College drop out blues

[2manyrocks]

I forget where, but I think there was a recent article in Newsweek about job prospects for the young in the present economy. As I recall, it seemed to say that their true earnings rate is likely to be lower than what Americans have expected in the past.

A friend of mine used to teach a course in sales at a University. He always said that it didn't matter what a student majored in because the majority would end up in sales in real life. He wasn't totally disinterested in saying this since he taught sales, but that's what he said.

Another guy said he wouldn't trade his experience waiting on tables for anything because he learned more from that job about how to deal with a variety of people than anything else.

 

[dave1949]

I forget where, but I think there was a recent article in Newsweek about job prospects for the young in the present economy. As I recall, it seemed to say that their true earnings rate is likely to be lower than what Americans have expected in the past.

A friend of mine used to teach a course in sales at a University. He always said that it didn't matter what a student majored in because the majority would end up in sales in real life. He wasn't totally disinterested in saying this since he taught sales, but that's what he said.

Another guy said he wouldn't trade his experience waiting on tables for anything because he learned more from that job about how to deal with a variety of people than anything else.

I suppose there is an element of truth in that we all end up is sales. Even if it just in how you relate to co-workers.

In wealthier areas where real estate tends to be expensive, entry level jobs rarely pay enough for a person to be totally self supporting. Young folks usually end up sharing an apartment and the expenses with a friend or living at home.

I can remember paying $280 for a full course load for one semester at a state university in Ohio in 1968. To put that in context, my first year teaching in 1974 paid $7,500/yr. Teacher pay wasn't great then either, most other jobs requiring a degree paid around $12,000/yr at the time, as I remember it, in the same geographical area.

I am not sure $280 would cover one credit hour now The cost of tuition has just risen to ridiculous levels. From an economic standpoint, it becomes more and more difficult to justify the expense and (probably) debt load for a degree IF you have a reasonable alternative.

I think a degree used to be seen as the way to be in the 'middle class' or perhaps the upper end of that. As someone else said, you won't get rich working for someone else, seems to be at least 95% true.

There has been a lot of degree inflation or it could be deflation . Around 1970, graduate school students were not nearly as common as now. Grad school seemed to be for the really serious geeks , the average students need not apply. It's not that way anymore.
Dave.

 

[Sigarms]

Another guy said he wouldn't trade his experience waiting on tables for anything because he learned more from that job about how to deal with a variety of people than anything else.

Have to laugh, I agree however one job that will teach you even more IMO is being a raft guide on a very diffiult river. Trying to get at times eight total strangers working together not to dump the raft can be very interesting. Top it off, you have to be good enough to get a tip at the end for hollering at people.

 

[MossRoad]

Sorry, I have to disagree.

When I left my career of 15 years last year to change jobs without having anything lined up, guess what I did?

I looked for work outside of what I knew just to keep busy.

Unemployment office was a waste of time and a joke, but guess what, I found work.

If you really want to work, you can. The question is, are you willing to take whatever is avialable or do you think that you're to good to take the job?



As an adult I've found that if you don't have a paycheck coming in, your expectations of what kind of life you're going to live better be adjusted accordingly, unless you're independently wealthy.

Come and tell that to the folks here in Northern Indiana where the real unemployment rate is 18%. The fact it, THERE ARE NOT ENOUGH JOBS HERE FOR THE PEOPLE THAT WANT TO WORK. When Walmart isn't hiring, society is in deep doo-doo. And since they have ZERO money left, and cannot get a loan, they cannot get any money to relocate to an area that is hiring. They are between the proverbial rock and a hard place.

 

[dave1949]

Come and tell that to the folks here in Northern Indiana where the real unemployment rate is 18%. The fact it, THERE ARE NOT ENOUGH JOBS HERE FOR THE PEOPLE THAT WANT TO WORK. When Walmart isn't hiring, society is in deep doo-doo. And since they have ZERO money left, and cannot get a loan, they cannot get any money to relocate to an area that is hiring. They are between the proverbial rock and a hard place.

They are in a tough spot. I wonder what will become of the 'Rust Belt' eventually. There is a lot of recreation-type water there, great farmland and growing weather, decent universities, it just doesn't seem to come together.

I grew up in the Toledo area, I can't remember a time when it wasn't on a downward economic trend since about 1970. Also have to wonder about the long-term viability of the RV industry in Indiana. About when the jobs come back, the price of fuel will spike up and that won't help the RV sales.
Dave.

 

[Sigarms]

When Walmart isn't hiring, society is in deep doo-doo.

Ironcially, Walmart was one of many locations that didn't hire me when I was looking for work at the time.

When I say I looked for work, I really looked. I also did find it.

