In the "Furrow" magazine by John Deere published in 1953 I read an article describing a "complete machine system for one man small hay bales" using a baler with a kicker or thrower onto a hay wagon and then pushed on a conveyor belt which transported the bales up into the top and then across of the barn were they were deposited. Where could I get a conveyor system and what type of baler / kicker system should be used. Thank you.
complete machine system for one man small hay bales
- Thread starter terence
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Welcome to TBN. 
DAY
Platinum Member
Yes, welcome!
The "machine" you describe sound a bit Rube Goldberg, but was part of a long line of agricultural implements, starting with the moldboard blow, and progressing into the late 19th Century with massive combines pulled by huge teams of horses or mules.
The first balers merely dropped the twine or wire tied product on the ground, to be hoisted onto a wagon by strapping youths in summer heat. None cheered louder with the arrival of the kicker, be it belt of hydraulic powered!
There were also wagons that were PTO powered, and picked up and stacked the bales without human hands involved. Back at the barn the entire load was was removed at once, again without human contact.
Today the round baler/large square baler rules, and the tightly packed hay is often left in the field- wrapped or not- until needed.
And then there is haylage.
Hay elevators are still to be found at auction, as are older balers with kickers. They become obsolete before they wear out, and parts are still available.
The "machine" you describe sound a bit Rube Goldberg, but was part of a long line of agricultural implements, starting with the moldboard blow, and progressing into the late 19th Century with massive combines pulled by huge teams of horses or mules.
The first balers merely dropped the twine or wire tied product on the ground, to be hoisted onto a wagon by strapping youths in summer heat. None cheered louder with the arrival of the kicker, be it belt of hydraulic powered!
There were also wagons that were PTO powered, and picked up and stacked the bales without human hands involved. Back at the barn the entire load was was removed at once, again without human contact.
Today the round baler/large square baler rules, and the tightly packed hay is often left in the field- wrapped or not- until needed.
And then there is haylage.
Hay elevators are still to be found at auction, as are older balers with kickers. They become obsolete before they wear out, and parts are still available.
Day,
Thank you for your most helpful reply. Is it worth the expense to buy this equipment and produce small 50 pound hay bales hoping to sell for $3-$5? I have over 250 acres that grows grass which produces over 700 hundred large square bales weighing from 900 - 1200 pounds each which I receive $3 for each large bale. I would like to harvsts my own hay and make a considerable amount more. Thank you.
Thank you for your most helpful reply. Is it worth the expense to buy this equipment and produce small 50 pound hay bales hoping to sell for $3-$5? I have over 250 acres that grows grass which produces over 700 hundred large square bales weighing from 900 - 1200 pounds each which I receive $3 for each large bale. I would like to harvsts my own hay and make a considerable amount more. Thank you.
DAY
Platinum Member
I sure read you wrong, terence! I assumed you were looking for a system to make some hay on five or so acres!
With 250 acres some serious machinery is needed. From your numbers, you would be making 14,000 fifty pound bales PER CUTTING. At $3 a bale, that is $42,000. Talk to your bank about an ag loan!
John Deere Ag - New Equipment Features for 328 Twine Baler
The John Deere 328 square twine baler. List $19,000.
Machine Finder (Used Hay Equipment - John Deere MachineFinder) has a 1997 used 328 for $9,750.
With 250 acres some serious machinery is needed. From your numbers, you would be making 14,000 fifty pound bales PER CUTTING. At $3 a bale, that is $42,000. Talk to your bank about an ag loan!
John Deere Ag - New Equipment Features for 328 Twine Baler
The John Deere 328 square twine baler. List $19,000.
Machine Finder (Used Hay Equipment - John Deere MachineFinder) has a 1997 used 328 for $9,750.
beenthere
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terence
Post in one of the forums other than this "Introduction to New Members" and you will get additional information and help.
But would be good to provide a better description of what you really have in mind. Since 1953, there have been many advances in handling hay. Only one of them was bale kickers and bale handlers for mowing away bales.
Also, where you are located will help with the answers.
Post in one of the forums other than this "Introduction to New Members" and you will get additional information and help.
But would be good to provide a better description of what you really have in mind. Since 1953, there have been many advances in handling hay. Only one of them was bale kickers and bale handlers for mowing away bales.
Also, where you are located will help with the answers.
slowzuki
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Do you have storage for 14,000 to 28,000 bales? That is a large barn.
You would need a bale baron or similar with a large tractor and high output baler to do the baling in a reasonable time. Are you mowing too?
