When to stop driving autos

[CurlyDave]

Everyone is talking about older drivers but what about young drivers? Like the stupid college kid that hit my wife's parked car while she and my daughter were loading groceries. The kid pulled in the parking place in front of her and got out of the car only he did not put the transmission in park. The kid called his Dad. The Dad apologized and told my wife the kid had another wreck a couple months before.

I remember several years ago, my car was hit from behind by a young driver. Got all the insurance information, etc. somehow I could not seem to get his insurance companies attention, until I got my own insurance to go after them.

It turns out that he had rear-ended two different cars on the same day, and his insurance company filed stuff by his name and then the date of accident.

 

[Denwa]

.....What sometimes scares me more then older drivers is when I see people who can barely walk get in behind the wheel.

You know, the ones who use a cane or a walker or shuffle their feet to walk. When they get into the car, they can barely pick up their feet or have to use their hands to put their legs into the vehicle.

Then, they drive - WITH THEIR FEET - .....It is true, they can rest their foot on the gas pedal, but can they really lift either foot fast enough to hit the brake in an emergency?

This goes beyond any age, as people of all ages have leg, feet and back problems making it difficult to use their feet or lift their legs.

You've got valid concerns here, BUT good driving practice would have
the driver keep their heel in contact with the floor at all times and apply pedal pressure to gas or brake WITHOUT lifting the foot or leg.

Two advantages at least: The application of control pressure to the pedals will be smoother and better modulated. If the foot IS lifted,
it is much more likely to come back down in the wrong place than if
the heel is left on the floorboard and the foot just pivoted sideways one way or the other.

So, actually being able to lift a leg is not necessary in itself. Lots of other possible factors to be considered here of course.

Dennis

 

['Bota Fan]

It's difficult to know how to begin this post, but I can't imagine not relating our sad story. In fact, I am possessed of a strong ethical obligation to do so.

Dad was in his eighties, he was growing physically weaker, and his driving had become erratic and jerky. There were the telltale signs of scrapes and dents on his car, and when I would ask what had happened, he would offer lame excuses that never included any major culpability on his part. Whenever I suggested he should become a full-time passenger, I was always met with total resistance, even though I solemnly promised I would take him anywhere he would like to go. I was worrying for nothing, he would say. Unfortunately, my mother would side with him, so I was left to fly the flag of sensibility alone.

Suffice it to say Dad was in an automobile accident resulting in a fatality, and a young man with a wife and two children was taken from them far too soon. Every year, I mark my calendar to remember to pray for that family on the anniversary of the accident, at Thanksgiving, and at Christmas. Had I exhibited the fortitude and courage to press the issue more forcefully with Dad, that man might still be taking his place at the Thanksgiving table and passing out gifts from under the Christmas tree.

Dad is gone now, too, but the regrets still linger. My fervent hope is that others may benefit from our experience.

 

[Denwa]

.... My dad doesn't want to stop driving. I accept that I cant force him , I do however express my opinion strongly.His recent accidents, remind me so much of when my kids were learning to drive , well they got the license but would do things like tear the front bumper and nose off on a guard rail and then bring it home for me to do my magic with duck tape and my favorite drywall screws. Maybe thats why i feel like its repeating .
In my case he had a stroke 4 years ago and amazingly recovered. But it still causes some vision perferal problems and as well as some times not thinking quickly.
I compare it to the computer.
its called LAG. Ask it something and it hesitates but finally gets the point.

What you describe sounds similar to what I went through with my dad.
Slow reactions, lack of observation, very poor peripheral vision, near deaf, slow mentally.... The real tell tales were the growing variety of dents in the car that were caused by "someone hitting me in a parking lot". Then he put the car in a ditch, because it was "too dark". He also missed his exit on the freeway because it was snowing and forgot how to get home from the next exit. Etc....

Here's the hard reality. If my dad had not, or your dad does not get off
the road ASAP it's a game of diminishing returns. Every time they get
behind the wheel it's closer to the probability of their or someone elses injury or destruction.

My dad protested that he'd been driving for xx years and had never had a crash (except the ditch and parking lots perhaps). What I tried to sell him on was that it was much better to quit while he was ahead. Go out clean. Quit BEFORE he hurt himself or someone else. "Go out in style" I said, rather than with a nightmare to last you and the rest of us the rest of our lives. Again, tough stuff to deal with...

At one point he ended up in the hospital with pneumonia. When he got out, I told him I would be his driver from now on. He kept grousing to folks that I had hidden his car keys when if fact they were hanging on the key rack in the kitchen, in plain sight. I doubt I'll ever figure out if he really couldn't find them or he was just using this statement as a way of saving face and getting some digs in. At 93 he's now in dementia care.

You say you can't force him to stop driving, and this is true in an immediate legal sense, but you can certainly bring all his deficits to the attention of the authorities, his insurance company, and lean on his doctor to do what is right for the rest of society. Insurance companies really get excited about this kind of thing and might require a physical at a doctor they select. Your dad wouldn't drive without insurance would he? That's illegal. He can blame "them". You will probably feel as if you are betraying your father, and you may have to take a fair bit of abuse for a while, but, BUT, the alternatives are no less tasteful.

Enlist the help/conspiracy of family and friends who share your concerns. Make it a project. If you are sneaky enough, and no one rats you out, dad will blame "them" instead of taking it out on you. The world will thank you. You WILL have done the right thing.

Everyone has to stop driving sometime, providing they live long enough to come to that point. Everyone will die. Best to do your dying by yourself and not selfishly take others with you.

Two stories I tell my driving students relate to old drivers:

One was an 90 something old man in CA several years back who launched his car into a pedestrian mall. He killed 13 people as I recall, before his car crashed out. "His gas pedal got stuck", and standing on the brake did nothing. Riiiiight....