The fact it, THERE ARE NOT ENOUGH JOBS HERE FOR THE PEOPLE THAT WANT TO WORK.

The first question that comes to mind is what auto manufacturer shut down a plant or perhaps what high paid union job shut down leaving everyone unemployed at the same time?

Just my experience that if you want to work you can. The question is for how much?

 

[300UGUY]

Ironcially, Walmart was one of many locations that didn't hire me when I was looking for work at the time.

When I say I looked for work, I really looked. I also did find it.



The first question that comes to mind is what auto manufacturer shut down a plant or perhaps what high paid union job shut down leaving everyone unemployed at the same time?

Just my experience that if you want to work you can. The question is for how much?

The answer is thousands of companies, large and small are either gone or restructured - and restructured sometimes means that production is now in China or ?

 

[dave1949]

Ironcially, Walmart was one of many locations that didn't hire me when I was looking for work at the time.

When I say I looked for work, I really looked. I also did find it.



The first question that comes to mind is what auto manufacturer shut down a plant or perhaps what high paid union job shut down leaving everyone unemployed at the same time?

Just my experience that if you want to work you can. The question is for how much?

Well, you just aren't Walmart material - it's not a bad thing Somehow, I don't picture your personality doing the morning cheer

The migration of auto plants to non-union areas added to the decline of the Rust Belt. The steel and rubber industries also were hurt by imports and such. I know there were guys making $14/hr pushing a broom in 1980, that's a problem, but we need some decent paying jobs that can support a family too.

I worked for about 9 months saving college money at the Libby-Owens-Ford auto glass plant in Rossford, OH. Union shop. What an experience that was. For each window pattern, you made an exact number each shift. If you got done with your quota in 6 hours, well, just don't lay around where the bosses have to see you. Couldn't do more if you wanted, the fork lift drivers wouldn't bring any more glass to your line.

Each finished window glass was inspected before packing. The cutting line of about 4 teams got a small bonus payment based upon the percentage of good windows that were made on their shift. It was pretty easy to hit 98% good.

They had a robot machine set up way in the back of the plant that basically could do your job - you were welcome to go watch it run anytime you were free.

Of course everything was strictly by seniority. The shift supervisor had a clipboard with all the names and everyday you got sent to a particular station based on who showed up, what glass was being run and how many, etc. The guys who had been there 20-30 yrs. would head for the supposedly secret basement and play cards after their quota was done. I don't know how a person could do that for 30 yrs. I think most of them were half crazy anyways. They ran three shifts and you would swing to the next shift every week, that alone is enough to make you nuts.

Dave.

 

[MossRoad]

The first question that comes to mind is what auto manufacturer shut down a plant or perhaps what high paid union job shut down leaving everyone unemployed at the same time?

Just my experience that if you want to work you can. The question is for how much?

The next county over is the capitol of the U.S. RV manufacturing industry. The industry collapsed. Most aren't union jobs. Most aren't high paying jobs. All of the different RV companies cut way back or went belly up. So all of the support industry jobs went, too. In this county, South Bend, Indiana has a 40% vacant housing rate. That means 4 out of 10 houses are empty.... abandoned, empty. When there are job openings, hundreds of people apply for 1 opening.

A few years ago, if you were unemployed around here it was because you were unemployable, I.E. drug user, mental instability, prison record... or you just didn't want to work. Today, that is not the case here. All of the local colleges are full because so many people are unemployed and qualifying for job retraining grants.

A couple times a year I give tours of our computer facilities to local college computer classes. They are traditionally full of young pups. The last one I gave was half old dudes (like me) switching careers. I was kinda shocked.

 

[Sigarms]

I don't picture your personality doing the morning cheer

If I was working at a Walmart in Jersey, my personality wouldn't be a problem

Besides that, you should never be confrontational when carrying a sidearm LOL.

Moss, I agree, sometimes situations in areas really do suck. However, usually (and I could be wrong) if the "local" economy relies heavily upon one or two industries in that local area, when that industry takes a tank, so does that local area. Kind of like that everywhere.

Last year I spoke at a local trade college a couple times. Over half were over the age of 40 and there on some kind of grant from the goverment because they lost their job some kind of manufacturing. I did tell them that if they lose their job in the trade, the goverment wont be paying for them to go to school again.

Heck, Trane has closed good portion of their commercial manufacturing facilities down and moving to Mexico. Carrier makes their Payne equipment in Mexico. Lennox closed their one S.C facility down and moved to Mexico as well. Honeywell is made and shipped from Mexico. No industry is immune to cost cutting. However, sometimes it seems that because we as consumers want the best price, the manufacturers have to cut cost to make any money, so they move. I applied at Walmart because I needed a job. Know what though? I will do my best to stay out of that whoring China cheap but redneck he ll hole