hydrostatic transmission experts? 3000 series

   / hydrostatic transmission experts? 3000 series #11  
Mind you I haven't seen the transmission on the newer cubs.

On the 1250-1450-1650 Cubs, there is a slotted engagement device on the side of the transmission that is operated by a linkage to the hydro control lever. If the linkage or the engagement device is out of adjustment, it can reduce ground speed.

Thinking out loud here, if you aren't getting the factory speed you think you're supposed to get, is there the possibility that your linkage is misadjusted? Or maybe there is a piece of debris stuck in the mechanism somewhere that is causing it to not have the full range of travel it should have.

If there is a factory service manual for your machine, it should describe how to make the adjustment.
 
   / hydrostatic transmission experts? 3000 series #12  
Are you really that desperate for a bit more ground speed? Seriously - fiddling with the forward/rev linkage is one thing (I have done this) but mucking with RPM's, cracking open the tranny....IMHO if you really want fast mowing, you need to get a ZTR. Your are trying to make your machine do something it just was not designed to do....
 
   / hydrostatic transmission experts? 3000 series #13  
I stated this before; easiest way to increase speed; change tires to a larger diameter. Yours are 23 x 9.5? See what next size would be.
 
   / hydrostatic transmission experts? 3000 series #14  
wondering if it's possible to increase the forward speed by altering or making some kind of adjustments to the hydrostatic transmission.

First, I assume your machine uses a HST that is composed of a variable
displacement hyd pump (contolled externally with a lever to change the
position of the swash plate), and a fixed displacement hyd motor that drives
the rear wheels. So the only way to get higher HST output shaft speed
is more flow thru the motor. That means higher max flow from the pump,
or less internal leakage. You are stuck with these, I am afraid.

The other solutions posted are all EXTERNAL to the HST, but valid nonethe-
less. Higher engine speed will increase road speed a little bit, bigger
tires do that too, but at a cost of lower torque. Checking your linkages,
pedals, interlocks, etc is always good, too. Anything that keeps you from
moving the HST swash plate to MAX will rob you of speed.

You could also consider a new ring/pinion gear set for the final drive, if
one is made (unlikely).
 
   / hydrostatic transmission experts? 3000 series
  • Thread Starter
#15  
Mind you I haven't seen the transmission on the newer cubs.

On the 1250-1450-1650 Cubs, there is a slotted engagement device on the side of the transmission that is operated by a linkage to the hydro control lever. If the linkage or the engagement device is out of adjustment, it can reduce ground speed.

Thinking out loud here, if you aren't getting the factory speed you think you're supposed to get, is there the possibility that your linkage is misadjusted? Or maybe there is a piece of debris stuck in the mechanism somewhere that is causing it to not have the full range of travel it should have.

If there is a factory service manual for your machine, it should describe how to make the adjustment.

thanks 2manyrocks for your attention,
i tried adjusting the linkage but still wasn't getting the rated 8 mph (i got 7.1). does anyone know of a (bootleg) factory service manual on-line?
 
   / hydrostatic transmission experts? 3000 series
  • Thread Starter
#16  
Are you really that desperate for a bit more ground speed? Seriously - fiddling with the forward/rev linkage is one thing (I have done this) but mucking with RPM's, cracking open the tranny....IMHO if you really want fast mowing, you need to get a ZTR. Your are trying to make your machine do something it just was not designed to do....

yeah, i am really that desperate. (i owned a cub cadet 1864 which i hated with a PASSION for many years and i want this $6000 machine to function *completely* to my satisfaction). or i was going to sue cub cadet to give me my money back. using that 1864 was torture, now they must pay me back for that torture. for someone to suggest to me that i ought to sell my newly purchased $6000 3100 at what i'd assume would be a tremendous loss, and then to buy a ZTR is... silly. it would be great to have 10 mph mowing, but i already own this machine and don't want to take the loss in selling it, i'm not asking for 8 mph *mowing*, you got that right? all i can expect is the rated 8 mph so i can zip quickly through the areas in my lawn where the grass grows slowly or to zip (at the full 8 mph) between mowing tasks, i don't want a "consumer grade" artificial limitation on the traveling speed, i got the top of the line 3100 so i woudn't have to muck around with the artificial dumba$$ "consumer grade" limitations. would you like to buy my brand new 3100 at the price i paid for it? my machine was, apparently, designed to go 8 mph, at least that's what's in writing on their specs, if that's a lie just for marketing i want to sue them, that's kinda like fraud, don't you think? i asked the dealer BEFORE i plunked down my six grand, kinda half jokingly, "do you have a "try it before you buy it program?" he said, NOT jokingly, deadpan, "NO".
 
