Clutch Repair Kama 554

   / Clutch Repair Kama 554 #101  
I see from this reply and your last one that you have no idea what I've done with the lubrication holes.
No intention to offend Rob, but that's what it looked and read like to me. Your mirror photo has grease that appears (at best) to be in close proximity to the race - if not in direct contact. And you clearly stated hopes of grease migrating into the bearings. Can't do that without first contacting the race.

//greg//
 
   / Clutch Repair Kama 554
  • Thread Starter
#102  
No intention to offend Rob, but that's what it looked and read like to me. Your mirror photo has grease that appears (at best) to be in close proximity to the race - if not in direct contact. And you clearly stated hopes of grease migrating into the bearings. Can't do that without first contacting the race.

//greg//
OK thank you, I'll give you that.
Perhaps I've not been clear enough about placement and my hopes.
The holes ARE up against the side of the bearing race but the race blocks a small part of each hole. The grease can only go up and over the race to find it's way to the gap between the ball bearings and race. You should know it's gonna find the path of least resistance and will no way get between the press fit if there is a lesser resistance path available. I'll let it rest at that.
Rob-
 
   / Clutch Repair Kama 554
  • Thread Starter
#103  
I was hoping you'd clear that up Tom, about the shielded bearing and the fully sealed ones with rubber or even plastic lip on them.

We think alike Larry.
I thought a lot about the "O" ring right there and decided to add an "O" ring groove ... a small one to keep it against the bearing. But in my haste to take these photos to show how the grease migrates and approaches the .020" gap, I forgot to add it.
Dang, now I have to remove it all and press that bearing off again.
Plus I get to deal with all that black graphite impregnated grease.
Thanks for reminding me.

I've got to turn up the clutch alignment tool this morning but first have to get my lathe set up.
*Yeah more set up work. Then I'll assemble the clutch pack on the bench like Greg suggested in his earlier posts. I guess after that it's time to get the tractor together?
Rob-
 
   / Clutch Repair Kama 554
  • Thread Starter
#104  
I got my lathe all set up and ran power to it. I started it up several times and ran the feeds back and forth lubing it all up. Then I chucked up the piece of aluminum I got to make the clutch alignment tool and was gonna cut it. I have to run a 10hp rotary 3 phase converter motor and the lathe is a 7-1/2hp motor so that's a lot of power consumption. What I didn't know was Loretta was doing a load of laundry and drying another in the electric dryer. I blew a fuse in the solar panel. Then I found out my solar guy has NOT wired up the generator by pass to the shop. So I couldn't cut anything today.

Now I have a couple questions.
Perhaps Chip or Tommy or Ronald can help with this or any of you guys who know. I want to set up the clutch on the bench like Tommy and Greg referred to.
First, there is a 105mm stack height called out in the manual. It is the dimension from the flywheel face to the top of the release fingers.
-How critical is that dimension?
The reason I ask is that I have to move my throw out bearing forward quite a bit, about .230" (5.8mm) from where it sits now. I can do that by adjusting the outside linkage. That puts the throw out bearing towards the end of the Support Tube(which it slides on) and part of the Sliding Seat leaves the Support Tube. It also would make the throw out bearing more "inside" the clutch pack. If I use the place where the throw out bearing sits now, with the outside linkage as is, I would have to make the stack height about 5.8mm taller than the 105mm called out in the book or 110.8mm stack.
Is this acceptable?
Or should I hold the 105mm as called out in the book? I know I can do that by adjusting the outside linkage, right?
But my question is which is better to do or does it really matter?

Second is how do you set the stack height on the bench.
My clutch pack has a gap in it where the Belleville type disc springs keep it open.
-Do I leave it relaxed and then set the stack height?
-Or do I compress the clutch pack together like it would be when bolted to the flywheel?
See these photos. First one is relaxed and second one has it clamped up. I suspended the clutch pack on 1-2-3 blocks from where the flange would seat against the flywheel.



Once I get the right way to do this, I will set each finger height by using gage blocks and a drop indicator to the high point on each finger. They should all come out within a thousands (.001" or .025mm) of each other this way.



If the clutch pack needs to be compressed like it would be when bolted to the flywheel, and if the stack height can vary from the 105mm book dimension, it is ready to bolt back onto the flywheel now. I set the 1.2mm PTO clutch gap and also took into account the 2mm gap between release fingers and throw out bearing (where it sits now).
Let me know which way to bench set it.
Thanks,
Rob-
 
   / Clutch Repair Kama 554 #105  
Hopefully that 6mm won't screw the pooch, but I think you should initially find enough adjustment in the clutch pull rod to set the gap between the release fingers and the bearing face. I just don't know how much that 6mm will affect the ability to subsequently adjust the gap if/when compensating for wear.

Start your stack height alignment by using the plywood as a flywheel simulator like I mentioned before. You need something with dimensions larger than the clutch pack itself. Place the PTO friction disc on the plywood. Set the clutchpack on the PTO disc. Align the friction discs circumferentially. The 1.2mm gap is for the main clutch discs. Do that first, then add the locking nuts.

The 105mm depth does not take into consideration the PTO friction disc. And this is not an exacting measurement either, so just add 10mm for the disc. That means you tighten the three black nuts on the fingers to achieve ~115mm between the top of the black nuts and the plywood. Again, this is not micrometer work. It's more important to get it symmetrical than it is to get it exact, which means you might end up with three slightly different measurements; let's say 115mm +/- 1 or 2.

But that's not the end. It's more critical that all three fingers contact the bearing face at the same time, so now you fine tune them. Technically, the black nut should be on the same plane as the finger tips. But if you'd prefer to measure 115mm from fingertips to plywood, that should work too. This is where you'll realize the +/- 1 or 2 aspect.

