Batt. charging ideas

[chuck172]

I'm picking up a harbor frieght winch today. I want to mount it to my 1971 ford 4500 tlb.
Thinking of making some type of quick mount to the top of the loader. I'm going to be using the winch for logging some "can't get to" firewood.
The tlb now uses a 12 vdc generator. I suppose I can replace it with a one wire alternator, but then I'll loose my tach. No real big deal. Do you guys think maybe I'll be o.k with the very low output generator? I'll just pull a little at a time, real slow and careful.

 

[zmoz]

I'm picking up a harbor frieght winch today. I want to mount it to my 1971 ford 4500 tlb.
Thinking of making some type of quick mount to the top of the loader. I'm going to be using the winch for logging some "can't get to" firewood.
The tlb now uses a 12 vdc generator. I suppose I can replace it with a one wire alternator, but then I'll loose my tach. No real big deal. Do you guys think maybe I'll be o.k with the very low output generator? I'll just pull a little at a time, real slow and careful.

Could you add a second battery and alternator while still leaving the original generator? The extra alternator would only charge the extra battery and your tach would work.

I don't know how much charging power you're working with, but it's probably not enough...

 

[chuck172]

That would work fine, might be tough to do though. I guess I'd have to somehow add a pulley somewhere.

 

[zmoz]

Do you know what the max amp draw of the winch is? If you have a big enough deep cycle battery (or two) you might be able to get away with no charging at all (plug it in when you're done) or very low charging from the old generator, depending on how much you really need to use it.

 

[goldenwings]

Yeah it will work, you may be disappointed though unless you have a long time to get these trees. I am doing the same thing on my JD2520 with a front mounted 4500 lb winch. I can usually get 4-5 full 60' pulls before the battery starts to poop out. My tractor only has a 20 amp alternator, so I try to stagger my pulls in between some hauling/other activities not drawing any battery current.

When I get close to the 4500 lb limit or 9000 lbs i guess, with a snatch block, the 5 or so feet a minute seems like an eternity. However that being said, sometimes it is the only way to get these trees out of the woods.

As a self recovery winch it is indispensable though, as being stuck in the woods is no fun.

At the end of the day i generally throw the battery on the charger to top it off.

 

[chuck172]

I have all the time in the world to winch. No hurry. I'm going to try the marine battery on its own first. See what kind of winching time I get.

 

[retiredIW]

i think i would just use snatch blocks and a long cable looped to the tractor. back up to pull the log so you can see what you are doing. have safety cage around operator to keep from doing damage if cable snaps.

 

[chuck172]

Thats what I've been doing my whole life. There are trees I need to get at that I just can't get to with long cables and snatch blocks. I think a winch might do what I want but powering the winch is tough.
Seems like self powered portable winches go for an arm and a leg, small chain saw winches have their negatives.
a helicopter would do the job.

 

[Soundguy]

you are over thinking this.. the 20a genny will charge the tractor batter which I would parallel with the winch battery.. both will be charged...

soundguy

 

[retiredIW]

Thats what I've been doing my whole life. There are trees I need to get at that I just can't get to with long cables and snatch blocks. I think a winch might do what I want but powering the winch is tough.
Seems like self powered portable winches go for an arm and a leg, small chain saw winches have their negatives.
a helicopter would do the job.

and that wouldnt cost an arm and leg. ive used helicopters to set big units on a roof. now that is exspensive

 

[Jay4200]

I'm picking up a harbor frieght winch today. I want to mount it to my 1971 ford 4500 tlb.
Thinking of making some type of quick mount to the top of the loader. I'm going to be using the winch for logging some "can't get to" firewood.
The tlb now uses a 12 vdc generator. I suppose I can replace it with a one wire alternator, but then I'll loose my tach. No real big deal. Do you guys think maybe I'll be o.k with the very low output generator? I'll just pull a little at a time, real slow and careful.

You winch runs will run completely off of the battery - no alternator/generator can keep up with a winch. Your best bet is to put a 3-mode charger (I'd get a Battery Tender) onto your battery during times of non-use and keep your battery at 100% capacity at all times.

JayC

 

[Natureboy]

Do you know what the max amp draw of the winch is? If you have a big enough deep cycle battery (or two) you might be able to get away with no charging at all (plug it in when you're done) or very low charging from the old generator, depending on how much you really need to use it.

