get caught up in the excitment & over-purchase. My 28hp unit works great for my 11+ acres, most of which is field & was overgrown. We also leased another 6 acres from the feds & I mow that as well. Too big & it would be like swatting flies with a sledge hammer.
Just my .01 (not worth .02)

Jackrabbit_Slim · Aug 29, 2004

Doug,

I'm also in a very wet part of the world. I use my B2710 commercially for everything from brush mowing to box blading to backhoe work to skidding logs and I'm quite happy with it.

While I agree that weight equals traction, I'm not using any ground engaging implements so it's not really an issue for me. If I was farming, I'd definitely be looking for more weight and more horsepower. But I'm not farming. I guess it boils down to "the right tool for the job."

As it stands, I think I'd rather be winching a lighter machine out of the swamp on those days that I do get stuck.

Slim

shoppintractors · Aug 29, 2004

Are the Kioti's TOO HEAVY?

Food for thought.
I haven't heard any complaints in the Kioti forum that the tractors are too heavy.
Go figure?

Don

KiotiJohn · Aug 29, 2004

( Food for thought.
I haven't heard any complaints in the Kioti forum that the tractors are too heavy.
Go figure? )
In all fairness, as the newer CKs are concerned, there aren't that many out there yet, and maybe the soil conditions are such that it hasn't been a problem yet. Also, maybe the persons who own the heavier models haven't had a lot of rain and it hasn't come up yet.
All that said, there ARE a lot of other models of Kioti being used, and they are ALL pretty much heavier than many of their competitors, and, you're right Don, they're not complaining.
It has been my experience that if one is using heavy equipment in soil that is too moist, it doesn't make a lot of difference really what the weight difference is. Once one starts rolling those tires back and forth and around and around, they all rut and get stuck. In that respect, as Jackrabbit slim said, a lighter one may be more desirable to have to winch out. It's going to get stuck even if it's a light one.
John

Cliff_Johns · Aug 29, 2004

( Dillema: The CK30 is nearly twice the weight: over 3000 lbs to the 1700lbs for the B7800.
. . .
REAL DILLEMA: Weight is traction. Traction is work. Work is time. Time is money.
. . .
Choosing between a 30 hp machine that weighs 1700 lbs (without loader) and one that weighs 3054lbs (without loader) makes me pause.
. . .
Are the Kubota's TOO LIGHT? Are the Kioti's TOO HEAVY? )

Seems to me that you can always ADD weight if you're traction needs a boost for some jobs. It's harder to remove weight if the fundamental weight of the tractor is to high for the boggy ground. You might just need removable weights on the lighter tractor so you can set the weight for the job.

Cliff

Bob_Skurka · Aug 29, 2004

Ditto what Cliff said.

Rowski · Aug 29, 2004

Doug

One thing you might look into is switching the OEM tire and rims on the heavier machine. Get a radial tire of wider width to keep PSI of your tire foot print to a minimum.

It does seem that there is alway a trade off. There doesn't seem to be an all around good tractor. You have to give a little to get a little. I'm sure I'm not telling you anything new /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif.

frank_f15 · Aug 29, 2004

in your situation i think you might prefer the lighter machine. on wet or soggy ground they are all going to leave marks, but you are right everything is a trade off. you will have to make final decesion on which suits your needs best.