Kubota L48 or Deere 110? Your thoughts..

[JPCjr]

I suggest starting another post/thread to hash out "The Benefits of Large backhoes vs. Small backhoes." There's stuff that a Case backhoe can't do that a Deere 120C can do. There's the start of another thread! wow.

Blake
WA

I was thinking the same thing, so I started a new thread here:

http://www.tractorbynet.com/forums/...093-compact-tlb-vs-full-size.html#post1180630

 

[leoniru]

FWIW, I bought a new L-48 instead of a used full-sized machine for two very important reasons:
1. No CDL/large rig required to move it
2. No wories about a high hour used machine taking a crap and me having to eat the loss.


leoniru

 

[coopers]

cool.

Blake
WA

 

[drgrant]

I think if you had experience running both, you'd realize that a Case 580 is darn near as manueverable as a small Kubota. Reason I know is because I've run both machines in the same scenarios and was surprised at how nimble my Case is in tight spots. I'm just kicking myself for ever having sold my Ford 555!

Builder, I have to say I agree with most of your points. I've been
researching this issue myself (I see SOMETHING with a backhoe in my
future) There are some nice used TLBs below 30K floating around
out there and they're very tempting. You buy a new, or nearly
new CUT and load it up with FEL, BH, and weights, you can blow past
that number easy.

I don't think that a regular tractor with a backhoe on the back of it is a
bad thing.... the biggest advantages of something like a Kubota or a JD
tractor with a BH is that it'll probably damage ones lawn a lot less, they're
really small, and you can move them with a pickup truck and dodge a
CDL. (Although, from what it appears, one can drive a regular BH w/o a
CDL, trailering it is a different story... correct me if I'm wrong on that...
brings up another question, how do most states treat a real TBL as a road
vehicle? I'm guessing it just gets regged as a "truck" of some sort. I'm
also guessing that TBLs aren't allowed on roads with high speed limits,
etc.... )

Outside of the advantages of the compactness, though, I see a real
TLB beating a CUT just about every time for FEL and BH work. There
are going to be some cases where the full TLB isn't going to fit, but I'd
guess thats an exception rather than a rule.

Further, due to the machines being so damned robust, it's
probably a lot harder to break the things, save for severe operator negligence.

IMO in a perfect world it sounds like the answer is to have both a
TLB and a CUT or AG type utility tractor.


-Mike

 

[Builder]

Builder, I have to say I agree with most of your points. I've been
researching this issue myself (I see SOMETHING with a backhoe in my
future) There are some nice used TLBs below 30K floating around
out there and they're very tempting. You buy a new, or nearly
new CUT and load it up with FEL, BH, and weights, you can blow past
that number easy.

I don't think that a regular tractor with a backhoe on the back of it is a
bad thing.... the biggest advantages of something like a Kubota or a JD
tractor with a BH is that it'll probably damage ones lawn a lot less, they're
really small, and you can move them with a pickup truck and dodge a
CDL. (Although, from what it appears, one can drive a regular BH w/o a
CDL, trailering it is a different story... correct me if I'm wrong on that...
brings up another question, how do most states treat a real TBL as a road
vehicle? I'm guessing it just gets regged as a "truck" of some sort. I'm
also guessing that TBLs aren't allowed on roads with high speed limits,
etc.... )

Outside of the advantages of the compactness, though, I see a real
TLB beating a CUT just about every time for FEL and BH work. There
are going to be some cases where the full TLB isn't going to fit, but I'd
guess thats an exception rather than a rule.

Further, due to the machines being so damned robust, it's
probably a lot harder to break the things, save for severe operator negligence.

IMO in a perfect world it sounds like the answer is to have both a
TLB and a CUT or AG type utility tractor.


-Mike

In my state, you can "road" a backhoe on back roads with little notice from the police. Technically, you need a licence for it, but most cops around here don't care. My guess is that it gets more scrutiny as the states try to scrape up more revenue.

you are right about the "perfect world" scenario. A full size 4x4 TLB and a CUT is the perfect set-up for what I do, too. I have the full size backhoe, but I'm still trying to find a 4x4 CUT with a cab & loader for a reasonable price.

Small tractors are a darn rip-off. You pay a high price for their small size, which flies in the face of logic, but it's reality.

 

[plowrup]

I think what is being missed here (or maybe it has been and I missed it) is the versatility of a smaller TLB-a 580 Case does not have a three point-you can do so much more with a 110, L39 or L48 (for instance if you are a Landscaper you can put in a Sprinkler System and then finish grade the lot with a Box Blade, take out the Rocks with a Harley Rake, or even seed it if neccesary).

