water tank connections and foundation ?

[bcarwell]

Thanks all for taking the time to respond. Much appreciated.
Here are some answers:
1/ Closed top tanks. End use: domestic (with appropriate UV, microfiltering, etc. later). 4 inch delivery pipes off 2800 sq. footprint roof. Budget up to $20K (8 tanks were $7200). Flow rate ?: no idea. Water source: roof runoffs from house, guest house, barn. Pump: no idea yet. How long before rainfalls: no idea, if I knew that I'd tell fortunes for a handsome living.
2/ Not as hair brained as you might think, as I'm patterning off several folks with rain catchment systems here in Central Texas that have been effective. I know because of record drought it may sound crazy but I'm optimistic drought will not be as bad later. Friends have 20,000 gallon tanks which in the past were filled during the year. May not rain frequently in Texas but when it does they are often gushers and kicker is when it DOES rain, you've got to catch EVERY drop. Fortunately this is domestic use for two people.
3/ Great ideas about considering crushed gravel or pea gravel for drainage, fire hose adapter, top fill.
4/ One reason for the question about tank connections and valving was indeed to avoid stagnation with last in first out, ease of clean out, etc.

Keep the ideas comin' folks, much appreciated !

 

[crbr]

Good info....thanks

 

[boggen]

Koiphen.com would be a good place for DIY'er. granted they deal with koi ponds, goldfish ponds, plant ponds, and type of ponds, but they deal with huge filtration systems.

many times folks there, need to do large water changes on there ponds. and the waste water removed. is sent through a "serial" setup. one tank after another tank. each tank is treated perhaps differently. till last one. they re-use to replenish the pond water with.

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you may get better results when searching on interent using "grey water" or "brackish water" or ughs... been some time do not remember other key words / spelling of them. to get drinkable water

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to keep water from not going stagnate, you could get a small little recirculating pump. or use an Air stone in each tank. (see air lifts on Koiphen.com) or some various websites.

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for connecting each tank and setup. it depends. myself would prefer a 2 Inch drain, min size on each tank bottom (shower drains can work for this) for a bulkhead through bottom of tank.

for other connections to tank, you might look into "uniseals" if you will be going through side of tank or bottom is domed.

Koiphen.com has better How to's, but some have used female / male threaded adaptors and used them as "bulkhead connectors"

i would advise using "clean outs" (tee or wye, with a screw on end cap) in multi places. to deal with leaves, clogs, cleaning the plumbing, etc...

another major concern, is "sedmentation" in bottom of tanks. (gunk building up in bottom of tanks). many folks on koiphen have flipped tanks upside down, so there is a cone or dome like bottom. and then sealed up all the man holes and like. having a cone / dome bottom allows much easier way to use a garden hose or like and send all gunk out through a drain.

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you will most likely want to setup some sort of "leaf trap" or on koiphen "external leaf basket" say out of a 55 gallon drum. to deal with leaves coming down off the roof through gutters / plumbing.

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to help keep algae and like growing in water. it would be advised to keep tanks in the dark, or burred.

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circulation pump. just to keep the water moving, should be fairly easy to size, but the main water pump, should be very last thing to be sized.

you will also be setting this up more likely with a "well tank" or rather "pressure tank" and the main pump having a pressure switch on it. much like how folks setup pumps on wells. though though for you would highly suggest external water pump. (last longer in your situation) and less risk of a pump breaking and destroying your water supply.

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i would advise against using garden hoses or fire hoses for various things. it can be way to easy to swap a hose used for ugly bad water. then used for good water after it had been filtered and end up re-contaminating the good water.

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if you did not use this water for "drinking / showering / cooking" your overall code / law / will be reduced dramatically so would your overall cost and much less maintenance required. other words just used water to say flush toilet, or water yard.

as soon as you label it / use it for drinking / showering / cooking there is a good amount of extra filtration costs and code requirements you will have to deal with.

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valves cost a pretty penny, so does overall plumbing. but extra valves makes the entire setup much easier to clean and maintain long term. that and fix things as needed.

2" and larger size ball valves can be hard to turn more so the cheap ones.
knife valves can over time leak a little bit

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it would be advisable. to make sure to leave extra foot or little bit more on each side of a valve, in case it ever needs to be replaced later down the road.

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fernco (name brande) but rather "rubber fitting" that come with 2 pipe clamps. make the solid connection to the large tanks. and run pipe work little bit away from tank. then use the rubber fitting to attach pipe work to the rest of everything.

the rubber fittings can slide over end of a pipe. and then be pulled back over the end of a pipe. and can allow just a little bit of wiggle / bending in case not everything lines up.

just try and keep pipe clamps from not being buried under ground.