   / hydrostatic transmission experts? 3000 series
  • Thread Starter
#17  
I stated this before; easiest way to increase speed; change tires to a larger diameter. Yours are 23 x 9.5? See what next size would be.

thanks dqdave, i stated before i don't want to do that. i want the factory to live up to their printed specs.
 
   / hydrostatic transmission experts? 3000 series
  • Thread Starter
#18  
First, I assume your machine uses a HST that is composed of a variable
displacement hyd pump (contolled externally with a lever to change the
position of the swash plate), and a fixed displacement hyd motor that drives
the rear wheels. So the only way to get higher HST output shaft speed
is more flow thru the motor. That means higher max flow from the pump,
or less internal leakage. You are stuck with these, I am afraid.

The other solutions posted are all EXTERNAL to the HST, but valid nonethe-
less. Higher engine speed will increase road speed a little bit, bigger
tires do that too, but at a cost of lower torque. Checking your linkages,
pedals, interlocks, etc is always good, too. Anything that keeps you from
moving the HST swash plate to MAX will rob you of speed.

You could also consider a new ring/pinion gear set for the final drive, if
one is made (unlikely).

thanks dfkrug,
yeah, i'm coming to accept there's nothing that can be done with the HST. i tried to find an aftermarket ring/pinion but couldn't. i'm sure it would be an astronomical cost and probably even risky to use if i were to have 'em made. would be nice though. i want to be able to smoke the tires to show off for the neighbor kid (i'm joking).
i didn't have a tachometer. i took the mower into the dealer (after a little back and forth on the phone)(just a little though) and he raised the rpms from what he said was 3200 to the acceptable 3600, i even had him SHOW me the tach readout. he also adjusted the linkage, again, after i'd adjusted the linkage. i noticed the machine whined with the brake on and it creeped EVER SO SLOWLY forward at full throttle and pedals at neutral. the mechanic was going to re-adjust it for me but i insisted it was ok. he and i both thought it was creeping only because it was cold (southeast new york state). i told him i'm not going to be cutting my grass in the winter and was sure that in the summer the oil would already be warm enough so the machine would sit still without having the brake engaged.
what a relief! (i rode around in the parking lot with a GPS and clocked it at around 8 mph, 7.9, 8.1, etc. i was enormously relieved! i was SO afraid this was going to be a huge hassle with the factory, i was sure this was the beginning of a huge dickaround and i was going to have to end up suing the ba$tards. (i've gotten so many screwjobs before and i'm tired of it, time for me to take a stand) i gave the mechanic in the shop a $20 tip. i think i prolly shoulda put that 20 toward buying a tach though so i could've done the entire job myself, not troubled the dealer and y'all.
bigger tires would've cost me money, not covered under waranty, didn't want to spend money out of my own pocket to bring this machine up to the written factory specs after spending six grand.
what i was afraid of was the dealer was in cohoots with the factory and they were going to crank my rpm's up to 4000 to stick it to me, "we'll get this troublemaker's travel speed up to 8 mph, and we'll ruin his engine in the process, BWAHAHAHA!"
 
   / hydrostatic transmission experts? 3000 series
  • Thread Starter
#19  
one more thing.
there are (at least) 10 things i DO NOT like about this machine. things i figured i'd take care of myself or just have to live with. this 8 mph travel speed was the one i DID NOT want to compromise on.

1. the specialized bolts that hold the height adjustment wheels in position fell out only a couple hours after I got the machine. I was outraged. After the torture of using that model 1864 for years and years I wanted this brand new $6000 machine to be trouble free for years. I was in a huge rush to get the grass cut and ended up having to fashion the (specialized) bolts myself to get the job done. The dealer sent me the bolts a week or so later. That was number one. Ok. No biggie.

2. even when I picked it up at the dealer I HATED that the throttle lever would engage the engine at the halfway point in itç—´ travel. That totally bugged me. I didn稚 say anything at the time because I didn稚 want to be a pest, so I just ate it. But it bugged me enough that I spent HOURS of fiddling around with it to try to figure out how to get the throttle lever to start raising the engine speed as soon as the lever is adjusted. I was overjoyed when I did figure it out. It was a problem that I took care of myself. Oh, I asked about it at the dealer and I was told thatç—´ the way theyæ±*e making/selling them now, for dumb consumers who don稚 run the throttle at full speed while cutting the grass. I found that offensive.

