DOT and non comercial traffic

[sandman2234]

Stand corrected, should have read the durn thing.... instead of just "assuming" it matched Florida law.
David from jax

 

[Duffster]

Stand corrected, should have read the durn thing.... instead of just "assuming" it matched Florida law.
David from jax

NY does match Florida law.............and every other state when it comes to air brakes.

 

[Kaliburz]

I just sped read most of the pages, stopped about page 12....so...

If I recall, a CDL is not needed for ag here in WA. BUT, it changed or now they are enforcing the rules more. If your farm tagged truck (be it straight truck or semi) is over 40,000 GVWR, they want a CDL. Under 40,000, you are fine following the farm rules. But more and more farms are using semi's.....

Last year, they required US DOT numbers for intra-state trucks here in in WA (if I got my term right, even trucks that just stay in WA need a US DOT number!) for the first time.

I have mixed feelings about this whole mess. A friend who works for the city says that a driver who had a Class B for driving city dump trucks needed to upgrade his license to a Class A just to tow a trailer behind the dump truck! When I think of Class A, I think of a semi truck....

Soon they will be telling people w/ 1/2 ton pickups towing a car trailer they'll need CDL's no matter what. Even if it's private. I think it's all about $$$$$. The more endorsements on your license, the more it cost at renewal.

I mean, I've seen in spec sheets that a 1/2 ton w/ a 3.55 axle had less GCWR vs a 1/2 w/ a 4.10 (yes, I've seen them). But I'm sure that the brakes of the 3.55 vs the 4.10 axle are the same. Also, how do they know your ratings? The GCWR usually isn't posted on a 1/2 ton truck (or even 3/4 ton). Heck, I've got an old 1 1/2 truck (1950 GMC) that has the GVWR of 14,000lbs and a GCWR of 24,000lbs and it's on the plate.

I have a semi and I have a Class B license. I need to get my Class A since even if I use it for farm use- at least that's what I was told. It's just a license upgrade (and test, yes, more money to the state).

Oh, and the other day, I saw a Volvo single axle semi truck pulling a 5th wheel RV. Right on the side was "NOT FOR HIRE". More and more people are buying used semi's to tow their RV's. A used late model semi (the one I saw even had a sleeper on it!!!!) can be bought for $10-15,000 (well under $20,000) and it will have more capacity then 1 ton pickup (ie F350) or the "new" F450 ratings.... The thing is made to tow 105,500 lbs and run for nearly 500,000 miles with not much issues. A used one that's been keep up and goes into service towing a 15,000 RV 5th wheel.... that's hardly breaking a sweat for that truck....

 

[sandman2234]

I have known for a long time that it is "about the money"...and they just keep on spending more, and looking for more ways to get more to spend. Somethings gotta end this mess we're in.
David from jax

 

[brokenot]

A friend who works for the city says that a driver who had a Class B for driving city dump trucks needed to upgrade his license to a Class A just to tow a trailer behind the dump truck

I'm curious as to why this seems unusual to anyone. If he wasn't previously towing a trailer in excess of 10,000 lbs. behind the dump truck, he was able to operate with a Class B license. Now that he is towing a trailer behind the dump truck that will likely exceed the 10,000 lb. limit, a Class A endorsement is required. It seems perfectly logical to require the *higher* license standard as the combination vehicle reaches a *higher* gross weight.

Or am I missing something?

The Federal standard requires States to issue a CDL to drivers according to the following license classifications:

Class A -- Any combination of vehicles with a GCWR of 26,001 or more pounds provided the GVWR of the vehicle(s) being towed is in excess of 10,000 pounds.

Class B -- Any single vehicle with a GVWR of 26,001 or more pounds, or any such vehicle towing a vehicle not in excess of 10,000 pounds GVWR.

 

[Soundguy]

Soon they will be telling people w/ 1/2 ton pickups towing a car trailer they'll need CDL's no matter what. Even if it's private. I think it's all about $$$$$. The more endorsements on your license, the more it cost at renewal.
.

I'd agree.

nowadays I feel most things the government does is about money, perpetuating their own power, and reigning in citizen rights.. IE.. restricting them as much as possible and still trying to get under the radar. very seldom do I see real true altruism for the sale of safety when a piece of government paper gets issued.

soundguy

 

[Kaliburz]

Here's another thing.....

When the DOT rules were made, what year was it? And at that time, what was the average size trailer of pickups? I'm sure that everyone used 1/2 ton and 3/4 ton trucks. But I'm sure that people with 3/4 and 1 tons were farms and commercial folks. Not the person with the pickup truck being used as a car. In my humble opinion, 10,000lbs is light now a days- especially with the ability of the pickups and trucks. But say 30-35 years ago....

 

[FlaDon]

Here's another thing.....