The other happened right here in my neck of the woods. Some old gal
was angle parking in front of a travel agency. She got the pedals mixed up and crashed through the front of the agency, killing a travel agent sitting at her desk.

Also, as a motorcycle rider, I have heard numerous stories of old folks
pulling out or turning in front of oncoming bikes because "they did not
see them". The bike rider frequently does not survive this type of encounter. This situation is not limited to older drivers, but is more likely with reduced vision and attention.

Driving is a heavy responsibility, and in my view, taken way to lightly by most folks. My casual research has led me to believe that probably only 10% of drivers are really squared away, 10% are downright dangerous at any given moment, and the other 80% get it right most of the time. Personally, I drive very defensively, as if the other drivers are going to try to get me. It's a combat zone out there. Assume nothing, know all the rules and be self critical of your skills and abilities.

Off the soapbox....

Good night and good luck ;' > (somebody say that before?)
Dennis

 

[Denwa]

It's difficult to know how to begin this post, but I can't imagine not relating our sad story. In fact, I am possessed of a strong ethical obligation to do so. ......

Thank you for sharing your story and pain. It is very instructional. Your telling of one tragedy may prevent many more from occurring.

Peace brother, and don't to so hard on yourself. As with raising children, aging parents don't come with an instruction manual. You did what seemed best at the time.

Dennis

 

[Bird]

This topic has long been a tough one to resolve. Texas regular drivers licenses are good for 6 years, and if you have a clean record you can renew on the Internet. But about 3 years ago, our legislature, in their infinite wisdom, passed some new laws. If you are 79 or older, you must appear in person, take the eye exam, etc. to renew your license. And once you turn 85, you must renew every 2 years. Of course if you renew when you are 84, you still get the 6 year license. In either case, they can require taking the written and driving tests, but I don't know whether they are doing it or not.

My paternal grandfather would never quit driving, even when he had a couple of accidents and the state revoked his license. Alzheimers kept him from knowing when to quit. Fortunately, where he lived, even in his earlier days, he rarely drove faster than 20 mph so the accidents were minor ones with no injuries. So, I think Dad's sisters did the only reasonable thing. They took his car and one of them drove it to her home in another state. He knew someone from Texas took his car, but he could never remember who so he wasn't mad at anyone.

This topic is of concern to me, too, of course. Nearly 25 years as a police officer, part of that time in charge of the safety section. I've taught driving, I've driven high speed pursuits, and I have a 20 consecutive year safe driving award from the department. I've done some racing, and before becoming a police officer, two of my part time jobs were driving a school bus one year and driving a taxi cab in Dallas; probably have as wide a variety of experience as almost anyone. However, I'm now 70 years old and know I'm not as capable a driver as I used to be. I used to like working nights. Now I try to avoid driving during the hours of darkness. And I know I need to be especially careful when driving, but I do acclerate briskly getting onto freeways and I do drive the speed limit. I still hate to see old folks poking along slowly tying up other traffic.

So when will I quit? Well, right now I'd be glad to let someone else do the driving and/or I'd have no objection at all to being retested. But if Alzheimers gets me, who knows?

Some have mentioned the AARP publication on persuading drivers to quit. AARP also has their own online defensive driving program designed especially for older drivers. Both my wife and I take that program every 3 years for the insurance discount we get as a result. And of course it's a good refresher anyway. AAA also has one, but it costs more than the AARP course.

What sometimes scares me more then older drivers is when I see people who can barely walk get in behind the wheel.

You know, the ones who use a cane or a walker or shuffle their feet to walk. When they get into the car, they can barely pick up their feet or have to use their hands to put their legs into the vehicle.

Then, they drive - WITH THEIR FEET - not with hand controls.

Hey, are you talking about me?:laughing: I had my right knee replaced August 30; didn't get out or drive while I was using the walker, but did while I was still using my cane.:laughing:

You've got valid concerns here, BUT good driving practice would have
the driver keep their heel in contact with the floor at all times and apply pedal pressure to gas or brake WITHOUT lifting the foot or leg.

Exactly!

 

[chopped]

I really appreciate the posts here it is helping me alot to deal with it.I sure dont want to be the one to hijack my own thread lol But the renewal of licence online Id like to ask and or add how do they check your eyes?No eye exam I assume its almost like they are admitting they are only really interested in the almight buck??

 

[Bird]

I really appreciate the posts here it is helping me alot to deal with it.I sure dont want to be the one to hijack my own thread lol But the renewal of licence online Id like to ask and or add how do they check your eyes?No eye exam I assume its almost like they are admitting they are only really interested in the almight buck??

You can only renew online every second renewal; i.e., can renew online if you renewed in person last time. For some of the requirements, read here. If you have a clean record, they'll take your word for vision being OK once.:laughing: My wife renewed online last time, so she'll have to go in person next time.

I must be getting old and forgetful, or maybe they changed something, but I thought you couldn't renew your license until 90 days before it expired, and now I see you can renew up to one year before expiration.:laughing: Mine is due to expire in January, so I intended to renew it next month. However, I went ahead and did it just now. Of course, it does cost an extra dollar "convenience" fee over the $24 renewal fee to do it online, but I'd burn more than a dollar's worth of gas to drive to their office.

 

[teg]

Wanted to add that my grandmother-in-law (?) at 95 years old finally stopped driving when she said about her drive home from church that: "God, got me home!!!".

She was a tiny lady, she could either press the gas pedal or see where to steer...:shocked:

 

['Bota Fan]

Your telling of one tragedy may prevent many more from occurring.

I truly hope so. Thanks for your comforting words.

Like I've heard many times, "once a man, twice a child."