Silt Happens!
- Thread starter jinman
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JimMorrissey
Veteran Member
Jim,
An excavator would rather easily dig the pond to the depth you want in less time than a bulldozer and with deeper side walls if you want it quickly falling off. A quick depth gives you more time before you see it start to dry up. Another aspect of the excavator is that the spoil pile could be moved a pretty long way away from the pond edge after it was dug out. He'd relay the piles. It would be much easier for you to clean up after he leaves for the day.
Personally I think this is a perfect job for you to do with a rental excavator. What fun and nothing to destroy in the area. You'd get good at the controls pretty quickly. The rental for two days would be about what it cost to have a guy come for one day. You can do a lot of work with a good sized excavator in two full days. Get a big one and go nuts /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif
An excavator would rather easily dig the pond to the depth you want in less time than a bulldozer and with deeper side walls if you want it quickly falling off. A quick depth gives you more time before you see it start to dry up. Another aspect of the excavator is that the spoil pile could be moved a pretty long way away from the pond edge after it was dug out. He'd relay the piles. It would be much easier for you to clean up after he leaves for the day.
Personally I think this is a perfect job for you to do with a rental excavator. What fun and nothing to destroy in the area. You'd get good at the controls pretty quickly. The rental for two days would be about what it cost to have a guy come for one day. You can do a lot of work with a good sized excavator in two full days. Get a big one and go nuts /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif
gmsssi
Platinum Member
Sorry but I disagree. You can make the bank steep enough and be safe with the dozer and the escavator will require multiple handlings. The pond is too broad an expanse to make it worth while. The dozer can contour the spoil much better than the escavator while its removed. Just my opinion!
MMM
Platinum Member
</font><font color="blue" class="small">( You all in Texas sure have a strange definition of "pond"./quote]
It's a universal definition- A hole in the ground you fill with water and lots of money.
It's a universal definition- A hole in the ground you fill with water and lots of money.
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jinman
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</font><font color="blue" class="small">( is it the angle or is that tractor dangerously close to an edge that looks as though there is no bottom..............? )</font>
Danny, I'm not sure which picture you are talking about, but the one with me down in the hole is a little deceptive. The tractor is sitting on relatively firm native soil. I know it's the native soil because I found a pile of burned wood in the bottom. It's been sealed like a time capsule below 6 feet of silt for the last 65 years. /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif
During this whole project, I kept my ROPS up and my seatbelt on. There are just too many ways to make a mistake to not take every precaution. Probably the most danger came when I was up on top of the pile of spoil. It's actually a much wider pile than it looks like and I let it dry for a week before driving up there to start another tier.
Danny, I'm not sure which picture you are talking about, but the one with me down in the hole is a little deceptive. The tractor is sitting on relatively firm native soil. I know it's the native soil because I found a pile of burned wood in the bottom. It's been sealed like a time capsule below 6 feet of silt for the last 65 years. /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif
During this whole project, I kept my ROPS up and my seatbelt on. There are just too many ways to make a mistake to not take every precaution. Probably the most danger came when I was up on top of the pile of spoil. It's actually a much wider pile than it looks like and I let it dry for a week before driving up there to start another tier.
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jinman
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</font><font color="blue" class="small">( An excavator would rather easily dig the pond to the depth you want in less time than a bulldozer and with deeper side walls if you want it quickly falling off. )</font>
Jim, you make a good point. I'd go for the excavator, but the nearest one I can rent is about 60 miles away. By the time I pay for two-way transport and the rental fee, I can hire a local guy.
My "dozer" guy talked to me tonight. He strongly suggested that I not use a dozer for wet silt. He has a track loader with a 3-yard bucket. He thinks he can do the job in one day. He only lives a few miles from me. He's coming out Saturday to look the job over and hopefully get it done next week.
I think the track loader is probably the the best compromise between the dozer and an excavator. He can scoop out a huge amount and transport it the short distance to the spoils area. I can then transport small loads to the hundreds of places I need fill.