3. the �it and finish of the machine was, I my opinion, awful. The hood was badly misaligned. Again, I didn稚 want to come across as a ******** at the dealer when I picked it up and I just told myself that was something I could take care of myself at home. I did try to adjust it, and I had some limited success, still not perfect, but better than it was. It was designed so there would地t be metal to metal contact but my hood DID rub metal to metal and it was painful to see the damage it was doing to itself.
4. the seat height. The seat is WAY too high. Apparently they designed a little plastic storage compartment under the seat but that makes the seat sit up ridiculously high. It sucks when youæ±*e mowing the grass and you need to/want to bend over to pick up a branch or some other obstruction. Funny thing, when I mentioned this to the mechanic I was pretty darn surprised he agreed with me! I am in the process of custom fabricating a steel hinge joint thing to remove/replace the plastic storage container thing to get the seat height lower by 2 or so inches. The seat height thing was actually a big part of the reason I delayed purchasing this 3100 by a couple years. When I first saw the 3100, soon after it first came out, I thought the seat height was ridiculous.

I知 writing these 10 items to let you know why I知 so stuck on getting the stated 8 mph. there are already 10 things about this mower I don稚 like, the 12th is the speed, that I知 not going to compromise about.

5. my superduper cub cadet engine oil plug started leaking after 25 hours of use. I was, well, at that point I wasn稚 as outraged as when the bolts fell out of the mower deck (which I was LUCKY to have noticed, if not I probably would致e damaged the mower deck and wonder if they壇 call that é›»eliberate mis-use and would致e had to pay for the repairs myself) I wasn稚 outraged at that point figuring I got a å¾’it instead of a real lawnmower. ç™»k, so thereç—´ going to be some stuff I知 going to have to work on myself with this lawnmower sorry, I知 paranoid. This I also figured was some kind of scam the factory worked out after 60 years of selling lawnmowers. I figured if they installed a handy dandy plastic oil drain plug it must be because they were hoping to get unwary consumers to seize up their engines due to 渡egligence 努e told you youæ±*e supposed to check your oil before EVERY use? I figured this is how they get you to buy a replacement engine for your 25 hour lawn and garden tractor. No, I wouldn稚致e noticed the oil was leaking except that I壇 put it in the garage for the winter and it was sitting in one place for 2 months, and I DON探 check the oil before every use. Usually if thereç—´ a puddle of oil under the tractor, after several hundred hours of use, I値l be like ç™»h, I have an oil leak? The handy dandy plastic oil drain plug SUCKS and is defective. I hope cub cadet gets MANY class action lawsuits over that one. I welded up a 90 degree elbow out of ï½½ inch black pipe and screwed it in.

6. the miniscule microscopic hour meter ssssuuu---ckkkss! Almost impossible to read. At 49 my eyesight is starting to fade but I believe even if I WAS at this point used to having a pair of reading glasses on me at all times I STILL wouldn稚 be able to read that hourmeter. It痴 way too small. It痴 completely un-illuminated. When I back my 3100 into the garage and get out my notepad to record the hours I ran cutting the grass I CANNOT read it and have to drive it back out into the daylight in order to read it. That or get out a flashlight to read it. It痴 WAY too small and WAY too un-illuminated. This is another thing that I was quite astonished when I mentioned it to the mechanic at the dealership he agreed with me on!!! He told me his theory (something like, I can稚 remember exactly what he said) is that cub cadet got hoodwinked into a huge purchase of these hourmeters and had to use 粗m up somehow.

7. when I picked up this machine at the dealer he told me I have to jack up the tractor to put in and take out the mower deck. I NEVER had to jack up any of the previous lawn mowers I致e owned/operated to put on or take off the deck. I知 like, 登k, so, something I値l just have to live with.

8. the deck only raises and lowers about an inch. Maybe max 2 inches. I知 like 努hy even bother installing all that expensive hydraulics if the mower deck only goes up and down one inch入! it痴 absurd. And the mechanic at the dealership agreed with me on that one too. He explained with the 52 inch deck you only get 1 inch of raise/lower. Sucks. Oh well, another thing I値l just have to live with. That one inch DOES help me get un-stuck if I get stuck on wet grass on the side of a hill. Still not what someone would think a mower deck ought to raise up to though. (say, if you get it into a bigger jam where you need the deck to go up more, like the time I got it stuck in a gully and had to PUSH it out.)

9. the 途everse caution mode is utterly ridiculous and a huge hassle. When I was in the showroom the dealer explained to me what it was when I asked and I commented 努ow, that seems like a hassle and he said it wasn稚 a hassle, to me it seemed like he was even a little offended I suggested it might BE a hassle, I was shocked. I think either he doesn稚 cut his own grass or he doesn稚 use a 3100 because it IS a HUGE hassle. Several times while I知 cutting my grass I have to **** around with that feature. Luckily it痴 easily disabled. Weee! I壇 imagine if you had a perfectly flat perfect square perfectly clear of obstructions (trees, fallen branches, etc.) the 途everse caution mode would be no hassle at all, but on my lawn i知 CONSTANTLY having to engage, re-engage it. It ssssuuuucccckkkksss. I disabled it.

