R1 versus R4

[Builder]

This is just plain wrong.

It's really sad when someone has put down everyone else's choices because they don't match their own.

I did not get R4's because they "look good", when I ordered my tractor brand new my dealer said which tires do you want, R1 (Ag) R4 (Industrial) or R3 (Turf), either choice was the same price. I wanted good traction for snowblowing and excavating my back yard which is wet and muddy but also wanted something that wouldn't tear up my lawn and rode smooth on pavement.

The R1's have good traction but they tear up grass and ride rough on pave and I tried a similar tractor with R1's at the dealer to confirm this before deciding. The R3's were smooth on pave and easy on grass but did not have good traction in mud and snow. The R4 Industrial tires were a perfect medium and I am very happy with them. I have gone through mud deep enough to drag the undercarriage through and snow blow up hill in reverse through snow heavy and deep and have NEVER been stuck. I would buy these tires again in a heartbeat. All four tires are loaded so that helps with traction too.

Ain't that the truth. Sure we all have brand preferences, but to put another's tire choice down to the point that their only virtue is they "look good" is just silly.

Like I'm going to buy a tire for a machine I will be using to provide for my family because "it looks good". There ya go.

 

[harpoonalt]

I had almost forgot about this thread, but there are 2 dogs tugging on an old towel out front and that reminded me to check back in. Asking about tires is like the Kubota vs JD. Buy what I have, 'cause it's the best. Get whatever makes sense to you and adjust as you go. Or be smart and buy 3 tractors with 3 sets of tires and not have to worry..................Hey, one dog just got the towel........kinda looking stupid sitting there with that old towel now, but he's happy!

 

[Builder]

No, it is not nailed by oversimplifying. Sure a heavier tractor has more traction, but not in greater proportion to its weight than does a lighter one. Absent true penetration and interlock with the surface, traction force is just the coefficient of friction times the weight. A small benefit also comes from more rubber in contact, but this is miniscule unless an advantage is taken with the higher contact tire by using a softer rubber. The R4, with hi tread area, is not set up to apply intense areas of down pressure to force into and interlock with the surface. This interlock gives the R1 the advantage on all consolidated surfaces that are not ultrahard. On softer consolidated surfaces the advantage swings further in favor of the R1 because of the directional tread. The shape of the tread causes rearward force to try to move dirt rearward and outward from the tire centerline. This effectively uses a larger area than the tire footprint for tractive force since outward flow of dirt is resisted by the dirt to each side of the tire. So the initial advantage of better interlock with the dirt is augmented as the tire creeps, and maintained and as the R1 tire begins to slip. At this point the R4 traction is dying and the R1 is maintaining... self cleaning, taking new bites and jamming them back and outward. --- Now, backing up R1s have no advantage. And on unconsolidated surface like sand and gravel the smooth hi area tread of the R4 will usually do a little better.
larry

You can try to throw all the coefficients & diagonals you want at me. I'm no scientist like you, I just use 2 machines, a dumptruck a pickup and a couple trailers to make a living. You still have me laughing about the "Construction sites rarely require max traction" comment. It did bring a little levity to the jobsite this morning.....

R-4's get the job done very well in situations from hard pavement to mud on top of frost. R-1's are impractical on construction equipment because they're too narrow and too succeptible to damage on tougher construction site conditions.

If I were farming, I'd have R-1's, R-4's don't have enough bar height to paddle through deep soft dirt.

If I were maintaining large expanses of lawn I'd be on Turfs. R-1's & R-4's would damage the lawn surfaces.

Tire choice is different for everyone based on what they will be doing with the tractor. Mowing my yard I get along great with turf tires. I wouldn't want to do dirt work with them. R 1's work great for the field type work I do but they sure tear up my yard I wouldn't want to mow with them. I feel that the R4's are a happy medium for all types of work. Decide what you are going to be doing mostly with your tractor and get the tire that is best suited for your needs. What works for me may not be what is best for you. I have turf tires for lawn mowing and R1's for all the other work I do.

well said. The R-1 guys that think all other tire choices are bad or are "just for looks" need to understand this. No tire is "better" than the other, they were designed for different tasks.

 

[MossRoad]

I know for a fact that R4s work well in mud otherwise most construction machinery would have R1s.

Maybe you should re-think that.

You could have just as easily said "I know for a fact that R1s work well in mud other wise most farm machinery would have R4s. "

The reason most construction machinery has R4s is because they can carry more weight and are less likely to get torn up from debris than R1s, not because they have better traction than R1s... they don't. R1s give superior traction to R4s.

 

[MossRoad]

... R-4's don't have enough bar height to paddle through deep soft dirt.

Must be poor operator skills!

Hey, that's what you told me when I said R4s wouldn't work on our machine in our soils. Hmmmm.... working both sides of the debate now?

 

[Builder]

Maybe you should re-think that.

The reason most construction machinery has R4s is because they can carry more weight and are less likely to get torn up from debris than R1s, not because they have better traction than R1s... they don't. R1s give superior traction to R4s.

And I have mentioned that in previous posts like RIGHT HERE:

"R-1's are impractical on construction equipment because they're too narrow and too succeptible to damage on tougher construction site conditions. "

Maybe you forgot to read that.

 

[Builder]

Must be poor operator skills!

Hey, that's what you told me when I said R4s wouldn't work on our machine in our soils. Hmmmm.... working both sides of the debate now?

I'm not working both sides of anything.

That comment had nothing to do with operator skills, just not enough rubber to form a paddle to get though soft dirt. It's pretty common knowledge that R-1's are what 90% of farmers use for the exact reason I said- more rubber paddle to move through soft dirt.

 

[MossRoad]

I'm not working both sides of anything.

That comment had nothing to do with operator skills, just not enough rubber to form a paddle to get though soft dirt.

Your position on this issue is losing traction, so to speak.

 

[MossRoad]

And I have mentioned that in previous posts like RIGHT HERE:


Maybe you forgot to read that.

I wasn't talking to you, but nice of you to reply anyway.

 

[Builder]

I wasn't talking to you, but nice of you to reply anyway.

I'm addressing an observation you are making. Makes no difference who you quoted.