M59 Discussion Thread

[LarryRB]

the nut and bolt works great until you peen over the threads on the bolt, then it becomes time to cut the thing off. Been here and done that, and more than once. I found the washers stack works best..

 

[Charlesaf3]

Hmm, that's a good point. I'll see how this goes - grinding it off wouldn't be the end of the world. I did end up getting stainless and I'll put never seize on it, though with stainless so soft I'm not sure if that will make it better or worse.

 

[rScotty]

Yes, that quick change lynch pin is a Kubota oversight. I like our new M59 - and the more I use it the better it gets. Its far and away the best of its type. But that's not going to make me ignore Kubota's design oversights or mistakes.....or stop me from fixing the ones that need it.

First change was to raise the seat a couple of inches and rubber mount it. Much nicer and gives a tad more knee room past the fender. Now the clearance problem is my big feet. But measuring it tonight there seems to be some space available by lowering the walk-through plate. It's worth a look.

For the lynch pin replacement I'm going to use a bolt with a nylock nut. Nylocks don't need to be tightened against a surface in order to resist turning. Give it a try. Best case would be to use a bolt long enough to leave about an eight of an inch end play after it fills up the Nylock nut threads.

Chain hooks on the bucket are next on the list, followed by remounting the thumb control lever, some sound deadening for the hood & hood protector, and a look at the range shifter. Then wheel weights. I'd love to have a vertical exhaust stack, but am hoping that Kubota will come up with one as an option.
It is really satisfying to find things to customize on such a well-built machine.
rScotty

 

[LarryRB]

I have 12 and 24 inch buckets and for quite a while there, was changing them several times a day at my project at the time. After losing several lynch pins and bolting them,, fighting to get the bolts off, regardless of being bent and or threads peened over,, took way too much time..I started with the large washers,, after awhile, I have it down to a science with the washer stack and in the last 4 years have lost only one lynch pin. Our geology is heavy rock, and digging trenches and scraping along side of rock/boulders it is easy to lose a pin, from being worn through or most times simply lost,, This may not work for the rest of you and you may need to design something else, For me, the washer stack works and I like the KISS way to complete things,

 

[rScotty]

Hydraulics question.

On the m59 hydraulic pressure seems to climb all the way up to max RPM, so I end up running it around 2500 while using the hoe or Preseeder.

Is that everyone else's experience?

Our new M59 is still on break-in hours so I haven't run the motor up yet..... but that sounds pretty typical for a small open center type of hydraulic pump and system. I don't know if that is the system that the M59 uses because the factory and parts manuals are still on order. Does anyone have the books yet?

I'm guessing open center system because it is simple, inexpensive, efficient, and mostly adequate for low to medium pressure systems. Yes, I've noticed that my BH is slow at doing no-load cycles at idle RPMs and that sort of surprised me as it implies a low flow rate. But a higher flow rate would be a constant load on the system when driving around. Since I'm rarely in a hurry this system flow is likely more than I need. Of course for smooth low RPM flow the closed center type of system like John Deere uses is king. But it is expensive and complex. The advantage there is that the pressure is dependent on the load rather than on the RPM. And also that the closed center pump is not putting a constant horsepower load on the engine. Closed center damages your pocketbook, but only costs power when the hydraulics are being used. That is why the JD can get away with using such a high flow rate pump.

On previous tractors I've plumbed in a pressure gauge on a "tee" and watched the pressure change as the loader worked. It's interesting and also keeps me informed about the "health" of the hydraulic system. For our M59s I expect that the factory workshop manual will have a pressure/RPM spec that we can measure against.
rScotty

 

[Charlesaf3]

Our new M59 is still on break-in hours so I haven't run the motor up yet..... but that sounds pretty typical for a small open center type of hydraulic pump and system. I don't know if that is the system that the M59 uses because the factory and parts manuals are still on order. Does anyone have the books yet?

I'm guessing open center system because it is simple, inexpensive, efficient, and mostly adequate for low to medium pressure systems. Yes, I've noticed that my BH is slow at doing no-load cycles at idle RPMs and that sort of surprised me as it implies a low flow rate. But a higher flow rate would be a constant load on the system when driving around. Since I'm rarely in a hurry this system flow is likely more than I need. Of course for smooth low RPM flow the closed center type of system like John Deere uses is king. But it is expensive and complex. The advantage there is that the pressure is dependent on the load rather than on the RPM. And also that the closed center pump is not putting a constant horsepower load on the engine. Closed center damages your pocketbook, but only costs power when the hydraulics are being used. That is why the JD can get away with using such a high flow rate pump.

On previous tractors I've plumbed in a pressure gauge on a "tee" and watched the pressure change as the loader worked. It's interesting and also keeps me informed about the "health" of the hydraulic system. For our M59s I expect that the factory workshop manual will have a pressure/RPM spec that we can measure against.
rScotty

Scotty, you clearly have a much better technical understanding of this than I do! I'd love to hear your results if you slap a gauge on though, or if you come across the info.

As I understand it, the kubota design should be more fuel efficient? In that you only use high flow when you need it? I have found it to be a surprisingly fuel efficient tractor, though nothing like the b3030, which does not actually seem to consume any diesel.

 

[Charlesaf3]

Yes, that quick change lynch pin is a Kubota oversight. I like our new M59 - and the more I use it the better it gets. Its far and away the best of its type. But that's not going to make me ignore Kubota's design oversights or mistakes.....or stop me from fixing the ones that need it.