10. I don稚 like that I have to take my foot off the forward pedal and put it onto the reverse pedal to move in reverse and then take my foot off the reverse pedal and put back onto the forward pedal to go back forward. It痴 SO unlike my automobile it痴 very difficult to get used to, and I haven稚 used this tractor often enough TO get used to it. I like MUCH better the forward/reverse actuator pedal on my old BOLENS tractor, didn稚 have to take your foot off the pedal to go from forward to reverse. This is another item I知 assuming is designed for a dumb consumer, to prevent the consumer from ramming it into forward then ramming it into reverse then ramming it back into forward. I suspect the designers wanted to create a built in pause between forward and reverse. This is again where the cub cadet design engineers are getting between me and me getting my grass cut. In a hurry. Can稚 change it, have to live with it.

11. I HATE that I cannot turn off the headlights. That makes no sense to me. The only reason I can imagine they designed it that way is so they could save money on putting in a on/off switch and the added complexity of installing the wiring harness at the factory. It sssuuuccckkksss. In my life I致e been in situations where I had a weak battery and getting on with things hinged on keeping the headlights turned off. I can see no reason why a LAWNMOWER needs to have it痴 headlights on CONSTANTLY. But, ok, this is something, HOPEFULLY I can change. Cut in a on/off switch and drill a hole for it in the dash.

12. oh, the seat safety interlock switch. This is a universal gripe with all riding lawnmowers, not specific to cub cadet. This I already disabled. Thank god. On the 3100 itç—´ easy to disable and the machine can still be safely used. On the 1864, because it was designed poorly (with a hand actuated forward/reverse motion lever) I dared NOT disable the seat switch. One time I was mowing under a low hanging branch uphill, wasn稚 able to move out of the way quickly enough from the branch and at that point the handle became inaccessible to me (because I was being pushed off/over the back of the seat) at that point I realized I DARED not EVER disable the seat safety interlock on the 1864, it was absolutely crucial to the safe operation of this dangerous unsafe tractor. The mower would致e simply continued on after the branch pushed/knocked me backwards over/out of the seat. On the BOLENS if you take your foot off (say if youæ±*e being knocked off the tractor by a low hanging branch) the mower simply stops moving. After that incident I came to feel the 1864 was of faulty design, was a dangerous machine to operate, it wanted to do me bodily harm. I hold a grudge against the 1864, but not simply for that one incident/trait, multiple other incidents/attributes. The only reason I could think of cub cadet designed a lawn mower with a hand actuated forward/reverse lever would be because it was more expensive to put a foot pedal on it, or itç—´ designed for paraplegics, of which I imagine the market is pretty small. What an awful design. Or, again, if you have a perfectly flat, square, free of obstructions lawn, maybe then itç—´ good. It sucked that I couldn稚 modulate the speed while I was turning a corner (because my hands were occupied with turning the super low gear ratio steering wheel) and it SUCKED I wasn稚 able to carry/hold anything in my hands while cutting the grass and still be able to steer and modulate the forward/reverse speed (for example, picking up a fallen branch from the yard and ferrying it over to my brush pile). What a sucky design. So, thatç—´ 12 things on my list of 10 things I don稚 like about this 3100, and thatç—´ why I was SO fed up with having to å…Žat it with any aspect of a cub cadet product. Not willing to compromise at all with this 8 mph thing. So there. Thereç—´ probably even a couple more things about the 3100 that I don稚 like that I知 forgetting. Thing is, save the 8 mile per hour thing, I LOVE this tractor, itç—´ SSSSSOOOO MUCH better than the 1864 I知 in heaven when I知 using it, even WITH all the things I don稚 like about it.
 
   / hydrostatic transmission experts? 3000 series #20  
WILLIAM, I think it is reasonable to expect the travel speed promised, esp
since you are mowing large areas. 8 MPH is not very fast after all.

Since you mention it, does the machine travel a little faster when the
hyd oil is cold? If the oil is cold and there is less internal HST leakage
due to the oil being a bit thicker.....this makes a case for using a higher
viscosity hyd oil. It might only add a few tenths MPH, however.

RE HST drive control pedals, the same issue applies to larger compact
utility tractors. Rocker pedal vs. 2-pedal.....its what you get used to.

What kind of engine does that machine have?
 

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