I don't want to cut my edge much more than about a 3' vertical wall. I can't afford cave offs and any loss of material in the dam. The outer dam wall goes by two ponds and is about 600 feet long with a soil conservation lake on the other side. So I need it to be very substantial. The inner wall could be cut down some and I think the track loader will be able to do that. This cleanout will easily double the amount of water the pond will hold. I think it will make it through very long dry seasons since it will be so deep and not have anymore exposed surface area than it does now.
I'm starting to get excited about having this done. /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif
Jim, you make a good point. I'd go for the excavator, but the nearest one I can rent is about 60 miles away. By the time I pay for two-way transport and the rental fee, I can hire a local guy.
My "dozer" guy talked to me tonight. He strongly suggested that I not use a dozer for wet silt. He has a track loader with a 3-yard bucket. He thinks he can do the job in one day. He only lives a few miles from me. He's coming out Saturday to look the job over and hopefully get it done next week.
I think the track loader is probably the the best compromise between the dozer and an excavator. He can scoop out a huge amount and transport it the short distance to the spoils area. I can then transport small loads to the hundreds of places I need fill.
I don't want to cut my edge much more than about a 3' vertical wall. I can't afford cave offs and any loss of material in the dam. The outer dam wall goes by two ponds and is about 600 feet long with a soil conservation lake on the other side. So I need it to be very substantial. The inner wall could be cut down some and I think the track loader will be able to do that. This cleanout will easily double the amount of water the pond will hold. I think it will make it through very long dry seasons since it will be so deep and not have anymore exposed surface area than it does now.
I'm starting to get excited about having this done. /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif
nobaddays
Member
jinman. be careful about making your vertical edges to steep. if anyone were to fall in, you would want them to be able to crawl out. there are ordinances about this angle in many places. have fun. jc
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jinman
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Here's one more photo that I didn't post earlier. It shows the area where I'm putting the silt. I'll have the loader operator put the spoils to the right of my pile and up into the little valley behind that if necessary. I also may build up around the base of the slope on the right, but if I do I'll have to cut a ditch so water won't come down the hillside and wash the silt right back into the pond. Having watched the way water flows through here for the last 10 years gives me a good idea of what will work and what won't.
What does everyone think? Should I take out the trees on the little peninsula where the tractor is in this picture? I'm sure it would be easier to take them out and replant later. I just haven't made up my mind. The two willows in front have a lot of beaver damage and look pretty miserable anyway. There is one large tree that is dead behind them and will have to come out anyhow. Most of the others are persimmon trees and a single cedar juniper. I'd love to have a nice pecan tree here.
What does everyone think? Should I take out the trees on the little peninsula where the tractor is in this picture? I'm sure it would be easier to take them out and replant later. I just haven't made up my mind. The two willows in front have a lot of beaver damage and look pretty miserable anyway. There is one large tree that is dead behind them and will have to come out anyhow. Most of the others are persimmon trees and a single cedar juniper. I'd love to have a nice pecan tree here.
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mikim
Veteran Member
Jim - Looking at this pic - isn't this the valley between the house & the picnic area? Why did you pick there for the spoils? Easy access to be sure ... I was just thinkin' the area toward the beaver dam - but staying closer to the pond so it all doesn't end up in the lake -could use some filling......... course I've only been there once so ...... there i goes thinkin' agin..... /forums/images/graemlins/tongue.gif
JimMorrissey
Veteran Member
If they're damaged and in the way, get rid of them. So many people keep damaged and useless (trash) trees just for the sake of a "tree". --Not saying those trees are "trash" /forums/images/graemlins/blush.gif If these were your only three trees you might want to think twice, but it looks like you've got plenty all over the property. **They'll likely die in a couple of years anyway from soil compaction and lack of oxygen from the soils pile. Rope off any quality trees you have and forbid the machines from driving over or placing spoil near the base. A size the covers about the size of the trees crown is good, the "drip line".