Flail Mower Caroni TM1900 flail mower vs. Woodmaxx FM-78 flail mower, which to buy, any others?

[Z-Michigan]

I know about the huge flail mowers thread and would prefer to keep this separate and narrow.

I need a rough cut mower for maintaining about 25 acres of field, which is currently overgrown with weeds and some bushes / brush. Over time much of it will become orchard or managed vegetable garden, but that will take years and even then I'll be mowing around the rows and edges. I've used both a light duty rotary cutter and a Caroni TM-1900 flail mower before, on a different but somewhat similar farm. Not surprisingly, I liked the Caroni flail better!

In my use the Caroni flail worked very well. My only significant complaint was on changing belts. I shredded belts one time when something got wrapped around the rotor. Can't blame Caroni for this. But changing belts is tedious and difficult due to both the belt cover design and the tensioner design. I had no other issues in about 4.5 years of use.

The Caroni TM-1900 is a known quantity for me and is going to cost about $2378 shipped to my house. The Woodmaxx flail has been getting a lot of interest here and would cost around the same delivered price ($2349 with "free shipping" but I would probably have to pay extra for a liftgate and gravel road delivery). I called up Woodmaxx to get some info and had a positive call but can't say I really learned all that much.

From viewing the Woodmaxx website, here's what I see as potential benefits:
-belt tensioner design
-knife/hammer design
-access door for top-side access

Other than those it looks very similar in design and capability. I'm familiar with the Caroni and it's made in Italy, vs. China for the Woodmaxx. Has anyone seen both of these flails in person to compare them? Any other guidance to offer?

Finally, is there any other flail mower under $3000 that I should be aware of?

 

[Teachu2]

I bought one from seller Betstco on Ebay - 68" Heavy duty. Can't seem to get the link to copy. He sells a regular duty, a heavy duty, and a heavy duty with hydraulic offset. Easy to deal with. Used it quite a bit on my 5ac hillsides, grass and brush, over the last two seasons. Works as advertised!

 

[leonz]

I know about the huge flail mowers thread and would prefer to keep this separate and narrow.

I need a rough cut mower for maintaining about 25 acres of field, which is currently overgrown with weeds and some bushes / brush. Over time much of it will become orchard or managed vegetable garden, but that will take years and even then I'll be mowing around the rows and edges. I've used both a light duty rotary cutter and a Caroni TM-1900 flail mower before, on a different but somewhat similar farm. Not surprisingly, I liked the Caroni flail better!

In my use the Caroni flail worked very well. My only significant complaint was on changing belts. I shredded belts one time when something got wrapped around the rotor. Can't blame Caroni for this. But changing belts is tedious and difficult due to both the belt cover design and the tensioner design. I had no other issues in about 4.5 years of use.

The Caroni TM-1900 is a known quantity for me and is going to cost about $2378 shipped to my house. The Woodmaxx flail has been getting a lot of interest here and would cost around the same delivered price ($2349 with "free shipping" but I would probably have to pay extra for a liftgate and gravel road delivery). I called up Woodmaxx to get some info and had a positive call but can't say I really learned all that much.

From viewing the Woodmaxx website, here's what I see as potential benefits:
-belt tensioner design
-knife/hammer design
-access door for top-side access

Other than those it looks very similar in design and capability. I'm familiar with the Caroni and it's made in Italy, vs. China for the Woodmaxx. Has anyone seen both of these flails in person to compare them? Any other guidance to offer?

Finally, is there any other flail mower under $3000 that I should be aware of?

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You should read the thread as it will answer all your questions.



Check the Vrisimo home page Vrisimo-Flail Mowers and Shredders

They are made in California and have dealers in every state in the lower 48 states their orchard and vineyard flail mowers have been on the market for a very long time and are also very easy to maintain as they show in their literature.

They will also send you a price quote too.


Its going to be a case of pay for a good quality flail mower ment for your type of workload now and in doing so knowing where you can obtain wear parts and V belts locally quickly. You can buy the Gates Series 1 V belts on amazon through one of their partner retailers if needed.