Would be interested to hear from anyone that has tried this with the deep cycle battery powering the winch on its own. I am thinking about the same setup. The winch is mounted on a receiver plate which slides into a receiver bolted to the lower drawbar (between the wheels, don't want to pull with the 3 point arms). The battery would be mounted on a carryall that also contains a toolbox for everything else (chainsaws, etal). I had the winch (2000 lb) already, and would chunk up anything really heavy so as not to exceed the rating. I don't have alot of use for it, but on occasion I run into the blowdown tree that I hate to see just rot in the woods, when I could use it for firewood.If I remember correctly the winch specs say it uses 50 amps when pulling 1000 lbs. The battery I'm looking at is rated at 105 amp hours, which if I understand correctly would power the winch intermittently for about 2 hours. The battery would be on a tender when not in use. Again, it would only be occasional use.

 

[RPW]

I agree with soundguy. You're over complicating the problem. Upgrade your battery to a heavier duty farm battery or optra deep cycle. Hook winch up as directed in installation manual. One change would be to get some 300amp anderson connectors to make a quick connect (look at stall amperage). Run tractor at 1200 - 1500 rpms to keep charging at max current. You should be able to haul your logs out all day. I'm using an 8000# winch on my 25ft dovetail to use for recovery etc. I run mine off of a deep cycle and use a 5w solar charger. Hasn't failed me yet.

good luck.

 

[moship]

Natureboy,

The Ah rating is not linear and I believe most automotive/deep cell bateries are rated using a fairly low current (<5 amps, but someone can verify if needed). Drawing higher current, 50 amps in this case will result in higher internal batteries temperatures and likely not to approach the 2 hrs the calculations suggest.

I believe reserve capacity is based on a 25 amp load, so it might give a better indication of battery life.

Having a "spare battery" in the rear is a plausible idea and battery life could be extended if a charging wire is also supplied.

Deep cycle is the way to go.

 

[hr3]

Just a thought but why couldn't you hook a high amp alternator to the rear pto,, Should be easy to do and will charge as you go..

 

[Gordon Gould]

Just a thought but why couldn't you hook a high amp alternator to the rear pto,, Should be easy to do and will charge as you go..

I would think you could make a nice unit with that idea. :thumbsup:
Alternator, voltage regulator, battery and winch right on the 3ph. Cheap light capacity logging winch.

 

[Rio_Grande]

I use several winches in my operation. One trailer 25 foot goose with a 10,000 lb pull winch on the neck. In the beginning I had 2 brand new identical deep cycle heavy duty batteries hooked together to supply the 12 volts. That trailer would winch as many as 6 30 is foot pulls a day for 3-4 days before being recharged, but there were breaks in between pulls. To say it would pull that distance straight out would not be true.

Our 8000 pound winches will go longer than that between charges at same duty.

Remember though if you are using a shatch block you are pulling double the distance of the same pull at single line pull. I dont know much about that harbor freight winch but I have a few china series wound units that seem to draw alot more juice to opperate than my ramsey. May be made in the same factory for all I know but there is an observable diffrence.

Now to your question. I run one winch on a jeep running a 100 amp alternator and a heavy duty high output jell cell battery. that setup will pull the full line in dragging the jeep every time but I stop on occasion to cool the winch.

The 8000 lb pull China made I put on my Tractor pulls the battery and alternator down hard on my trailer. More than a 50 foot pull and the power is reduced to the point ya have to let it sit there and run to charge back up. That being said I rarely need a pull farther than that as I am typically just straighting things up on the trail to drag out.

 

[chuck172]

The winch I just picked up from harbor frieght draws 37.5 amps. My ford 4500 generator puts out 22 amps.
My marine battery is rated at 875 marine cranking amps at 125 amp hrs.

What does all this mean?
How well will the generator keep the battery charged to run the winch and how will the battery do if I just run the winch off the battery and not connect it to the tlb?

 

[Rio_Grande]

Means at some point you will run out of juice before the tractor can recharge the battery. I would hook it to the alternator, if you dont then you only get what the battery can pull then your done. By hooking it up at least you can let it sit, Idle and recharge then go back to work.

That is how I did mine after playing around a but.

We are preparing to log a 13 acer wooded hillsides. We are gonna skid our own logs out so i am preparing to Adapt a pto winch to the tractor and run it off of a hydraulic motor. Mostly because I need the 300+ feet of cable it provides and I know an electric will not hold up to the kind fo winching we will be doing.

Good luck.

 

[olds67]

You can get alternator conversion kits that you will be able to run your tach off of. Just do a Google search on "Ford 4000 alternator conversion" there is a lot out there.