Tiller Tiller vs. Harrow

[Don87]

....ya know.....so much is going to depend on your soil, and what is there now. I have a 2 bottom plow, a ripper, a box blade, a 5' box frame disc, and a 5' tiller. I have tilled new ground without any prior plowing....and I have plowed first and used ripper or box blade rippers first...and then followed with the disc and then tiller. So much depends on the vegetation and soil types. Mostly....for my sandy loam.....I can just lower the tiller and start tilling. One pass and I'm ready to plant. But sometimes.......I have lots of roots and such and it takes a few passes to clean up the land to prepare for the tiller.....then too, sometimes I have stumps and/or rocks.

Like so many things......the answer to this question is: It Depends. :laughing:

That was the best answer so far. Where I am, a tiller is best because the ground will clump with a little dampness. A reverse tine tiller is the best choice for my location.
I've spent over 6 hours now preparing next years garden area. First I removed the sod with the FEL. Second was the middlebuster, third was the culivator.
My ground is very dry here right now, so it is breaking up fairly easily. But it's still not what I was looking for.
My garden area is only 18 by 36 feet.
My old Cub Cadet 2160, with the reverse tine tiller I had, would have done a much better job in 1/3rd the time.
Hope this helps

 

[cspot]

I must be the exception... I had a 5' tiller for years and sold it two weeks after I got my disc harrow. That thing covers some ground in a hurry! Tillers are SLOW! I can make a couple passes and still catch the game!

If it your first time breaking the land, a plow first would be ideal, every year after the disc alone will do fine.

There is no doubt that with a plow and a disc are the quickest way to get the ground worked up especially large areas. A tiller is nice for gardens and small food plots though. Even with a tiller I still like to plow the ground first if it is the first time breaking the land. I also think it is good to plow the ground every 4 or 5 years.

 

[gwdixon]

Yes it will be the first time that soils been disturbed. I'm thinking definitely a plow to start with. The area was used for many years to strip branches from trees before they were fed into the saw mill so they put down some baseball sized rock for the equipment to drive on.

The rocks do add an issue. If you have a box scraper it would behoove you to scrape off as many of those as humanly possible. Your mom will not appreciate having to haul those away in a wheelbarrow.

That size rock will definitely be a factor on tiller tines. They probably won't break but will wear at a tremendous rate. My several tillers have had the tines rebuilt and hardfaced multiple times in the rocky soil here.

Another possibility is that the tines will catch a rock that baseball size just right and rotate it up into the sheet metal. Your PTO shaft should have a sheer pin or slip clutch to avoid tractor damage.

 

[sweettractors]

That was the best answer so far. Where I am, a tiller is best because the ground will clump with a little dampness. A reverse tine tiller is the best choice for my location.
I've spent over 6 hours now preparing next years garden area. First I removed the sod with the FEL. Second was the middlebuster, third was the culivator.
My ground is very dry here right now, so it is breaking up fairly easily. But it's still not what I was looking for.
My garden area is only 18 by 36 feet.
My old Cub Cadet 2160, with the reverse tine tiller I had, would have done a much better job in 1/3rd the time.
Hope this helps

It is a good practice to leave the sod on and incorporate it into the soil. This makes the soil richer in nutrients and organic material and helps the soil retain moisture and resists compaction better. If we have a bare field in the fall, we sow a cover crop, to mix with the soil come spring. Ken Sweet

 

[Redgoatea]

Other than the rocks that were added on top for traction there are NO other rocks in my soil.

The ground around here usually consists of a few inches of top soil then a few inches of just dirt and then endless clay under that.

I'm getting a plow just because I have some other things around here I want to do with it. I'm also planning on covering the area now compost, mulch, and whatever else is around here and plowing that all under. By spring there should be plenty of nutrients in the soil so well just need to add some lime before planting.

 

[bp fick]

Other than the rocks that were added on top for traction there are NO other rocks in my soil.

The ground around here usually consists of a few inches of top soil then a few inches of just dirt and then endless clay under that.

I'm getting a plow just because I have some other things around here I want to do with it. I'm also planning on covering the area now compost, mulch, and whatever else is around here and plowing that all under. By spring there should be plenty of nutrients in the soil so well just need to add some lime before planting.

That sounds like you have a plan. As you probably recall, lime takes 30 days to work. In the absence of rain, even longer.

 

[TripleR]

It is a good practice to leave the sod on and incorporate it into the soil. This makes the soil richer in nutrients and organic material and helps the soil retain moisture and resists compaction better. If we have a bare field in the fall, we sow a cover crop, to mix with the soil come spring. Ken Sweet

Pretty much the same here for our soil and conditions.