I then got out a 5"x5" piece of plexiglass and a 2' spirit level. Set the plexiglass (or equivalent) on the finger tips, and the level on the plexiglass. Check the bubble between each of the 3 fingers. One will likely be either high or low. Fine tune the fingers till you're within ~1/4 bubble on all three. Then add the locking nuts.

Once the tractor is reassembled, make the 3 external clutch linkage adjustments - which includes setting the gap between the finger tips and the bearing face.

//greg//
 
   / Clutch Repair Kama 554
  • Thread Starter
#106  
Thanks for the detailed response Greg.
To be sure I get the process correct I want to go over your instructions step by step.

1)Hopefully that 6mm won't screw the pooch, but I think you should initially find enough adjustment in the clutch pull rod to set the gap between the release fingers and the bearing face. I just don't know how much that 6mm will affect the ability to subsequently adjust the gap if/when compensating for wear.
-Ha, I didn't think about that.
-Should I go ahead and set the clutch Pack stack height to 105mm as per the manual then?
-What do the dealers recommend?

2)Start your stack height alignment by using the plywood as a flywheel simulator like I mentioned before. You need something with dimensions larger than the clutch pack itself. Place the PTO friction disc on the plywood. Set the clutchpack on the PTO disc. Align the friction discs circumferentially. The 1.2mm gap is for the main clutch discs. Do that first, then add the locking nuts.
-I have done this.
-I used a 1" thick hardened and surface ground flat steel plate instead of the plywood.
-I suspended the PTO clutch and remaining clutch pack on 1-2-3 blocks.
-Then set the 1.2mm gap.

3)The 105mm depth does not take into consideration the PTO friction disc. And this is not an exacting measurement either, so just add 10mm for the disc. That means you tighten the three black nuts on the fingers to achieve ~115mm between the top of the black nuts and the plywood. Again, this is not micrometer work. It's more important to get it symmetrical than it is to get it exact, which means you might end up with three slightly different measurements; let's say 115mm +/- 1 or 2.

4)But that's not the end. It's more critical that all three fingers contact the bearing face at the same time, so now you fine tune them. Technically, the black nut should be on the same plane as the finger tips. But if you'd prefer to measure 115mm from fingertips to plywood, that should work too. This is where you'll realize the +/- 1 or 2 aspect.

-I did that, from where the clutch pack would meet (be bolted to) the flywheel (no PTO clutch).
-I thought (from the drawing in the manual) that the 105mm dimension was to the top of the release fingers, not the black nuts?
-The dimension line goes through the black nut and over to the release finger tips (looks like it goes to nuts but does not).
-Next to the 105mm dimension there is the 2mm gap between the release finger tips and the face of the throw out bearing.
-Please check that in your Tractor Operation Manual and verify.
-Here is the drawing if you can view it.



5)I then got out a 5"x5" piece of plexiglass and a 2' spirit level. Set the plexiglass (or equivalent) on the finger tips, and the level on the plexiglass. Check the bubble between each of the 3 fingers. One will likely be either high or low. Fine tune the fingers till you're within ~1/4 bubble on all three. Then add the locking nuts.

-Instead of the using a bubble level, I accomplished this with a .001" drop indicator and used gage blocks to set all 3 tips within .001" of each other. They are dead nuts.



Once the tractor is reassembled, make the 3 external clutch linkage adjustments - which includes setting the gap between the finger tips and the bearing face.

-OK, got that.
-Tommy from Affordable told me I can measure from the bell housing to the throw out bearing face on the rear half. Then measure from the bell housing on the engine side to the flywheel. Subtracting the two would give me the distance between the two. Subtract the 2mm finger gap, and that's what to make the clutch pack finger release stack height on the bench. When the tractor is all bolted together, the finger gap should be 2mm.
-So I calculated that and set the stack height.

-BUT ... my question remains about setting the finger height on the bench.
-Clamped together or relaxed?
-The disc springs (behind the pressure plates) hold the clutch pack open. But when the clutch pack is bolted to the flywheel, the disc springs are compressed, right?
-To set the stack height, I don't know whether I should clamp the clutch pack to compress the disc springs or not.
-I figure I should since that's how it is on the flywheel, but I'm asking.

To summarize:
1) Should I use the 105mm stack height or is the 110.8mm OK?
2) Should the clutch pack be clamped on the bench or relaxed to get that stack height?
 
   / Clutch Repair Kama 554 #107  
From your photos, it certainly appears that we both have the same clutchpack. But the nature of some of your questions make me wonder now. What is your friction disc diameter? Mine's 280mm. And would you mind emailing me a photo of the flywheel?

It might provide justification to loosen and repeat the stack height adjustment here, on the chance that I can come up with a modified procedure to better conform with your configuration.

//greg//
 
   / Clutch Repair Kama 554 #108  
Hey Rob nice work, but more importantly how are you getting by with just one tractor.:D

Happy New Year


Shane
 
   / Clutch Repair Kama 554
  • Thread Starter
#109  
Hey Shane,
Happy New Year to you and yours too.
Getting along pretty good with Loretta's tractor. Had to load our firewood box with it. Also dragged the road a couple days ago after a storm.

Greg,
email with photo on the way.

Good news is I talked to Tommy at Affordable today.
He told me exactly what to do about the stack height when setting the clutch pack on the bench. It must be compressed.
I got the clutch alignment tool made this morning and installed the clutch. Also got the tractor bolted back together tonight.:) I need to do all the other connections yet.
I'll post the story and some photos in the morning...
Rob-
 
   / Clutch Repair Kama 554 #110  
I tend to agree with the compression, it's probably why I spent so much time balancing the black nut adjustments before. I've also responded to your email with a few more details. But I sent the email before reading this post, so most of it's now OBE

//greg//
 

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