Their orchard and vineyard flail is available in a 43 inch wide model which lets you run the PTO flat out with a good mule and the 60 inch model is the same just larger.

Once you knock that stuff down to 2 inches in height and mow in a spiral pattern you save a lot of work, time, brakes and fuel and the recutting bars help to shred it even finer on the first pass as hammer knives do not recut material well due to their design.

You could buy their smallest grass flail mower which is the Mini Max 48" and have a heavy duty design to use on a smaller mule and the flail mower will last you for a very long time as long as you take care of it.


As I point of reference I have the same Mathews Company lawn genie flail mower that my father bought 37 plus years ago and its still working very well when I need it.


I would rather see you spend good money now and not have worries 15 years from now when its attached to a bigger mule.

please read the flail mower thread and talk to a Vrisimo dealer about the 48"mini max or the 43" vineyard shredder that can be used for grass mowing as well. The smallest Land Pride(Maschio) orchard and vineyard flail mower shredders are wider
than the Vrisimo flails I described to you.

Its better to justify quality when spending your money rather than simply buying on the basis of price as one bad weld on a flail mower shroud that occurs due to the flail mower wracking due to thinner metals is going to be nothing more than total trouble.


There are lots of good used crop shredders for sale that are easy to work on and change belts and you can rent a high horsepower mule for a week to mow and be done with it for one season and simply rent power once a year until you are ready to do what you want to do with a smaller flail mower.

 

[Dadnatron]

In my opinion, the 'Flail' thread should be shut down and restarted. It is a behemouth which has lost its ability to actually impart knowledge. I've read it... and purchased a flail... and I'd STILL recommend locking it and beginning a new thread. About 1/2 of it is non-informational commenting and 500 pages of thread, sorting through that mess, is just not a reasonable endeavor any longer. I purchased mine at around page 250. I'd hate to try to read it now.

Its kind of like the Library of Congress... without a card catalog. The information is there... but almost impossible to find.

 

[leonz]

Actually one should really consider it an unorganized ;^( flail mower dictionary with information from A to Z.

Sadly for anyone involved or examining the purchase and use of flail mowers of all types
I doubt we will ever see a flail mower page section as it is an integral three point
hitch attachment.

 

[Z-Michigan]

I'm really hoping someone who has at least seen both in person could chime in!

Since I previously owned the same model Caroni and was very happy with it, I'm not looking to go much more expensive than that. You can always spend more money on anything and I need to balance quality with affordability. I'm not looking to go dirt cheap because I'm well aware that is often the worst economic choice since it breaks or wears out.

Leonz, I appreciate your comments. The Vrisimo rep was friendly and helpful. We also discovered there's no stocking dealer within some vast distance (perhaps 1000+ miles). There's a dealer who sells a different product line of the parent company but would be allowed to order Vrisimo, a measly 150 miles away, but I'm not sure if that's going anywhere. And the MSRP of $5400 on the model I would need (mighty max 72") makes it a pretty tough sell in comparison to the Caroni.

 

[leonz]

Could you live with the smallest orchard and vineyard shredder model 48" or one of the 60" units and be able to benefit
from having full power all the time?

The smaller width rotor will always let you have full power all the time so keep that in mind.


I would hate to see you have problems that could be taken care of quickly by the
same vrisimo dealer.

The only reason I suggested the smaller one was because of the terrain you are going to be dealing with and backing over scrub and then driving forward will shred everything in 2 passes.

I use my towed motorized 48 inch flail mower for everything and its 37 years old now.

 

[Z-Michigan]

Could you live with the smallest orchard and vineyard shredder model 48" or one of the 60" units and be able to benefit from having full power all the time? The smaller width rotor will always let you have full power all the time so keep that in mind.

I have a 50hp / 45pto HP tractor, so I think I'll have more than enough HP for a 72". My prior tractor with only ~34 PTO HP worked fine with the same 72" Caroni flail.

I would hate to see you have problems that could be taken care of quickly by the
same vrisimo dealer.