 

[Don87]

It is a good practice to leave the sod on and incorporate it into the soil. This makes the soil richer in nutrients and organic material and helps the soil retain moisture and resists compaction better. If we have a bare field in the fall, we sow a cover crop, to mix with the soil come spring. Ken Sweet

I agree, but Wifey said..........you take it off or I will. LOL
I do have about 5 tons of well rotted horse manure coming though. Hopefully with that, and a bunch of lime for my normally sour soil, I'll be good to go.

 

[bp fick]

Pile that sod up somewhere else. Turn it once a month. Next year, it will be manure too. Not the kind that comes from the rear of a horse, but manure nonetheless. We call it green manure. Nutrient rich, perhaps richer than what the horse makes!! Seriously. Rotting it off site is a common practice.

 

[foggy1111]

I bought the nicest 2x16 Dearborn plow I could find. It is P A R A D E ready....and my tractor pulled it so nicely....and it turned the sod over...picture perfect. BUT.....I wont use it anymore.

On my soils I have about 4 or 5 inches of rich, black loam...which lies over about 1/2 mile of sand. Turn the black dirt over and put it deep.....and pull the sand up on top.....and you lose the value of the soils. Instead.....I can rip and then disc my land....or oftentimes just use the tiller to mix a the black top soil. Saves moisture too! Our water table is only a few feet below ground....so deep rooting plants thrive....and we get pretty frequent rains. :thumbsup:

So....which is better?.....IT DEPENDS ON YOUR SOIL. Give it some thought.

 

[hrcarver]

Same way here, the good(well, better) dirt is on top.

 

[bp fick]

Perhaps apropos.

Might point toward soil amending procedures for gardening. Having only 5" of quality soil is not ideal or sufficient. "Making" better soil in order to have at least 7-8 inches of healthy soil is a pretty important goal. Root systems easily descend through 7", depending on the plant. It takes time, in many cases years, but the rewarding results of amending thin soil is very worthwhile.

 

[Redgoatea]

Improving my soil quality is definitely a big priority for the garden. I'm thinking plow it once then send the (5) kids through with buckets to pick up all the rocks. We've got plenty of soil piles around with vegetation mixed in. Dump a few of those on top toss in some manure from the cows and muck out the goat pens once a month then pile that on. Grind it all up together with either a disc or tiller once in a while and I should have some pretty good crops next year. 7

 

[Don87]

Improving my soil quality is definitely a big priority for the garden. I'm thinking plow it once then send the (5) kids through with buckets to pick up all the rocks. We've got plenty of soil piles around with vegetation mixed in. Dump a few of those on top toss in some manure from the cows and muck out the goat pens once a month then pile that on. Grind it all up together with either a disc or tiller once in a while and I should have some pretty good crops next year. 7

Actually in your case you would be much better off making a 'compost pile'.
There are specefic technics to make the piles work well for you, but fresh manure is never good for a garden.

 

[Redgoatea]

Actually in your case you would be much better off making a 'compost pile'.
There are specefic technics to make the piles work well for you, but fresh manure is never good for a garden.

Ohh no no no. I'd throw it on now for next spring. Several months of decomp and a few hundred inches of rain from now. 7

 

[Duffster]

Actually in your case you would be much better off making a 'compost pile'.
There are specefic technics to make the piles work well for you, but fresh manure is never good for a garden.

Never?

 

[oneillmj]

If you were going to plow then disc, what kind of plow would be preferable for clay soil?

 

[sweettractors]

A bottom plow in clay soil. Ken Sweet

 

[BrianR]

I bought the nicest 2x16 Dearborn plow I could find. It is P A R A D E ready....and my tractor pulled it so nicely....and it turned the sod over...picture perfect. BUT.....I wont use it anymore.

On my soils I have about 4 or 5 inches of rich, black loam...which lies over about 1/2 mile of sand. Turn the black dirt over and put it deep.....and pull the sand up on top.....and you lose the value of the soils. Instead.....I can rip and then disc my land....or oftentimes just use the tiller to mix a the black top soil. Saves moisture too! Our water table is only a few feet below ground....so deep rooting plants thrive....and we get pretty frequent rains. :thumbsup:

So....which is better?.....IT DEPENDS ON YOUR SOIL. Give it some thought.

I fall plow every 4 to 5 years, but I go more than about 5 to 6" deep when I do it. Then every year between, I leave the garden trash on top through winter to preserve soil and then disc the stalks/trash/vines/etc to chop them up, and then run the chisel plow in two directions, let it sit for a couple of weeks and disc before planting. Of course, I plant with a Flex 71 planter for all of my row-crops.

If for some reason I need a more finished and smooth soil for rows, I just run a hand tiller down where my row will be and then plant.

 

[Don87]

Never?

Never. I tried that route last fall, I won't do it again.
I figured it would be well rotted by spring, but it wasn't. I wondered why, then found things like this:
Are All Animal Manures Safe for an Organic Garden ? -
An excerpt: Most raw animal manures contain the wrong form of nitrogen and the wrong form of bacteria for gardening use, from the original animal's digestive tract.