Welder/Plasma supply wireing, need homework graded

[WranglerX]

One thing we might consider is some of the professional may have always done residential or limited industrial wiring so they always use code for driers or kitchen ranges and AC compressors, maybe never done an "welding" circuits so they either don know there is different wiring code or never ventured out their comfort zone in code book....Might also be a failure in their apprenticeship program...

Dale

 

[LouNY]

Well I might resemble that as almost all of my electrical was industrial, gas plants, refinerys, power plants and petrochemical.
I read through the entire article 630 and dedicated welding circuits are allowed to use smaller conductors then general electrical code allows.
That said in absolutely no place in that section does it mention receptacles, it does mention disconnects and breakers located in the equipment and that
the wire has to be sized for any internal equipment breakers.
Any receptacle is going to be covered by other sections of the NEC because it is a receptacle NOT a dedicated welding connection.
That is my position from many years of Industrial and Controls experience and a bit of home and shop wiring,
oh and also I have never agreed with or wired using reduced grounds.

Almost forgot;
Codes are a minimum requirement and can always be exceeded.

 

[user.69169]

That is my position from many years of Industrial and Controls experience and a bit of home and shop wiring,
oh and also I have never agreed with or wired using reduced grounds.

Almost forgot;
Codes are a minimum requirement and can always be exceeded.

OMG, did you pull a full size neutral in yer house service?

Ground mosu usual only gotta sustain current for second till breaker trips or fuse blows.
Go back to 60s and 1" rigid conduit widout wire in it was Code for any amperage service even on 480 volts.

Code only worth price de book if man workin from book has common sense and skill of a workman. Most part Code & Inspections just anoder way of spreading money around to keep people off welfare.

 

[LouNY]

OMG, did you pull a full size neutral in yer house service?

Ground mosu usual only gotta sustain current for second till breaker trips or fuse blows.
Go back to 60s and 1" rigid conduit widout wire in it was Code for any amperage service even on 480 volts.

Code only worth price de book if man workin from book has common sense and skill of a workman. Most part Code & Inspections just anoder way of spreading money around to keep people off welfare.

Yes the neutral is full size, unfortunately I didn't install the service to the house it was done in the 70's with 4/0 aluminum (several hundred feet of it) and direct bury at that and too shallow also.

 

[WranglerX]

Yes the neutral is full size, unfortunately I didn't install the service to the house it was done in the 70's with 4/0 aluminum (several hundred feet of it) and direct bury at that and too shallow also.

Probably nothing to worry about, until the earth worms start coming up out of the ground....

Dale

 

[Sberry]

One thing we might consider is some of the professional may have always done residential or limited industrial wiring so they always use code for driers or kitchen ranges and AC compressors, maybe never done an "welding" circuits so they either don know there is different wiring code or never ventured out their comfort zone in code book....Might also be a failure in their apprenticeship program...

Dale

Absolutely and is relevant to this thread.

 

[Sberry]

We see a case where a guy came to the forum and ask because something didnt seem proper but find the "electrician" from work had wird the 7.5 comp with 12 cable 18 years ago.
But the only legal exception to the wire size with recept is welder, all the others need matching wire. The welders that come without plugs or special requirements spec a qualified electriciian who in theory understand the nature of the circuit and if I was gonna run a 255 wide open building trailers in my garage would verify the wiring. Especially true when its hard wired special machine above 50A input or allowed to be connected to circuits above 50.
There are other rules tend to overlap which would be horsepower ratings that are limited and motor size requirements. Also should be note the listing requirements for terminal sizes with recepts and breakers. 100A breaker listed with number 8 to 1/0 or 2/0. I believe a 30 lists 14 but a 6-50-R calls for 12 or 10 depending on mfg I believe. By the way no one really advocates for the minimum standards in this case and its not always cause it aint safe but a lot of technical compliance details kind of go away with larger wire and in some cases you get a little boost from a size better wire. The more oversized it is the less gain. Its not a bad thing in some cases, a good thing in others but not really much safer and can lead to a false sense of security if other details not complied with.
Worth noting the specialized ground wire sizes come with some equipment. Note the pictures of most instruction look like wire in pipe and number 6 cables not suitable for use over 60A. While the conductors are fine the ground too small. So the upsizing with the wrong wire can lead to a chain so to speak eventually finds its way out of compliance. ESPECIALLY on circuits above 50 and 60.

 

[Sberry]

At home is nuthin, you most dangerous at work where the code tends to assume that everyomne is under compentant professional supervision. I do think they limit 240V to a single recept upder some other building code and it would change some aspects of wire sizing for multiple machines. I put 2 on a 30 for a welder the other day, used 2 sets of 12 to a 30 listed and designed for 2 connections. While the outlets share the same breaker they do not share the same wire. It was a garage for a Hobart 175 and the guy bought some new 200. Properly terminated could hook both wires to a 6 with 50A and run both machines at once.
It was kind of a shame to go to the trouble to put up such a nice structure and hapharzzard the insulation and the utilities as an after thought. Call the electrician after the walls are sheeted. Could have fixed it at some point but continue with a cobble job.