Grapple cylinders

[IslandTractor]

I think it matters more what is on the bottom (thumb) of the grapple. We see this every day in the ag market. Farmers who try to use their hay grapple to handle trees and logs... they don't get the best results. The top teeth are too wide and rigid to conform around the load. I should clarify my statement refers to a single rigid grapple over 50" wide mounted to the top rail of a solid bucket with sides (not bottom tines). What you have is on the same lines as our large BC-8800 unit - I'd say you'd get a little more of a secure lock on the load with two jaws, but I think you could make either work.

I think one of the points of confusion relates to different types of grapples that go by similar names. One man's standard grapple is called a root grapple by the next guy and a completely different clamshell style is also called a root grapple by some.

To my thinking there are two basic types that use different physics to contain the load. "Gravity" grapples, like mine, have lower tines that are parallel to the ground when loaded. In this case the upper jaw just stabilizes the load but gravity does most of the work. Millonzi, Markham/Gator and a number of generic grapples are this type. Imagine scooping up a rock in you hand with palm up. The thumb (upper grapple jaw) just keeps the rock from sliding or bouncing out of your hand as you walk.

Compare that to what I'll call a "pinscher" style grapple where the "bottom" tines are usually vertical (perpendicular to gravity vector). In this case the upper and lower tines must be pressing hard against the object or it will slip out. Kinda like picking up a rock with thumb and fingertips with you palm facing down. The WRLong and Anbo are well known "clamshell" styles that operate on the pinscher principle.

My basic point here is that the "gravity" style grapples do fine with a single partial length midline vgan!upper jaw. The pinscher style grapples almost must have a single full length double ram upper jaw (=more engineering and bucks).

 

[easygo]

To settle the argument a grapple is just about the most MACHO implement you can own. Hands down!!! The more jaws the more AARRRGGHHH:drink:

 

[jimmysisson]

I had to buy a wide grapple (Millonzi 6', two clamps) so I could see the ends. With the QA plate hiding what the loader, cab, and hood don't, poor vision hampers anything approaching precision in picking up odd stuff. I like having the grapple stick out the side past the loader so I can lean over and see what I'm grabbing. Also, I had to go this wide to fit my odd Ford QA setup.
As Island correctly says, though, everyone likes what they get, pretty much. Great tool.
Jim

 

[RJJR]

Thanks for all the great feedback. I think I'm going with a single cylinder. Anyone bought anything from Gator lately? I've seen good and bad on the web. Got a quote of $900 a while back for the 48" light duty. Thanks

 

[kubotakid USA]

Thanks for all the great feedback. I think I'm going with a single cylinder. Anyone bought anything from Gator lately? I've seen good and bad on the web. Got a quote of $900 a while back for the 48" light duty. Thanks

Rjjr, a single jaw is a real work horse, and If you have never run a grapple before your gona be so tickeled with it you might even piss ur pants LOLOL Seriously tho most people will be happy with the single jaw, Its when you start using them regularly and needing more that you will see where the double jaw will get r dun faster and safer, Eric

 

[kubotakid USA]

To settle the argument a grapple is just about the most MACHO implement you can own. Hands down!!! The more jaws the more AARRRGGHHH:drink:

THERE YOU GO, Easy, I have to agree with you on that one, On a serious note tho, they can be deadly, Ive cleared alota land using a grapple, and feed a wood chipper train loads of trees, thats where it gets touchy, when you are workin around people,using this big macho hydraulic jaw, what happens when one of these compressed limbs pops lose of your grip,. Ive seen alot of them POP OUT when i realease the jaw, It can send a man flying, and if hes standing in front of a chipper,..Dont even think about it . unless you have run a grapple before, you probably cant imagine how much energy is compressed when you grab a tree right at the crotch. and compress the upper y , and this tree is 20. 30 ft tall U better be carefull workin around people, another reason I dont want a single jaw grapple, they only have half as much grip,.. Play Safe, :thumbsup: Eric

 

[magicheater]

What did you cut the metal with? Nice looking fab work.:thumbsup:

Thanx!! All my stuff is laser cut. I need that for the accuracy. I won't do it any other way.

 

[dstig1]

To my thinking there are two basic types that use different physics to contain the load. "Gravity" grapples, like mine, have lower tines that are parallel to the ground when loaded. In this case the upper jaw just stabilizes the load but gravity does most of the work. Millonzi, Markham/Gator and a number of generic grapples are this type.

Compare that to what I'll call a "pinscher" style grapple where the "bottom" tines are usually vertical (perpendicular to gravity vector). In this case the upper and lower tines must be pressing hard against the object or it will slip out. Kinda like picking up a rock with thumb and fingertips with you palm facing down. The WRLong and Anbo are well known "clamshell" styles that operate on the pinscher principle.

You want somebody who isn't the hugest fan of the grapple they own? You got him! I have the Gator 48", single jaw. It is a mixed bag, but it sure beats what I was doing before I got it! Issues:

1. Brush. Unless you are digging into a HUGE brush pile, too much falls off as the upper jaw does not clamp tight to the bottom jaw. Though I haven't used one, it sure appears that the second style you note will grab tight and hold whatever you get in there. Simple physics of the design. Second issue is that the top jaw is not full width so things tend to fall off easier than they should. 2-jaw grapples tend to be full width on the uppers.

2. Logs - same deal. the inability to clamp tight means you lose some things here too.

3. Stumps. Grabbing things can be pretty tough without getting off and levering them into place.

I think there is a happy medium that is not yet addressed in the market. A "gravity" style that has a full width upper jaw and that can swing through a good degree of the angle to clamp tighter would be a great multi-use grapple. As it is, there are grapple styles that are better for one thing than another.

This is irrespective of the weight of a SS type grapple. Any of the pincer style can be built with thinner plate, and fewer tines to lighten the dead load a lot. Maybe nobody does that yet, but as people learn it will evolve, I bet.

Island, I know you like your grapple, but it is not the perfect solution for many. Please stop assaulting those with different views.

 

[IslandTractor]

Dstig1, I understand your points. Grapples are optimized for larger rather than smaller loads. That is particularly true of the gravity type. Neither a dual or single jaw grapple will positively secure any load that is not big enough to be compressed. Clamshell grapples and 4n1 buckets or grapple buckets are better for small loads.

I have not had your problem with single trees though. Just center the load and curl to carry it. I do it all the time. Same with stumps, use the grapple to nudge it into the orientation that allows the most centered load and just clamp it. If you just grab that type of stump with a double jaw you risk having a heavy imbalanced load so the stump needs manipulation regardless.

Some places, Gator included, will make a wider top jaw if you ask. While I appreciate the concept, and it would be nice for loose brush, I'd be concerned that with a noncompressible asymmetric load like a boulder that the jaw would be twisted. That isn't such a problem with a narrow jaw. Some guys with clamshells have twisted their upper jaws with that type of load.

I don't mean to be ragging on double jaws so much as I want to dispel persistent false rumors about the single jaw types. Single jaws are not less desirable or "cheap" versions. They work! And they have significant advantages on a CUT.