This is the Kubota forum, not the MF forum. The Kubota brand is CLEARY the brand by which others are judged. I never stated the MF couldn't perform as good as the Kubota, they appear quite equal. HOWEVER, the overall national dealer support is not the same. The commitment and breadth of offerings..is NOT the same. So if two machines are equal, but one machine has a superior dealer network, is the established leader...etc. The question remains...why would you consider paying MORE for the lesser package??? You can keep your insults to your self...and trot right back to the MF forum.
Massey Ferguson GC2310 vs. Kubota BX23
- Thread starter wchp
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</font><font color="blue" class="small">( <font color="blue"> So you should buy a Yugo instead of a Toyota if they impress you w/ thier service? Go right ahead!? </font>
Mike's point was that you need to look at the facts and see through the saleman's hype when purchasing a tractor. I hardly think comparing a Massey Ferguson with a Yugo is a very fair example to use. /forums/images/graemlins/mad.gif
Kubota and Massey Ferguson both make equally comparable products, and that being the case, you need to look at addition things, like service from the dealer.
While I'm glad that Bota Guy and Rainbow6 like their Kubotas, other people may have differenting opinions and may like another color more, and that is OK that other people are different! /forums/images/graemlins/laugh.gif /forums/images/graemlins/cool.gif )</font>
I think the point was ill-informed. to make a blanket recommendation to ignore the tractor and buy based on the dealer is complete lunacy.
Thin for a minute....you are BUYING the tractor first, dealer second. Is this how you guys buy cars too???
Mike's point was that you need to look at the facts and see through the saleman's hype when purchasing a tractor. I hardly think comparing a Massey Ferguson with a Yugo is a very fair example to use. /forums/images/graemlins/mad.gif
Kubota and Massey Ferguson both make equally comparable products, and that being the case, you need to look at addition things, like service from the dealer.
While I'm glad that Bota Guy and Rainbow6 like their Kubotas, other people may have differenting opinions and may like another color more, and that is OK that other people are different! /forums/images/graemlins/laugh.gif /forums/images/graemlins/cool.gif )</font>
I think the point was ill-informed. to make a blanket recommendation to ignore the tractor and buy based on the dealer is complete lunacy.
Thin for a minute....you are BUYING the tractor first, dealer second. Is this how you guys buy cars too???
NIXON
Veteran Member
You are "CLEARY " the voice of reason /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif
While I owna Kubota and dearly love my machine . I find your Rabid opinions of other brands somewhat offensive .
It's one thing to recommend a brand over another . But it's entirely different to do so by denegrating other brands .
All the best, John
While I owna Kubota and dearly love my machine . I find your Rabid opinions of other brands somewhat offensive .
It's one thing to recommend a brand over another . But it's entirely different to do so by denegrating other brands .
All the best, John
Bob_Skurka
Super Member
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</font><font color="blue" class="small">( </font>
Thin for a minute....you are BUYING the tractor first, dealer second. Is this how you guys buy cars too??? )</font>
Personally, I wouldn't buy an Audi despite the fact that I'd love to have an Audi 8L because the nearest dealer is on the opposite end of the county of where I travel. The Volvo dealer is on my way to my office, they pick my cars up, or they take me to my office, they wash my cars, and they do that when I go in for a simple oil change. If I drove the Audi, a simple oil change would take me 40 minutes out of my way (each way) so even if they matched the service I receive from the Volvo dealer, it would still cost me well over an hour of my time. So yes, I do think that a dealer is important and that is how I buy my cars. Then again, I don't look under the hood either because there is nothing under the hood of a modern car that I can fix anyway!
As for the statement that this is the Kubota Forum not the Massey Forum, I would point out that regardless of which forum a question is asked on, it is important to give OBJECTIVE and ACCURATE information.
As for the Massey being a LESSER tractor, I really think that is not an accurate statement. I think the tractors are pretty much equals and I doubt one really is better than the other from any practical perspective.
The dealer network of one tractor brand may be larger than another tractor brand, but if that is related to cars, then one would have to presume that the largest dealer network would provide the best cars? There are very few people who would actually believe that General Motors, which has the largest dealer network, actually produces the most trouble free, highest quality automobiles. The LOCAL dealer is the one you need to deal with and the quality of that dealership IS important, the size of the national network is pretty much irrelevant.
Thin for a minute....you are BUYING the tractor first, dealer second. Is this how you guys buy cars too??? )</font>
Personally, I wouldn't buy an Audi despite the fact that I'd love to have an Audi 8L because the nearest dealer is on the opposite end of the county of where I travel. The Volvo dealer is on my way to my office, they pick my cars up, or they take me to my office, they wash my cars, and they do that when I go in for a simple oil change. If I drove the Audi, a simple oil change would take me 40 minutes out of my way (each way) so even if they matched the service I receive from the Volvo dealer, it would still cost me well over an hour of my time. So yes, I do think that a dealer is important and that is how I buy my cars. Then again, I don't look under the hood either because there is nothing under the hood of a modern car that I can fix anyway!
As for the statement that this is the Kubota Forum not the Massey Forum, I would point out that regardless of which forum a question is asked on, it is important to give OBJECTIVE and ACCURATE information.
As for the Massey being a LESSER tractor, I really think that is not an accurate statement. I think the tractors are pretty much equals and I doubt one really is better than the other from any practical perspective.
