Oil & Fuel Which Kohler oil filter?

[Fish4um]

I have a 2005 Cub 1050 w/ 26hp Kohler and I am using a 12-050-01 Kohler oil filter now. I have a great offer to buy some 12-050-02 filters from a freind. They seem to be a bit taller, but doesn't matter because it sits sideways on the engine. Does this or will this hurt the engine?

 

[DieselPower]

I would think as long as the gasket sealing surface and thread size is the same it shouldn't be a problem. It's probably a filter for a larger engine with a larger oil capacity.

 

[GarthH]

The length typically is not a big concern but be careful with any cross members that might be close to the filter. As the engine vibrates you would be surpised how a it can rub against it - watch the filter for any signs of rubbing.

A others few things to watch are the bypass valve setting - different engines can have a different setting. If you can cross the filters to baldwin or fleetguard check the valve setting.

Thread sizes are sometimes tricky 20 ml and 3/4" are amazingly close. The 20 mil thread will not thread on the 3/4" but the 20 will go on the 3/4" but will blow off under pressure. Make sure it winds on tightly try to wable it back and forth, and make sure it will not strip off - 20 mil thread may back off like a strip thread with over tightening. Find a couple bolts with a 3/4" thread and 20 Mil thread try them on your filter and on the DEAL - if you can't wable you are most likely OK.

The last issue is look down your filter, if it looks all smooth you might have stand tube - it is not very common but something to watch for.

It is true there most threads have a series of different lenght of filters. The 3/4" can go from a 3" filter to 10" filter - 20 mil is not qute as robust.

As DieselPower said match the gaskets. Face them together and make sure they are the same height and same diameter.

Good Luck.

Garth

 

[Fish4um]

GarthH, thanks for all the insight. You must have had an issue with this before? Yeah, from what I see on the engine nothing looks to be in the way. Now on the thread issue does Kohler have different threads on their filters. I would think they would all be std. I will be checking it now, since you brought it up. Thanks.

 

[Dave01]

Fish, I know you said it was a good deal but in my opinion its one of those good deals that ought to be passed up. If you change oil once a year, twice at most, the filters don't add up to all that much and to risk a different bypass valve or other issue just isn't worth it.

The only way I'd run that filter is if you contact Kohler directly and they say the filter will be OK on your engine. Just my 2 cents.

 

[Fordlords]

According to the parts lookup, the 12-50-02 is the proper filter for the 26 HP Kohler Courage engine in the 1050. The proper one for 1050's with Kohler Command engine is 12-50-08. Command/Courage engines use different oil pumps and lubrication systems between each other, so I wouldn't be so eager to swap around filters. -Fordlords-

 

[JTKub]

Like the other fellas say, you cant go wrong with what the OEM recommends. I wouldn't sweat a filter's bypass setting too much. That spec will vary from filter/filter as the bypass setting has to do with the pressure delta/difference across the filtering media associated with that specific filter. More surface area of filtering media generally means a lower bypass setting. A lower or higher setting does not mean you will starve your engine of oil pressure. It's got nothing directly to do with your engines oiling system, it's there to prevent the media and/or filter from bursting. That would have an ugly effect the engine. FWIW, I use the napa gold equiv of a FL400A filter on my 2544. It's the largest I can safely fit in there. I always have a stash of that filter on hand since a few of my family's vehicles use them.

Joel

 

[GarthH]

The bypass setting on the filter is very important and likely the most common error people do when using non-OEM filters. If the setting is very low and the oil pressure of the tractor is high then it is very likely the valve will open and the oil will just bypass the filter - as it is designed to do.

I agree most companies do have the same settings for all models. Their seems to a marriage between the oil pump and the filter. As long as the different engines can keep the same oil pump then you will like see the same filter (with varying lengths). Big companies like Deere, Ford, GM have rarely changed the filter over the many decades. I assume that they make their own pumps and are able to make them work with the varying models. Ford for example used the FL1 for every - maybe 30 years. When they introduced the 4.6L engine was the very first time they had a new filter - it was heavier duty than the FL1. The FL400 for example is identical to the FL1 except for the diameter - same gasket, same bypass setting and so on.

GM did the same - the PH13 Fram existed for decades, the PH3387 was the same thread size and the same settngs - different gasket as the 13 had an outside ring. Then came the 6.5 engine and they introduced a new filter.

The smaller companies like Kubota can vary based on design and if they outsourced the pump. I will take a look at some filter books in the next couple days to see if they do have multiple thread sizes, gaskets and bypass valve. Most filter manufacturers have a product guide that shows all of the details.

I did get my filter education over many years - my father had a filter shop that serviced mostly farmers. My brother now operate the business. I set up an oil change operation - one of the pit guys installed 20 ml filter on a 3/4 nipple and we got to buy a new engine. I was amazed how the filter even tightened up and under pressure literaly flew off. There is one car, an import that the manufacuture changed the filter between 20 mil and 3/4" in mid year - to figure out the correct filter you had to get the serial number. We started to always cross referencing the part number there after. I was very happy when we sold the oil change business.

Garth

 

[JTKub]

The bypass setting on the filter is very important and likely the most common error people do when using non-OEM filters. If the setting is very low and the oil pressure of the tractor is high then it is very likely the valve will open and the oil will just bypass the filter - as it is designed to do.

Garth, I'm with you on this, but installed on the same engine, a dinky filter with say a 20psig bypass could very well bypass before a huge filter with a 16psig bypass setting would. You never know. It's all about flow and oil viscosity. Unless you could read the pressure on both sides of the filter media, you'd never know the difference. I guess bottom line is, if this is a concern, go OEM.

