Adding Marine 2cycle oil to Diesel Fuel?

[RalphVa]

I second the notion about NOT using EP 90 gear oil. It's way too heavy to mix in properly and will likely leave some unburned carbon behind, if it doesn't gum things up first in not mixing properly.

If you happen to have some cheap or leftover transmission fluid, it can be added to diesel. TF is 5w oil and is sometimes a cut off the pipe stills that isn't captured from TF or lube oil and is diverted to the diesel pool. I had some leftover Mercon TF from when I had a Ford Ranger. Poured remaiins of a quart in my tractor tank and a whole unopened quart into the 240D tank.

Normally, you should use no additive for lubricity to ULSD. It isn't needed.

Ralph

 

[Todd_C]

RalphVA,

The reason that I made this post was because of a very informative post on diesel garage under the Ford Powerstroke 6.0. The post is over 34 pages and it includes several tests about adding lubrication to ULSD. According to the people on this site, new trucks (late 07>) does not need any additive to work properly; however, there are several complaints from users who are forced to use ULSD in an older truck. The older diesel engines were designed to operate higher amounts of sulfer. The current ULSD has about 15ppm compared to 500ppm just a few years ago.

I'm not advocating adding 2 cycle oil, but this post really did shine light on some of the aftermarket diesel additives. The data sheets for these products were examined and I was taken back by some the contents. It really is worth spending a few hours to read the entire post. Just google diesel garage.

 

[Skyco]

Normally, you should use no additive for lubricity to ULSD. It isn't needed.

Ralph

It shouldn't be needed if all of the ULSD met the standards. Unfortunately as pointed out in the well known Spicer test it doesn't.

 

[Diamondpilot]

Kind of off topic here but in the marine business we winterize boats by adding Marine 2 Cycle Oil to 4 stroke engines. What is in my MerCruiser Tech Manual for late model fuel injected motors, which are basically GM 305, 350, 383, 496, and 502 blocks or 4.3, 5.0, 5.7, and 8.1 liter engines.

What the manual says to do is disconnect the fuel line from the main boat tank and hook it to a portable tank with 1 gallon fresh fuel, 12.8 oz of 2 cycle oil, and the appropriate amount of fuel stabilizer. Run the engine for 10 minutes at no more than 1500 rpm then shut down. Change the fuel filter and fuel/water separator then reconnect the fuel line back to the main boat tank.

This has nothing to do with adding mpg ect but it show you it will do no harm and is a great way to store a engine. It coats all internal parts with this cocktail of 10:1 gas/oil mixture.

Chris

 

[mwb]

I posted this link before Lubricity Additive Study Results - Diesel Place

The nice thing about adding a little bio is that it is NOT considered to be an additive. Bio appears to be the most effective solution and it will not impact other additives you might want to use (anti-gel, cetane, etc) - no problem mixing medicines.

If you purchase B20 (20% bio / 80% dino) and add enough to your tank to make a 2-5% mix then you will not have any problems. New Ford trucks have a warning about using more than 5% - I am not aware of any other vehicle or engine that cannot run some bio.

I think Ford should be reprimanded for not allowing their customer to "go green" in the newer engines. I don't care if the OEM's say that their FI can handle low sulfer - that won't help you in 5 or 6 years when it is worn out. This is especially true for our tractors that we are hoping will last 20 - 50 years.

 

[Diamondpilot]

Its not just Ford not wanting more than 5%. I had a D-Max and in the manual it also stated not to use more than 5%.

Chris

 

[KML]

" I am not aware of any other vehicle or engine that cannot run some bio."

From John Deere:

John Deere Power Systems has a strong commitment to the environment, energy security, and technological advances that have a positive impact on both.

Biodiesel certainly meets these criteria. While B5 blends are preferred, biodiesel concentrations up to 20 percent (B20) blended in petroleum diesel fuel can be used in all John Deere engines certified up to Tier 3/Stage III A, as well as all non-emissions-certified engines, providing the biodiesel used in the fuel blend meets the standards set by the American Society of Testing Materials (ASTM) D6751.

We recognize the importance of biofuels to our customers and to the environment. Use of quality biodiesel in John Deere diesel engines has economic and environmental benefits, boosts development in rural areas, and helps provide energy security.

"John Deere was one of the first off-highway engine manufacturers to factory-fill biodiesel in North America, and we approved B5 biodiesel in 2001. Since then, John Deere has continued to conduct biodiesel research and has performed lab and field tests using biodiesel fuel. We have also developed a fuel conditioner that is recommended when using lower biodiesel blends and required when using B20 blends and above."
From Here:
What does biodiesel mean for John Deere engines?

John deere only recommended a max of B5 until very recently and still require an additive in the higher concentrations. Although Biodiesel adds lubricity to the fuel it brings with it other issues such as fuel system component compatability and fuel stability. Another issue that is the talk of the town here in corn country is the percieved or real concern about any particular bio diesel actually meeting ANY standard as early reports showed them to be "inconsistant" at best.

As far as adding 2 stroke oil I started doing it in my 1994 JD455 and it made a very noticable reduction in injector pump noise. I keep detailed hour/fuel usage logs because I'm funny like that and didn't see any impact on fuel consumption. My 2004 2210 shows no perceivable change but I still add 1oz/gal when I fill up. Kind of a better safe than sorry thing. I really don't see how it would hurt anything and it's cheap.

 

[mwb]

For clarification, in my previous post I was suggesting diluting B20 with regular dino diesel - you would end up with "B2" - "B5" depending on how much you mix. With this low of concentration there "shouldn't" be any problem with compatibility.

I know that Bio's are good system cleaners - including removing some rubber products (hoses, o-rings) but that is in a worst case senario (B20 - B100). The problems with the new Ford's, D-max are "probably" related more with other emission controls/sensors that are not compatible with Bio-exhaust (oxymoron?).

Anyway, if users are dumping 2-stroke, 90W, ATF, UTF and old engine oil in their tanks I think it would be safer and more cost effective to run 2% bio.

I like the term "bio-exhaust" - sounds like we want that. Wonder what the chemical structure of that would be. BioO2?

 

[Skyco]

Kind of off topic here but in the marine business we winterize boats by adding Marine 2 Cycle Oil to 4 stroke engines. What is in my MerCruiser Tech Manual for late model fuel injected motors, which are basically GM 305, 350, 383, 496, and 502 blocks or 4.3, 5.0, 5.7, and 8.1 liter engines.

What the manual says to do is disconnect the fuel line from the main boat tank and hook it to a portable tank with 1 gallon fresh fuel, 12.8 oz of 2 cycle oil, and the appropriate amount of fuel stabilizer. Run the engine for 10 minutes at no more than 1500 rpm then shut down. Change the fuel filter and fuel/water separator then reconnect the fuel line back to the main boat tank.

This has nothing to do with adding mpg ect but it show you it will do no harm and is a great way to store a engine. It coats all internal parts with this cocktail of 10:1 gas/oil mixture.

Chris

Do the marine engines have oxygen sensors and catalytic convertors?

 

[sw03]

before I dump any 2-cycle oil I want to ask a tribologists first. Outside of that, no way bud.