Turbocharging

[Raspy]

I can't see how you can turbo a stock engine and get it to run on pump gas. Diesels are a perfect match for turbos, but gas engines? The kind of performance mentioned here seems like it would need aviation gas at least. How do you stop the detonation at boost pressures?

 

[CLinton_in_FL]

I could do both with a 396 with 4:10's and barely made 13. Friends with semi-pro built cars were getting into the high 10's adn 11's with 20K pro built motors and slicks...Just sayin.

There was a reference before to a 12 second Aviator too.

A Z06 wil hook perfectly too...It'll never see 11 without 20K in add-ons. The Z06 numbers are professional, not weekenders.

Not saying it didn't happen..but...

Well I will give you this, I dont know how the sea level affects the times, but if you had that set up, you were not making the power or rather torque to get you moving.

 

[tcartwri]

I can't see how you can turbo a stock engine and get it to run on pump gas. Diesels are a perfect match for turbos, but gas engines? The kind of performance mentioned here seems like it would need aviation gas at least. How do you stop the detonation at boost pressures?

It's all about keeping the intake charge temperatures down. Modern turbo systems, and superchargers, put almost no extra heat into the intake. They are also comparitively easy on the bottem end parts because the loads in a boosted engine are compressive rather than the tensive loads you get from spinning a high horsepower naturally aspirated motor. In fact it's usually the block that fails before the rods and crank in a turbo motor.

 

[deerefan]

I have posted the power chart for you guys to review. Peak horsepower comes on about 600 rpm later than naturally aspirated, but peak torque comes on at roughly the same rpm as naturally aspirated. This article also cleared up for me why the 4.6 and 5.4 were not the greatest for towing, seeing their peak power numbers do not arrive until well north of 4000 rpms. These tests were run with 100 octane race fuel, but does state 93 octane is definitely safe. They kept the air fuel ratio around 11.8:1 and timing values below 20 degrees, all done in keeping the motor intact. The only non factory pieces were associated with the fuel system, as the stock system would not cut it. They replaced the injectors (19lb stock) and went to 39lb/hr injectors. Also, they used a FAST XFI/XIM system over the stock ECU for ease of testing but stated the stock ECU can be programmed to work. They bolted on a set of Kooks long tubes to be compatible with the turbo. The motor stock (from the junk yard) made 296hp at 4900 and 343 lb-ft at 4100. As turbos become more prevalent, articles like this are grabbing attention. If they can get 400+ hp and torque from a little 3.5 V6, just think what is possible with more cylinders and cubes. Maybe 500+ with over 22 mpg in a fullsize truck?

 

[Diamondpilot]

This is the main reason I think Ford is in such a good position right now. The development of the 3.5L TT is putting them so far ahead of everyone else right now. 400HP in stock form is going to be a reality, 500HP, not so much. But with rising fuel prices who knows. Whenever a new motor is introduced by any manufacture its de-tuned.

There is no secret to this article and its timing. Its what has been know for a long time. They are now just showing how its possible to take your existing truck and modify it with a simple bolt on turbo and get power above and beyond what the factory has with its new offerings.

As for the 4.6 and 5.4 motors. The claim to fame on these motors was that it made something like 80% of the available torque below 2000 rpm giving them respectable low end torque. Remember, these motors are nearly 20 years old now, basically the first multi port truck motors. Yes, they leave a lot to be desired but so did the 350. I think history will show they have done the job respectably just like a 350 and and if it were not for the spark plug issue been a trouble free line of motors if taken care of for many many miles.

Chris

 

[dodge man]

I can see that Linclon getting in the 12's really easy. I haven't had my Challenger down the 1/4 mile yet, but I've heard of guys getting in the low 13's, high 12's with just simple bolt ons, making in the high 300's hp at the rear wheels. Guys with bolt on superchargers are getting in the 11's pretty easy.

 

[Diamondpilot]

I can see that Linclon getting in the 12's really easy. I haven't had my Challenger down the 1/4 mile yet, but I've heard of guys getting in the low 13's, high 12's with just simple bolt ons, making in the high 300's hp at the rear wheels. Guys with bolt on superchargers are getting in the 11's pretty easy.

Yes, it does not take a lot of money to go fast. I watch that show Pinks all the time. There are tons of guys on there with F body Mustangs, early 90's Cameros, and small trucks like S-10's who are crazy fast with just a few thousand dollars of bolt on's to a factory setup.



Chris

 

[deerefan]

This is the main reason I think Ford is in such a good position right now. The development of the 3.5L TT is putting them so far ahead of everyone else right now. 400HP in stock form is going to be a reality, 500HP, not so much. But with rising fuel prices who knows. Whenever a new motor is introduced by any manufacture its de-tuned.

There is no secret to this article and its timing. Its what has been know for a long time. They are now just showing how its possible to take your existing truck and modify it with a simple bolt on turbo and get power above and beyond what the factory has with its new offerings.

As for the 4.6 and 5.4 motors. The claim to fame on these motors was that it made something like 80% of the available torque below 2000 rpm giving them respectable low end torque. Remember, these motors are nearly 20 years old now, basically the first multi port truck motors. Yes, they leave a lot to be desired but so did the 350. I think history will show they have done the job respectably just like a 350 and and if it were not for the spark plug issue been a trouble free line of motors if taken care of for many many miles.

Chris

Ford is taking a tremendous gamble and I hope it works out. Now that we have seen what power can be obtained, let's see if the rest of the drivetrain can handle it. After looking at the chart, you are correct as 80% of the power on the motor they tested was prevalent @ 2000 rpm. I hate how hard those motors were to work on. I guess I could say the 4.6 in my 97 was ok. It disappointed me at 135k miles I had to replace the motor due to a cracked cylinder head. The new motor has been fine so far. The 4.6 just feels a little gutless. I cannot critique the 5.4 as I have never owned one.

 

[tshep]

Wow - where is this going?

It seemed to start with electrically powered 'turbo charging'.

I looked into that real hard a few years ago, and if I remember right...
pressure was a function (square?) of speed, and at the required volumes, regular, inexpensive electric motors just didn't turn fast enough to get into the really fat part of the curve for engine volumes.(And thus they needed 2!) So rule out belts (even slower) and electric motors - that free exhaust flow is the only way to go for spindle speed.
I'll also bet those leaf blower motors were on stationary dyno's - with 120V circuits ON SHORT CORDS.

Despite how cool 'supercharged' looks in the sales brochure - turbocharging is the most cost effective, homebrew pressure mod - especially since sourcing and rebuilding have become routine in the last 30 years since the Buicks.

 

[timswi]

Wow - where is this going?

It seemed to start with electrically powered 'turbo charging'.

I looked into that real hard a few years ago, and if I remember right...
pressure was a function (square?) of speed, and at the required volumes, regular, inexpensive electric motors just didn't turn fast enough to get into the really fat part of the curve for engine volumes.(And thus they needed 2!) So rule out belts (even slower) and electric motors - that free exhaust flow is the only way to go for spindle speed.
I'll also bet those leaf blower motors were on stationary dyno's - with 120V circuits ON SHORT CORDS.

Despite how cool 'supercharged' looks in the sales brochure - turbocharging is the most cost effective, homebrew pressure mod - especially since sourcing and rebuilding have become routine in the last 30 years since the Buicks.

Ah the GNX...That was a cool car...A real sleeper in it's day...Love to find a good one now.