If you are a dirt guy a 580 is the best Hoe out there IMHO (I worked for Case for 15 Years-they are a darn good machine), but there is a growing market for Compact Equipment (the trend in Sales for larger Backhoes are falling nationwide) and Skid Steer, Mini-Excavators and small TLB's are increasingly taking their place. Couple that with what has been pointed out here (ease of Transport) and you can see why. Not to mention that you can buy a new Skid Steer and a Mini-Excavator cheaper than a new 580.

I sell to a lot of Miom and Pop Rental stores and they cannot keep these size of Machines on the lot-they rent very well and are very durable (even when they rent them to someone who has no prior experince on Equipment and REALLY tests them-remember, what's the fastest Car on the road? A Rental Car!).

 

[tlbuser]

I think what is being missed here (or maybe it has been and I missed it) is the versatility of a smaller TLB-a 580 Case does not have a three point-you can do so much more with a 110, L39 or L48 (for instance if you are a Landscaper you can put in a Sprinkler System and then finish grade the lot with a Box Blade, take out the Rocks with a Harley Rake, or even seed it if neccesary).

Well, yes and no. Why do you need a 3 pt? Because the attachments are cheaper or just habit? They do make harley rakes, boxblades and just about everything else you can imagine to go on a QA plate. Add enough hydraulic capacity and off you go. The one mark that's still missing on smaller stuff is backhoe capability. I do not like SS mounted hoes. Excavators are nice for some stuff, but a TLB is still the (IMO) best choice for load, move and dig operations.

 

[MessickFarmEqu]

Well, yes and no. Why do you need a 3 pt? Because the attachments are cheaper or just habit? They do make harley rakes, boxblades and just about everything else you can imagine to go on a QA plate. Add enough hydraulic capacity and off you go. The one mark that's still missing on smaller stuff is backhoe capability. I do not like SS mounted hoes. Excavators are nice for some stuff, but a TLB is still the (IMO) best choice for load, move and dig operations.

Have you actually seen someone do this? I did not think it was possible. Angled widths don't work out, hydraulic flow is a tad low, etc.

 

[plowrup]

Well, yes and no. Why do you need a 3 pt? Because the attachments are cheaper or just habit? They do make harley rakes, boxblades and just about everything else you can imagine to go on a QA plate. Add enough hydraulic capacity and off you go. The one mark that's still missing on smaller stuff is backhoe capability. I do not like SS mounted hoes. Excavators are nice for some stuff, but a TLB is still the (IMO) best choice for load, move and dig operations.

Three point equipment is generally much cheaper than Skid Steer mounted. I agree totally on Skid Steer mounted Hoes-since the Compact TLB's have come out we haven't sold a SS hoe one.

I do not disagree that for Dirt work ONLY, the large TLB's are the way to go (as I pointed out in my Post)-the problem is that they are limited in usage. As far as Dig Depth is concerned, our Manufacturer's point out that over 85% of all holes dug are under 6 feet, so a Compact TLB will work very well for most people.

My point is that for the Homeowner , small Rental Store, Landscaper and such it's hard to beat a mini TLB (and, of couse, a mini-TLB will also run most all of the SS attachments which greatly increases it's capability). I don't know how long it will be until Deere or Kubota offer an Extendahoe option, but I think it will be soon.

There is a place for the 14' TLB-I do not dispute that-however most of the Contractors I deal with are buying Skid Steers and mini-Excavators-it's a trend that is increasing (notice that everybody now has entered the market?), and with two operators (one running a Skid Steer, the other a mini Trackhoe) Contractors are moving more Dirt, getting more done (with less Capital expense, which means more $$).

I think you are missing my point-

 

[Builder]

I've owned both for years and just the loader speed & capacity & ability to rip into a pile faster on a 580 is like night & day compared to a small TLB. On the backhoe end, there's no comparison. My L-39 or L-35 would just raise up on most rocks & jar me around like a dang puppet where my 580 Super M just powers right through most rock. Same with stumps & breaking up concrete. There's just no comparison, even when you're digging shallow rock, stumps, concrete, blacktop, etc.

There's dozens of small TLB owners here on this site who rise up & defend them like they're defending their wife's reputation. I'm not trying to say they're not nice machines, but they're just too light & weak to compare to a full size to accomplish serious digging tasks. For little stuff, they're great, in fact, they're better due to lesser lawn damage & easier transport. All the little guys pull em around in my area with little trucks as did I.