You'd need about 100,000$ in equipment to do this with one man in a reasonable amount of time with one person, plus the right buildings to store. If you have say 3 people available, you can do it with about 15,000$ of equipment if you're very careful shopping and you all work hard.
Have you ever hayed before? To be honest, 2100$ rent without lifting a finger is pretty darned good.
You would need a bale baron or similar with a large tractor and high output baler to do the baling in a reasonable time. Are you mowing too?
You'd need about 100,000$ in equipment to do this with one man in a reasonable amount of time with one person, plus the right buildings to store. If you have say 3 people available, you can do it with about 15,000$ of equipment if you're very careful shopping and you all work hard.
Have you ever hayed before? To be honest, 2100$ rent without lifting a finger is pretty darned good.
smstonypoint
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Terence,
First, a few thoughts on the rent you are now receiving.
As I understand it, you are "renting" your 250 acres in return for a payment of approximately $2,100/year (700 bales @ $3/bale). This works out to $8.4/acre year. This is not purely a "cash rent" situation in that you are assuming some production risks -- if there is a poor (good) growing season, you receive less (more). However, you don't have any price risk -- you receive $3/bale regardless of hay price variation from year to year.
Using 1200 pounds/bale, the land is producing 420 tons/year or 1.68 tons/acre/year. I don't know where you are located, but your average hay yield is below the national average for 2010 -- 1.95 tons/acre (http://usda.mannlib.cornell.edu/usda/current/CropProdSu/CropProdSu-01-12-2011_new_format.pdf).
I am not aware of any reported data on rents for hay land for each of the individual states. However, the USDA reports average cash rents for pasture for the individual states. The US average was $11/acre in 2010 (NASS - Charts and Maps - Farm Values and Cash Rents). I'm not sure about the relationship between hay land and pasture rents in the various states, but in Iowa, the hay land rents are considerably higher (http://www.extension.iastate.edu/publications/fm1851.pdf)
Whether your rent is fair to you and the farmer is your call. There is considerable variation in rents within and across counties.
Now, to the economics of producing the hay yourself -- can you obtain a return to your land (after allowing for returns to your labor, management, and risks) greater than $8.4/acre per year? The answer depends on your revenues and costs of producing hay. The agricultural economics departments in many land-grant universities publish prototype enterprise budgets for forages that you can modify as needed to reflect your situation. Here's an example for NC -- Forage Budgets.
Note that a substantial investment in equipment may be required.
Note that you will have to include the costs of maintaining the hay land (e.g., liming, fertilization, etc.)
Note the labor requirements -- they will not be trivial for 250 acres.
You should also be thinking about the storage and marketing of your hay crop.
You should also be aware that you will face both production and price risks if you DIY.
Steve
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I bought a John Deere 7130 at an auction this winter so I need to gather the balance of the equipment. The math for 2 tons or 80 - 50# bales an acre times 250 acres times a modest $3 a bale = $60,000 for each cutting with hopefully two or three cuttings per year.
Is this sober thinking?
How much do the large squares bales sell for in your area? Perhaps this is a more efficient approach?
Thank you.
Is this sober thinking?
How much do the large squares bales sell for in your area? Perhaps this is a more efficient approach?
Thank you.
slowzuki
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Remember to add fertilizer, reseeding, transport, wastage and costs to sell and market the hay to your figuring.
That much land on one tractor is possible, I assume that is a newish 7130. It is really too small for a large square baler but it would run a big round baler. If you don't know the markets for local rounds and squares, you may have trouble selling that much hay at your asking price. That is a lot of hay to sell.
5x6 rounds on 250 acres is far far easier to deal with in a one man show. With your yields it sounds like large cheap wheel rakes would work perfectly. A 12 ft disc mower would run nicely behind your 7130. With a loader double spike and double rear spike or a round bale wagon you could quickly get your rounds or squares off the field to allow regrowth. Round bales can also be tarped if you don't have the indoor storage.
That much land on one tractor is possible, I assume that is a newish 7130. It is really too small for a large square baler but it would run a big round baler. If you don't know the markets for local rounds and squares, you may have trouble selling that much hay at your asking price. That is a lot of hay to sell.
5x6 rounds on 250 acres is far far easier to deal with in a one man show. With your yields it sounds like large cheap wheel rakes would work perfectly. A 12 ft disc mower would run nicely behind your 7130. With a loader double spike and double rear spike or a round bale wagon you could quickly get your rounds or squares off the field to allow regrowth. Round bales can also be tarped if you don't have the indoor storage.