First change was to raise the seat a couple of inches and rubber mount it. Much nicer and gives a tad more knee room past the fender. Now the clearance problem is my big feet. But measuring it tonight there seems to be some space available by lowering the walk-through plate. It's worth a look.

For the lynch pin replacement I'm going to use a bolt with a nylock nut. Nylocks don't need to be tightened against a surface in order to resist turning. Give it a try. Best case would be to use a bolt long enough to leave about an eight of an inch end play after it fills up the Nylock nut threads.

Chain hooks on the bucket are next on the list, followed by remounting the thumb control lever, some sound deadening for the hood & hood protector, and a look at the range shifter. Then wheel weights. I'd love to have a vertical exhaust stack, but am hoping that Kubota will come up with one as an option.
It is really satisfying to find things to customize on such a well-built machine.
rScotty

Agreed. I think in this thread we are by nature going to focus on things that can be improved on the machine, but I should be clear that I think it's excellent, would buy it again, and would recommend the M59.

I did get a bolt and lock nut as you described. Got stainless and will put never seize on it. Also got 4 flat washers and a lock washer. Hopefully I won't have the peening larry describes. Though I also won't be changing buckets nearly as often!

Hooks on the bucket are key. I had messicks weld them on. 4 hooks on the 24, in a pattern rec'd on TBN. only 1 hook on the 12 - it needs two, as the direction always seems to be wrong.... I've already found a great deal of use for the hooks.

By remounting the thumb control lever, do you mean reversing it? Thats's on todays project list, actually. I'm going to reverse the hoses at the cylinder. Messicks put QCs on, as an aside, for running things off the thumb control in the future - I hope to put my hydraulic PHD out there.

I'd love a vertical stack! I saw someone on here rigged one up for a b3030, so hopefully someone will do it for the m59. Beyond my technical skills I fear.

What I do with the seat (I'm a big guy, 6'5, size 13 shoes) is tuck my feet up and spin. Its ok, better then the deere 110 by a long shot, but not ideal. I'd LOVE to see pics and info on how you altered your seat.

Its loud under the FOPS no doubt. I wear hearing protection.

Instead of wheel weights I foamed the tires. If you aren't transporting it, which I don't think you are, I'd really recommend some form of tire filling. Adds about a ton of weight, nice and low. I feel glued to the slopes, including some impressive ones.

 

[rScotty]

I did get a bolt and lock nut as you described. Got stainless and will put never seize on it.

I'd LOVE to see pics and info on how you altered your seat.

OK. In the hopes that they would be helpful I did take some pictures of the seat mount mod. It's pretty simple. THe 2x2 wood sections will probably get replaced with something nicer when I see if the height is right. The project was a bit rushed because my wife was impatient quit toying with the tractor so we could go out and DO SOMETHING WITH IT. - And so we did.... Laid some fieldstone steps up to the front porch using the backhoe and thumb. Back to the seat picture, the bolts should be 8-1.25 x 70 mm from the hardware store....Lowe's I think. The 3/4" rubber donuts are found between the cab and frame on most US pickups built in the last 50 years. The thin rubber washers are cut from any 1/8" rubber sheet - although I did see that Lowe's had those too.

Some suppliers aren't familiar with the special nylock nuts. They are about twice the thickness of a normal nut and look like an acorn nut. Trapped in the additional space is a threaded piece of nylon that is slightly undersize for that thread and so locks it. It doesn't require a locking washer.
rScotty

 

[rScotty]

"Hooks on the bucket are key.......4 hooks on the 24, in a pattern rec'd on TBN. ... I've already found a great deal of use for the hooks."

Oh, I didn't think of putting hooks on the BH bucket. Where? I use them on the front bucket a lot. That's where the first one's are going.

By re-mounting the thumb control I mean that I will move it up on the control column and work it with a lever. Kubota's ideas on foot controls seem to be made for someone else's feet. Plus their foot pedal just doesn't work very well. Is there enough flow through that thumb circuit to run a hydraulic PHD?

On flow: " As I understand it, the kubota design should be more fuel efficient? In that you only use high flow when you need it?"
No...sorry...because with open center you get more flow along with more RPM whether you need it or not....For example when you are driving down the road the tractor with an open center system is merrily pumping oil at full RPM and charging you energy for the useless work. The JD closed center pump first fills a reserve pressure tank and then sets the variable output hydraulic pump to idle until you call for it. If on the other hand you are stationary and using full hydraulic capacity the efficiencies are equal. When using less than full hydraulic flow capacity JD's closed center type is again more efficient. Credit where it is due... Because it doesn't have to run it all the time, the closed center system in a JD can afford to run a much larger hydraulic pump. It's simply a better system though much more expensive and elaborate. Tinkerers tend to prefer the Kubota open center type because it is easier to modify.
enjoy! rScotty

 

[rScotty]

I'd love a vertical stack! I saw someone on here rigged one up for a b3030, so hopefully someone will do it for the m59. Beyond my technical skills I fear.

Maybe Messick's would build a vertical stack for us? I'd bet you could sell one to almost every M59 owner out there. It is hard to figure out why Kubota made such a nice machine and then aimed the exhaust so that the operator has to perpetually be driving through a cloud of diesel fumes. This exhaust problem could benefit from some immediate factory attention. Most of the other things we discuss are really just matters of individual preference, but the exhaust pipe needs to be fixed.
rScotty