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if you use the extra valves and "clean outs" then use some extra fittings / pipe work. to bring everything to one side. so it is much easier to deal with everything.

black marker, works nice on pipe work to label things.

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as far as filtering water to make it drinkable, that is way above me.

but filtering water for ponds. and like. any sort of gravel is a pain in the rear to clean and maintain. i would strongly advise against it. there are many better alternatives with a little bit of work, can be much much better.

 

[Tractor Seabee]

Lot of good advice in this thread. CAUTION! You are planning to use for domestic water so protect you and your loved ones. Many kinds of dangerous bacteria and etc can grow rapidly in stagnant water and warm like you get there in Texas. I am sure you are doing this w/o any permitting which is probably required in Texas as well as most states. Not a problem until a visitor gets sick or you try to sell the property. You need to consult a water purification expert to select the right equipment. Look at areation, chlorination or UV or Ozone, or a combination type for disease control. If the water sets more than a week stagnation sets in quick as the disolved Oxygen disipates. Aeration brings it back and oxygen is the best known sanitizer (that is what chlorination does). Simple as a small pump and spray heads in the top of each tank, that means each tank will need a place for new air to get in. Or you can use a small oiless aircompressor and inject air into the bottom of each tank. That is the way I would go. Final filter before the house system needs to be a 5 micron filter. There are many solutions depending on you bank book.

The place I now own; under the previous owner, had a surface water (creek) domestic water supply. They wanted to do a substantial remodel/add-on and applied for a building permit. First thing; the health dept visited and sampled water supply. They were require to put in a new 160' deep well before the permit could be processed as well install a new septic system. (The Health Police at work.)

Ron

 

[ultrarunner]

Lot of good advice in this thread. CAUTION! You are planning to use for domestic water so protect you and your loved ones. Many kinds of dangerous bacteria and etc can grow rapidly in stagnant water and warm like you get there in Texas. I am sure you are doing this w/o any permitting which is probably required in Texas as well as most states. Not a problem until a visitor gets sick or you try to sell the property. You need to consult a water purification expert to select the right equipment. Look at areation, chlorination or UV or Ozone, or a combination type for disease control. If the water sets more than a week stagnation sets in quick as the disolved Oxygen disipates. Aeration brings it back and oxygen is the best known sanitizer (that is what chlorination does). Simple as a small pump and spray heads in the top of each tank, that means each tank will need a place for new air to get in. Or you can use a small oiless aircompressor and inject air into the bottom of each tank. That is the way I would go. Final filter before the house system needs to be a 5 micron filter. There are many solutions depending on you bank book.

The place I now own; under the previous owner, had a surface water (creek) domestic water supply. They wanted to do a substantial remodel/add-on and applied for a building permit. First thing; the health dept visited and sampled water supply. They were require to put in a new 160' deep well before the permit could be processed as well install a new septic system. (The Health Police at work.)

Ron

I was surprised when I visited a friend's home at Summit Lake near Olympia WA that most or all the homes draw drinking water right from the Lake... they did have filters and UV for treatment.

I hear that Septic is becoming a huge deal where you are... sand mounds, Glendon Designs and much more?

 

[Tractor Seabee]

I was surprised when I visited a friend's home at Summit Lake near Olympia WA that most or all the homes draw drinking water right from the Lake... they did have filters and UV for treatment.

I hear that Septic is becoming a huge deal where you are... sand mounds, Glendon Designs and much more?

Actually here in western WA a lot of folks use surface water. The smart ones test their treated and untreated water often. Polution factors change when the rains come. There is a lot of wildlife in rural areas where these users live. There are at least 6 black bear and 8 deer that are frequent visitors to my 21 acres of forest, hence they raise the coliform count on surface water when it rains. Dilution is not always the soultion to pollution. Where they get caught up is when applying for a building permit it is mandatory for the county health sdepartments to require inspection and testing of water and sewage systems. In today's world it is difficult to build significant new buildings or additions w/o a permit as you used to do unless you never use a licensced contractor for anything as they will not take the risk against their licensce. Also Kitsap County where I live uses google maps and fly overs to detect non-permited construction.

The world has changed for us rural/farm livers from the old days when our property was all our own. I have to be very careful what I do along my year round creek 50' from the house. If I was building today; to get a permit it would have to be at least 110' from the creek. I have a logging contract in the works and it requires a permit from the state and a 5% excise tax to the state on the net proceeds. The logging permit ap has to have a map showing a 110' no-logging area both sides of the creek. That equates to $20-30K revenue loss for me and my loggers on prime timber we cannot touch unless the wind blows it down.

As this thread has developed it appears your little enterprise will have limited return given the rainfall in west Texas. The purification equip,ment is not cheap but you need it for your family's protection.