Hydraulic Pump Dead?

[Iplayfarmer]

I went out to move some snow yesterday afternoon. It has been below zero for a week or so, and it finally warmed up to 25 degrees. The tractor fired right up, but I had nothing for hydraulics.

I've started this little Massey 1215 in sub zero temperatures before. The hydraulics are sluggish at first in cold temps, but there's at least something. This time there was nothing. I checked the fluid...it was fine. I let the tractor run for a few minutes just to top of the battery, etc., and still nothing. The hydro transmission works; but the loader, power steering, and 3 pt. are dead.

Last time I used it was about 3 weeks ago, and everything worked fine.

I plowed the snow with the 4-wheeler. I won't be able to do anything with the tractor until at least Wednesday.

What's the worst case scenario?

 

[kennyd]

Worst:
You pump is dead...

Probable:
You have moisture in your fluid and it is frozen.

Why not post this in the hydraulics forum?

 

[J_J]

Iplayfarmer,

Can you tell if the pump is turning at all. It may have twisted the shaft off if it was frozen. Do you have any leaks around the pump?

 

[Hooked_on_HP]

I agree with Kenny. Ice in the hyd system. Get it thawed and change the fluid and filter.
Bill

 

[Soundguy]

that or loss of prime from an air leak / shrunk oring.

soundguy

 

[Wayne County Hose]

Water is heavier than oil and will sink to the bottom of your tank, that's where the suction hose for your pump connects. If there's ice in the tank, you ain't sucking no oil. Without some help, it will take a while to thaw the ice out. Try removing the drain plug from the tank. If nothing comes out, there ya' go.

 

[J_J]

Water is heavier than oil and will sink to the bottom of your tank, that's where the suction hose for your pump connects. If there's ice in the tank, you ain't sucking no oil. Without some help, it will take a while to thaw the ice out. Try removing the drain plug from the tank. If nothing comes out, there ya' go.

For obvious reasons, I am going to disagree with most of the above. Most hyd fluid has detergents in them and as such, any water that gets in the hydraulic fluid may go to the bottom, but as soon as the water/fluid is sucked up and blended by the pump, you now have a new combination of water/fluid mix. I do agree that if you pour a pint of water in a tank of hyd fluid, the water, being heavier than hyd fluid will go to the bottom. That water will probably freeze at 32 degrees, but after being mixed, who knows. Maybe hyd fluid with ice crystals in it.

The suction outlet to my pump is about 3 in off the bottom for obvious reasons. If there is water there, you do not want it in the system. You also do not want to suck up any crud off the bottom of the tank/reservoir.

I would say that the cleanest tank/reservoir would be the hyd system with a return line filter, and a filtered filler cap.

 

[Wayne County Hose]

For obvious reasons, I am going to disagree with most of the above. Most hyd fluid has detergents in them and as such, any water that gets in the hydraulic fluid may go to the bottom, but as soon as the water/fluid is sucked up and blended by the pump, you now have a new combination of water/fluid mix. I do agree that if you pour a pint of water in a tank of hyd fluid, the water, being heavier than hyd fluid will go to the bottom. That water will probably freeze at 32 degrees, but after being mixed, who knows. Maybe hyd fluid with ice crystals in it.

The suction outlet to my pump is about 3 in off the bottom for obvious reasons. If there is water there, you do not want it in the system. You also do not want to suck up any crud off the bottom of the tank/reservoir.

I would say that the cleanest tank/reservoir would be the hyd system with a return line filter, and a filtered filler cap.

Gotta love these guys that follow me around and look for any reason to contradict me.
Didn't disagree with anyone else that said it froze up, just me. Didn't post anything about disagreeing with the concept until I posted. Please, get a life.

 

[Soundguy]

the water and oil will mix into an emulsion once it makes it thru the pump.. much of that emulsion will be 'stabil'.. but after setting, some of the water will fall out. An easy test it to check the dipstick to look for the telltale milkshake look.. or to pull the drain plug and unscrew just a hair to see if a few drips of water seep out before oil starts coming out... pretty common check...

ditto on the filters.. clean is best..

soundguy

 

[oildoc]

Whatever you do, don't run the tractor anymore. If your pump is getting no oil to the suction (for whatever reason) running it without oil will burn it up. That being said, it's possible you could have water in your oil, although it would take a fair amount to actually freeze up the suction. If there is water in it, you may have a relief valve that's frozen in the cracked position and causing bypass. That much water will expand and can easily offset springs. Your cheapest bet is to tow it into a heated shop and warm it up for a few days. Then start poking around. See if your getting any return oil from the main valve. if so the valve is bypassing oil and you need to look at your relief.

Many hydraulic systems have suction screens if you have any moisture in the oil and all tractors have varrying degrees no matter how often you change the oil due to thermal gain and loss thus condensation. This moisture will form into icy particles and can clog an inlet screen and if there are enough (you'd need a bunch of moisture) can clog an inlet without a screen.

Good luck.