What to look for when inspecting an old backhoe / loader?

[Pete O]

I'll be inspecting an old MF50 TLB tomorrow, after posting a thread on here discussing a 3PL loader attachment and being advised against it I'm shopping for a proper old backhoe to do some drainage / landscaping. Keen to know what sort of defects on an old machine should be a dealbreaker; I'm thinking if it moves backwards & forwards and the hydraulics all work will be a start; also I've instructed the seller to have the engine stone cold so I can be sure it starts cold. I don't anticipate being able to do any actual digging as part of the inspection; how else to check the hydraulics have decent power? Advice on what else to check would be appreciated.

 

[rScotty]

I'll be inspecting an old MF50 TLB tomorrow, after posting a thread on here discussing a 3PL loader attachment and being advised against it I'm shopping for a proper old backhoe to do some drainage / landscaping. Keen to know what sort of defects on an old machine should be a dealbreaker; I'm thinking if it moves backwards & forwards and the hydraulics all work will be a start; also I've instructed the seller to have the engine stone cold so I can be sure it starts cold. I don't anticipate being able to do any actual digging as part of the inspection; how else to check the hydraulics have decent power? Advice on what else to check would be appreciated.

First of all, read thr old thread in the MF Forum here on TBN: "Mf 50 tlb 1975?"
It's short, but has good info.

I'm going to assume that you are a decent mechanic with tools and don't mind working. Even so, try to get a mate to go along for another pair or eyes. And take a ton of photos.

Basically you want it to start, go forward and back, and all the controls to work without weird sounds....although I once bought a tractor that had cylinders that moaned and wailed when actuated.
So I got the tractor for cheap. It turned out that all the the cylinders were full of fine clay dust particles caking the seals and had to be rebuilt with new seals - but it only cost about $200 each - which is a steal of a deal on an older tractor.

From reading that old thread, these of MFs tended to wear the steering. So one thing to check is how hard it is to turn the front wheels when it isn't moving. In other words, how is the power steering? Of course in old tractors it is usually shot, but this is an easy thing to check and a decent bargaining point. Look at the power steering fluid, belt, and idler pulley. Power steering fluid is special stuff, and old power steering pumps tend to leak. Then they get filled with something other than power steering fluid and the problems start. That pump is usually driven by the engine fan belt.
Next, put the front bucket down on the ground and lift the front of the tractor. Turn it off, get out, and shake the front wheels looking for loose bearings and worn steering rods, and steering knuckles.

Again, you will probably find a lot of wear. That's normal because what you are looking for is normal or even too much wear, because the front end is easy to fix. What you don't want to find is some sort of evidence that someone has tried to fix it and botched the job. Basically you want to find a good runner with steering problems because those problems are easy to fix. Clutch problems would be less easy... unless it is that shifting linkage problem discussed in the thread.

Oh,.... on the power to the hoe..... Test it by extending the hoe all the way straight backwards, curl the bucket towards you, and put down pressure on the bucket against the ground. If the hydraulics have good power you will easily be able to lift the tractor up in the air. Don't turn it over!! Test the FEL the same way....i.e. rotate the bucket until the lip is down and it should easily lift the front of the tractor when you apply down pressure.
Both ends should stay lifted and not settle - at least not too quickly - when you let go of the lever. In fact, a healthy machine will stay lifted this way for an hour before slowly leaking down...
good luck,
rScotty

 

[Pete O]

Thanks for that info, very helpful. I'm heading off shortly to have a look over the machine. I'm a capable mechanic with a well-equipped workshop but not looking for a major refurbishment project, need something that is ready to tackle the work I already have waiting!

 

[Pete O]

Went and had a look at this machine today. It looks awful- as expected- but seems reasonable where it matters. It starts from cold without complaint. The FEL goes through it's range of motion without any noises, also easily lifts the front wheels clear of the ground. There is excessive play in the front wheel bearings and some play in a couple of the steering linkage ball joints, however it turns from lock to lock effortlessly with the wheels on the ground. The backhoe has a lot of wear in all the pins as expected, moves through the range of motion without complaint and lifts the back end of the tractor clear of the ground as stated above. The transmission engages fwd & reverse high & low properly, moves fine back & forth. The brakes struggle to stop the machine so need work.
The asking price is right at the limit of what I'm confident I can get back in a couple of years when my work is done.
Is there much involved in relining the brakes in one of these machines? I might get lucky and find it just hasn't been adjusted in thirty years, but want to think worst case.

 

[rScotty]

Went and had a look at this machine today. It looks awful- as expected- but seems reasonable where it matters. It starts from cold without complaint. The FEL goes through it's range of motion without any noises, also easily lifts the front wheels clear of the ground. There is excessive play in the front wheel bearings and some play in a couple of the steering linkage ball joints, however it turns from lock to lock effortlessly with the wheels on the ground. The backhoe has a lot of wear in all the pins as expected, moves through the range of motion without complaint and lifts the back end of the tractor clear of the ground as stated above. The transmission engages fwd & reverse high & low properly, moves fine back & forth. The brakes struggle to stop the machine so need work.
The asking price is right at the limit of what I'm confident I can get back in a couple of years when my work is done.
Is there much involved in relining the brakes in one of these machines? I might get lucky and find it just hasn't been adjusted in thirty years, but want to think worst case.

Overall, that sounds promising. I don't know on the brakes, and they can be a hassle to get at on some TLBs. But with a good engine, tranny, and steering the brakes are worth doing. All old TLBs have way too much play in the pins and bushings. Good news is that you can buy these parts cheaply, they don't really matter anyway, they are easy to replace, and make a big difference.

Maybe someone can help with this question. All I can say is that unlike cars, some tractors have "wet brakes" where the shoes and drum are buried down in the innards of the transmission. These are hard to service.

Tractors historically have not had very good brakes. An exception here is some of the TLBs which have mediocre brakes but excellent solenoid-driven parking brakes.

You will need good parking brakes on a TLB. Oh, I guess you could get by without a good parking brake, but I wouldn't want to.

Brakes tend to actuate on a countershaft instead of putting braking force directly on the output of the axle shaft. They probably do this to gain a torque advantage in braking force....not a bad idea at all except if the brakes are internal they are hard to get at.

But you may get lucky. Some older TLBs and tractors both put their brakes where they were accessible for servicing on the outside of the transmission housing. These were often under accessible covers containing the drums mounted on the ends of counter shafts that protrude through the housing and are located inside of the rear wheels and slightly above the axle level.

No tractor or TLB has brakes on the front wheels. That means that unless they are 4wd, weight transfer means that when going down a steep incline there are no brakes at all. Even shallow inclines with a full bucket can leave you without brakes. So if your tractor or TLB is 2wd you should probably BACK DOWN any steep or slippery slopes. And always back down if you have a load in the bucket.
rScotty

 

[5030]

I've rebuilt a few for people. I check pivot pin slop and looks for cracks and welding on the boom and dipperstick. and remnants of old grease, a sure sign that the owner at least greased it at some point.