I spoke to Vrisimo. Very friendly and helpful! According to them, the closest dealer that truly stocks and services this product is over 1000 miles away. The dealer that's 150 miles away is in the distribution channel and can sell me a Vrisimo within the distribution agreement, but has most likely (according to the Vrisimo rep!!!) never heard of or seen this product.

The only reason I suggested the smaller one was because of the terrain you are going to be dealing with and backing over scrub and then driving forward will shred everything in 2 passes.

The first 1-2 mowings will be moderately difficult, and after that not at all difficult, I expect.

I like buying quality, but my own personal experience with the same mower over 4.5 years was very good. I'm simply looking for any guidance on how that one compares to another one now on the market.

 

[TractorToolsDirect]

You should look at the Del Morino T73 (73") as well. Built heavier than the Caroni, with bigger, heavier blades. Similar in design and the price is in your range. This is also an italian-made machine.

 

[Z-Michigan]

You should look at the Del Morino T73 (73") as well. Built heavier than the Caroni, with bigger, heavier blades. Similar in design and the price is in your range. This is also an italian-made machine.

Interesting. What is parts availability like for that - especially for knives and shackles? I'd be interested in detail on any other differences vs. the Caroni also.

 

[TractorToolsDirect]

Parts availability is complete. No problems there. This mower does not use the shackles like the Caroni, which also makes blade replacement much cheaper. I don't think I can put a link in here so you'll need to Google it. As far as similarities/differences, the DM has a little bit better skid design that is not as likely to get caught on something and bent. The mounting points for the blades are different, you'll want to check out the pictures in the listing. Weight is about the same, physical dimensions are about the same. The DM has a stand, which keeps it at a better height for mounting. Both use 3 belts. Tensioning is easier on the DM from an accessibility standpoint, but similar in design.

 

[Z-Michigan]

After considering the various options, I decided to go with the Woodmaxx FM-78. Incidentally, my second call to Woodmaxx reached a different person (Jim) who was extremely helpful. I'm on the May-delivery backorder list and will probably have it by the first week of June. Once I have it I plan to do a detailed and occasionally updated thread so others have a reference. I will also compare it to my memory of the Caroni I previously had, as much as I can.

Incidentally, the people I spoke to at Tractor Tools Direct and Vrisimo were also extremely helpful.

 

[crreed67]

"In my opinion, the 'Flail' thread should be shut down and restarted. It is a behemouth which has lost its ability to actually impart knowledge. I've read it... and purchased a flail... and I'd STILL recommend locking it and beginning a new thread. About 1/2 of it is non-informational commenting and 500 pages of thread, sorting through that mess, is just not a reasonable endeavor any longer. I purchased mine at around page 250. I'd hate to try to read it now.

Its kind of like the Library of Congress... without a card catalog. The information is there... but almost impossible to find."



Definitely.

 

[Aaron L]

I'm sifting through the BIG flail thread now. Am at page 62. At that point (in 2008....Good Lord) a bunch of fellows had recently purchased various FM's. For now I'm plodding along........in hopes of seeing some long-term reviews of the various options. This is going to take a while...

 

[Fallon]

Same... want to hear some longterm reviews as well. My ancient Ford 917 flail is beatup & in need of retirement soonish.

 

[morgart40]

Any update on how you liked the Woodmaxx?

 

[Z-Michigan]

I'm still waiting to get it. Supposedly it should be here within a week... or something? My credit card has been charged so I certainly hope it arrives soon, otherwise I'll be making a call to Woodmaxx.

 

[gbw]

I'll be interested too, my tractor is a JD 4320 eHydro 48hp, love it. I use a 72" rotary cutter on about 25 acres mix woods / pasture, I hate the rotary cutter. Noisy, shaky, dangerous, fair cut at best, clumps everywhere.

I tried the huge flail thread but gave up. I seems to be in very good company.

Some basic specs for the Woodmaxx FM-78, Caroni TM1900bsc, and TTD T73:

All are about the same cutting width, 73-74".