When the DOT rules were made, what year was it? And at that time, what was the average size trailer of pickups? I'm sure that everyone used 1/2 ton and 3/4 ton trucks. But I'm sure that people with 3/4 and 1 tons were farms and commercial folks. Not the person with the pickup truck being used as a car. In my humble opinion, 10,000lbs is light now a days- especially with the ability of the pickups and trucks. But say 30-35 years ago....

Law for CDLs started in 1986. Mandated that they be had by 4/1/1992. And watch out, there's more fun coming on 1/30/2012.

THE STATES

Certifications and Record checks:

When an individual applies for a CDL, or attempts to renew or update his or her CDL, the State must perform a check of its own database, the Commercial Driver's License Information System (CDLIS), and the National Driver Register (NDR), to ensure the driver is not disqualified and does not possess a license from more than one jurisdiction. If the driver possesses a license from another jurisdiction, the State must require the driver applicant to surrender his/her driver's license issued by that State before issuing a new license.

The State must request the complete driving record of the applicant from all jurisdictions where the driver was previously licensed in the past 10 years.

Beginning January 30, 2012, for each operator of a commercial motor vehicle required to have a commercial driver's license, the current licensing States must:



Require drivers to certify the type of operation the driver expects to conduct and post the driver's self-certification to the driver history record;
Retain the original or a copy of the medical certificate of any driver required to provide documentation of physical qualification for three years beyond the date the certificate was issued; and
Post the information from the medical examiner's certificate within 10 business days to the CDLIS driver record.
Within 10 calendar days of receiving information from FMCSA regarding issuance or renewal of a medical variance for a driver, the State must
update the CDLIS driver record to include the medical variance information provided by FMCSA.
Within 10 calendar days of the driver's medical certification status expiring or a medical variance expiring or being recinded, the State must:
Update the medical certification status of that driver as "not-certified."
Notify the CDL holder of his or her CDL "not-certified" medical certification status and that the CDL privilage will be removed from the driver license unless the driver submits a current medical certificate and/or medical variance, or changes his or her self-certification to driving only in excepted or intrastate commerce (if permitted by the State).
Initiate established State procedures for downgrading the license. The CDL downgrade must be completed and recorded within 60 days of the driver's medical certification status becoming "not-certified" to operate a CMV.

 

[Diamondpilot]

You are right about the laws being outdated. A lot has changed in the last 25 years in the pick up truck world. Many of my customers are towing 10,000 to 18,000# trailers every weekend with 3/4 and 1 ton diesels. Some even use 1/2 ton gas trucks for stuff in the 10,000# range without any issues.

The trucks are just that much better. I would take a NEW 1/2 ton gas truck by any manufacture properly equipped over any 3/4 ton gas truck built 20 years ago.

Chris

 

[Kaliburz]

Well, in 1986, I wasn't even in middle school/junior high and in 1992, I wasn't worrying about CDL's- I think my biggest worry was if the cute girl I liked liked me.

I have a Class B, but it was mainly so I can drive a yellow bus. I was trained by the local district just under 10 years ago. (So I don't know squat about log books and such... yes, yes, I'm probably a bad CDL driver for not knowing that- a prime example of drivers who don't know the law. You ever talk to an enforcement guy? Sometimes they can't explain things- only quoting the book.) But I've been driving trucks since I was a kid- farm kid here. Dad and Uncle knew nothing of CDL's- all our stuff was tagged farm. Biggest truck we had (still do) at the time was a C-750 Ford flatbed and we had a gross of 32K.

I still know of people w/ semi trucks driving w/out CDLs for farm stuff. And if I read it right, even if it's farm tagged, anything over 40K GVW, you are REQUIRED to have a CDL. I don't think it's right. But as posted, these laws went into effect long before I ever even had a license to drive. Around here, most farmers didn't have tandem axle trucks straight trucks, just singles. And semi's...well, not many were used from what I recall as a kid. Today.... heck.

I know it's all for "safety". But I still people getting caught in the cracks. I think I've seen stories on other forums (and I think here) of people getting pulled over and ticketed because they are towing a "rented" backhoe with a 3/4 ton to do work at their summer place etc. etc. Safety.... (And now we have the TSA at the airports.... also for safety- whole different subject). And the farmer who owns a semi to haul his stuff, but can't get a CDL due to his "high blood pressure" (or other health issue) and can't afford to hire someone since they only use the truck "infrequently".

LOL. If they wanted to make things truly safer, have 16 year olds go through the same training as CDL drivers. They won't get their license till they are 21 if they can't hack it.

edit-
Heck, I just bought a trailer (has it's own thread) and it was tagged "commercial" by the licensing dept because of it's curb weight! Suppose to weight 4050lbs. I'm gonna have to do some research.