The dealer network of one tractor brand may be larger than another tractor brand, but if that is related to cars, then one would have to presume that the largest dealer network would provide the best cars? There are very few people who would actually believe that General Motors, which has the largest dealer network, actually produces the most trouble free, highest quality automobiles. The LOCAL dealer is the one you need to deal with and the quality of that dealership IS important, the size of the national network is pretty much irrelevant.
MikePA
Super Moderator
<font color="blue"> I think the point was ill-informed to make a blanket recommendation to ignore the tractor </font>
Such a point would be ill informed indeed. However, where did I say 'ignore the tractor'? I specifically said, twice, that these 2 tractors are roughly equal in capability.
<font color="blue"> Thin{sic} for a minute....you are BUYING the tractor first, dealer second. </font>
TBN is replete with stories of people who bought the tractor (brand and model) from a dealer they really did not have confidence in based upon their sales practices and lived to regret it when the time came to get service, either normal service or warranty service. You buy a tractor once, you have to deal with the dealer for the life of the tractor. You have to consider both the tractor and the dealer. After I determine what tractor I need and evaluate the dealer, if I do not believe the dealer can support me, I go elsewhere. If that means I have to travel farther or switch brands, so be it. And, yes, that's how I buy cars.
<font color="blue"> but one machine has a superior dealer network </font>
The national network is meaningless since it's my local dealer who provides the post sale service.
Also refer to this thread.
Such a point would be ill informed indeed. However, where did I say 'ignore the tractor'? I specifically said, twice, that these 2 tractors are roughly equal in capability.
<font color="blue"> Thin{sic} for a minute....you are BUYING the tractor first, dealer second. </font>
TBN is replete with stories of people who bought the tractor (brand and model) from a dealer they really did not have confidence in based upon their sales practices and lived to regret it when the time came to get service, either normal service or warranty service. You buy a tractor once, you have to deal with the dealer for the life of the tractor. You have to consider both the tractor and the dealer. After I determine what tractor I need and evaluate the dealer, if I do not believe the dealer can support me, I go elsewhere. If that means I have to travel farther or switch brands, so be it. And, yes, that's how I buy cars.
<font color="blue"> but one machine has a superior dealer network </font>
The national network is meaningless since it's my local dealer who provides the post sale service.
Also refer to this thread.
JerryG
Super Member
A person should be happy or even proud of a major purchase, but there is a difference between that and obsessiveness. Just because YOU bought a certain brand, doesn't mean that it is the end all to end all. Grow up and see that. By taking the stance that your view is the one and only, you have totally ignored what the original poster needed. The original poster is here to learn, not hear a lot of garbage. Wchp, buy the tractor that fits YOU, from a dealer that you are comfortable with and then you will be happy.
NIXON
Veteran Member
Jerry G . I'll bet that after reading all these posts that
WCHP will go with a MF 23 series . Or maybe He won't buy at all . He's certainly been discouraged from buying anything but a Kubota . And If I was a new buyer , I'd hesitate to join that club based on some of the above posts !! Sad ! John
WCHP will go with a MF 23 series . Or maybe He won't buy at all . He's certainly been discouraged from buying anything but a Kubota . And If I was a new buyer , I'd hesitate to join that club based on some of the above posts !! Sad ! John
Bob_Skurka
Super Member
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</font><font color="blue" class="small">( Jerry G . I'll bet that after reading all these posts that
WCHP will go with a MF 23 series . Or maybe He won't buy at all . He's certainly been discouraged from buying anything but a Kubota . And If I was a new buyer , I'd hesitate to join that club based on some of the above posts !! Sad ! John )</font>
John, I tend to agree with you. I'm a Kubota fan but spent my time on this thread defending the Massey. It's sort of embarrassing to be a Kubota fan when a thread goes as wrong as this one has.
WCHP will go with a MF 23 series . Or maybe He won't buy at all . He's certainly been discouraged from buying anything but a Kubota . And If I was a new buyer , I'd hesitate to join that club based on some of the above posts !! Sad ! John )</font>
John, I tend to agree with you. I'm a Kubota fan but spent my time on this thread defending the Massey. It's sort of embarrassing to be a Kubota fan when a thread goes as wrong as this one has.
NIXON
Veteran Member
Bob , I'm all for standing up for my choices in life . Albeit cars ,politics , or whatever . But I also believe that I can be misinformed , wrong ,or just haven't thought things through .
To that end I don't take differences of opinion as a challenge or offence . To me it's an education . Not that I'm open minded ..... I've just come to realize I'm not as smart as I used to think I was /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif John
To that end I don't take differences of opinion as a challenge or offence . To me it's an education . Not that I'm open minded ..... I've just come to realize I'm not as smart as I used to think I was /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif John
Nik
Gold Member
Both tractors are nice. The 3 point hitch can stay on the Massey with the backhoe. The Bx23 has to have the 3 poiint hitch removed for the backhoe. The Massey runs at a lower RPM ?2600 compared to the Kubota's rated PTO speed of 3200. I think this would tranlate to less noise than the Kubota. I would operate either tractor in low range going up a steep incline and both would probably perform the same. I have a Kubota B2410 but previously owned a Massey compact 1233. The Massey Iseki engine is very smooth and reliable. I really liked the MAssey especially as the HST had 3 ranges and worked flawlessly. The ROPS of the Massey 2310 may be a liitle low for some when the seat is in the backhoe position. As said by others you should go with the tractor that you feel more comfortable on and has controls laid out to your liking. If you like both and service will be similar at both, then go with the less expensive one. I have checked out both models and liked the finish of the BX23 slightly more.
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