Woodmaxx FM-78 is about 10% heavier, so on the surface seems somewhat 'heavier duty'.

But the Woodmaxx has 6 fewer shackle points (22 v. 28), so WM has 44 blades v. 56 blades for the Caroni TM1900BSC and TTD T73 (not counting center blade on the WM). Will this matter much in how smoothly the cut or how finely mulched the material is left?

The 'heavy duty commercial grade' TTD T73 weighs the same as the Caroni and has the same number of blades, 56.

The T73 costs nearly $1000 more delivered than the other 2 based on their ebay price. Hard to know what the extra money is buying.

All have 3 belts.

None of the models listed have hydraulic offset option, I can't use that feature anyhow.

'Quality'?? Who knows. Defined as conformance to requirements, I guess that's reliability, maintenance, cutting power/quality, and ease of use, to the extent those are quantifiable.
​

So, like many out there I'll e interested to learn of any actual experiences and impressions.

It IS interesting that at least 2 of the 3, Woodmaxx and Caroni, are not available now in stock. Could be for the T73 too, I'm not sure. Anyway, perhaps flail mowers are finally really catching on.

 

[leonz]

I'll be interested too, my tractor is a JD 4320 eHydro 48hp, love it. I use a 72" rotary cutter on about 25 acres mix woods / pasture, I hate the rotary cutter. Noisy, shaky, dangerous, fair cut at best, clumps everywhere.

I tried the huge flail thread but gave up. I seem to be in very good company.

Some basic specs for the Woodmaxx FM-78, Caroni TM1900bsc, and TTD T73:

All are about the same cutting width, 73-74".

Woodmaxx FM-78 is about 10% heavier, so on the surface seems somewhat 'heavier duty'.

But the Woodmaxx has 8 fewer shackle points, so WM has 44 blades v. 56 blades for the Caroni TM1900BSC and TTD T73 (not counting center blade on the WM). Will this matter much in how smoothly the cut or how finely mulched the material is left?

The 'heavy duty commercial grade' TTD T73 weighs the same as the Caroni and has the same number of blades, 56.

The T73 costs nearly $1000 more delivered than the other 2 based on their ebay price. Hard to know what the extra money is buying.

All have 3 belts.

None of the models listed have hydraulic offset option, I can't use that feature anyhow.

'Quality'?? Who knows. Defined as conformance to requirements, I guess that's reliability, maintenance, cutting power/quality, and ease of use, to the extent those are quantifiable.
​

So, like many out there I'll e interested to learn of any actual experiences and impressions.

It IS interesting that at least 2 of the 3, Woodmaxx and Caroni, are not available now in stock. Could be for the T73 too, I'm not sure. Anyway, perhaps flail mowers are finally really catching on.

====================================================================================================================================================================================================================================

Please read the entire flail mower thread you will be a better informed consumer of information regarding them.

My father used a Ford Jubilee to run his John Deere 25A finish flail mower installed with side slicer knives with a 7 foot cut to reclaim pasture with heavy brush and 12-15 foot golden rod so perhaps a JD290 or JD390 would be a better fit for you as your mule would have more than enough power. My father also kept his pasture mowed down to 2 inches during the mowing season where he mowed 4 acre blocks each time he mowed.

The JD290 or JD390 would handle what you have to mow with zero issues as your mule has plenty of horsepower for either finish flail mower.

I would suggest that you look at tractor house and other publications for flail mowers as many dealers sell new inventory across state lines using tractor house and other publications.

Municipal auctions are also a good place to purchase used flail mowers as these units only saw seasonal use. and can be purchased for much less money than new AND parts can be purchased locally. they also have many hours of use left in them before they need major work as they were only used seasonally.


There are a lot of municipal auctions in the summer months and flail most of the flail mowers put on the block are Alamos and have very low hours.

 

[Z-Michigan]

Looks like my Woodmaxx flail finally arrived at the local delivery point this afternoon. I'll be bringing it home tomorrow and will follow up with comments once I have it in use.