Joel

 

[Fish4um]

Fordlords,
You say that the Kohler 12-050-02 is to replace the 12-050-08? Every place I've gone has told me that the 12-050-01 is the replacement filter? You are correct saying the 26hp used the 12-050-08 because thats the one I took off for my first oil change. The filters I'm looking to buy are Kohler OEM filters but are the -02 style. I don't believe in aftermarket. This has been an eyeopener! I never thought there was so much to know about oil filters.


Thank you everyone for your input.
We here in Delaware learned something today.

 

[gregdog47]

I use a AC Delco PH53 on my 1046. $2.50 vs. $8

 

[Fordlords]

I'm taking it your 1050 has the Command engine in it being a 2005. In that event, the 12-50-02 is NOT the right filter for your engine, as that is the one designed for the 26 HP Courage. You need to use the -01 or -08 for your Command engine to have the right filter on there. There are probably tons of filters that will fit and thread on to your engine- that does not make them the right one- use the right OEM filter OR it's PROPER equivalent. The -02 is not the proper equivalent. -Fordlords-

 

[MossRoad]

We have a 25HP Kohler Command and Kohler makes two different sized filters for it, a short one and a taller one. Either one will work on ours.

For yours, does your engine manual say anything about acceptable filters? Call a local small engine shop and check with them or call your dealer.

 

[Fish4um]

Fordlords,
I must apologize, I read your reply wrong (I didn't pick up on the word courage). I will stick with the 12-050-01, just like you said. Don't want to mess up my Cub. I can tell by your responses on this site, your someone who know his stuff. Thanks again, Fish4um

P.S. Come on springtime!!!

 

[Bob_Bainbridge]

I know there is a lot of discussion about using the correct filter but I don't think it's rocket science. I used Fram car filters on the hydro on my CC 1450, which ran for 26 years (1100 hours) until I traded it in on a new 3235 in 2004. It didn't have an engine filter. I've been using the correct CC filter on the 3235 hydro since I bought 4 of them at Lowes for $6 each but I've been using a Fram PH3614 car filter on the engine. We have 2 vehicles in the family that use that filter and it has the same thread and gasket size as the cub. It's slightly longer but doesn't interfere with anything. Most internal combustion engines with a pressure oil system have a similar design and oil pressures in similar ranges so there shouldn't be any major differences in pressure release valves.
Just my two cents. If you have any doubts, don't try it. I've been an auto mechanic, as a hobby, for almost 60 years so if something does break I'll probably be the one that has to fix it.

Bob B.

 

[Dave01]

Bob, I respect your knowledge but my question to the "will this oil filter fit" type of questions is ...... why? Getting the correct filter specified by the engine manufacturer isn't difficult. Maybe it means a trip to the CC dealer rather than Autozone, but most of us end up at the dealer for something during the year. Its not a high dollar item so if there is a savings its a few bucks a year.

Anyway, to me the easy way to know you have the right filter is to use the one listed in the manual.

 

[Fordlords]

I can easily show and demonstrate 2 models of Fram oil filters with the same external dimensions, threads, and gasket sizes. One is for a Porsche flat 6 engine, the other for a Buick 231 V6. Internally, a different story. Oil filters are not, "If the shoe fits, wear it," thing.
-Fordlords-

 

[JTKub]

I know there is a lot of discussion about using the correct filter but I don't think it's rocket science...

I couldn't agree more Bob. Use your noodle a bit, compare specs and use any make & exterior size you and your machine are comfortable with. I personally have never seen an engine oil filter damage an engine. I have *heard* of frams blowing their guts internally and did purchase a fram for an old ford about 20yrs ago that had a collapsed center tube right out of the box, but that's it from my non-expert knowledge on this.

Joel

 

[Fish4um]

Here is the reply I just got back from Kohler if anyone care to know>>> Thank you for contacting the Kohler Company. Sorry for the long delay
in responding to your question. Yes, you can use that oil filter with
no issues whatsoever, besides that you will need to add more oil to the
crankcase due to the larger filter (always use the dipstick!). For more
information than you really wanted to know:

Kohler sells three different sizes of oil filters: (1) Small 2.25" (28
050 01-S) (2) Medium 2.75" (12 050 01-S) and (3) Large 3.5" (52 050
02-S). The only difference between these three oil filters is the
length, and thus the filtering capability. The smaller filters are made
for applications where there is not adequate clearance for the larger
filters. Using the largest filter that will fit not only improves
filtering, but adds to the oil capacity of the engine, a good thing.

 

[Junebug99]

Fish4um-quote-Kohler sells three different sizes of oil filters: (1) Small 2.25" (28 050 01-S) (2) Medium 2.75" (12 050 01-S) and (3) Large 3.5" (52 050
02-S).

Thank you Fish4um for posting the Kohler response. I wish I had read your post before I needed a new filter on my 08 Craftsmen Tractor with the 26hp Kohler Courage. When new it had a 4" long Kohler oil filter marked 25 050 27. First I went to Sears-they only had the 2.25" long Kohler but would not assure me it was suitable (the weird part number on my oem filter made them nervous). Then I went to Lowes who also had the 2.25" long Kohler,it looks so much smaller than mine it was scary. No help when I went to Walmart or Autozone either.

Finally our local independent auto parts store convinced me that their $6 3-3/8" long Wix 51348 was the proper filter for this motor. I installed it and have had no problems at all. Apparently Wix makes the Napa Gold filter too and Napa's 1348 is the same as the Wix 51348.

Thanks again!