opinions appreciated, flail vs bh for my land

[ugabulldog]

I have read the threads on flails, but wanted others opinions on what fits my needs best. I don't mean to beat a dead horse with the flail vs... issue, but this is a big purchase for me and I want to make the best one.

I have about 10 acres of established pasture to cut. There are no rocks to worry about as it has been cleaned up already. I will make about an acre around the house yard and cut when needed every couple of weeks (don't need manicured lawn as this is the country) the other approx. 9 acres I would only like to cut two-three times a year. It is thick tall fescue that will be waist high when cut. I have a MF 245 (45 h.p., 43 pto h.p.) and plan to buy one 6' mower attachment, either flail or brush hog (and weed eat what it left close to the house). From what I have read, the flail would definetly have an advantage with less sticking out and be able to manuver around house, trees, fence better....the con being higher initial cost and maintenance. I have also read where it might be a good idea to have two sets of blades for a bh, one for around house and one for pasture, change as needed. I am still a little unclear on flails ability to cut over rolling land and also to cut without it touching the ground if I needed to raise up higher to make it through the thick grass. I have attached a picture of the hilliest part and also their is a good bit of flat also. Thank you to all who take the time to post and I will be happy to answer any other questions that might help.

 

[MarkV]

If you are looking for a finished lawn cut, which you will not get cutting waist high pasture, go flail. If you want to cut waist high 2-3 times a year go rotary mower (bush hog). I don't think either, configured to do waist high cutting, will work well around the house. I would never consider changing blades on a rotary mower to cut around the house. Besides being the wrong tool for the application it is a hassle to change them. Just my opinion.

MarkV

 

[leonz]

Good evening UGA Bulldog,


You have recieved excellent advice
from MarkV regarding your inquiry.

Your tractor has plenty of power to
run a seven or eight foot flailmower
if desired. The question is the time
you want to devote to it.


In the example;

one mile an hour is 88 feet per minute.
two miles an hour is 176 feet per minute.
three miles an hour is 264 feet per minute.

Using 209 by 209 feet(rounded) for the acre size
mowing one acre at one mile an hour in the example
with a seven foot mower will require 30 passes (rounded)
onre way to cover the acre.

Each 7 foot pass will take 2.4 minutes with the
7 foot flail mower at one mile per hour.

Each 8 foot pass at one mile per hour will require
the same time but will require 26 passes(rounded).

If you can mow when the heavy brush is
dead/winter killed is best as the
brush will no longer be green from
photosynthesis.


In our collective example my father
used a Ford Jubilee with 7 foot
John Deere finish flailmower with
a 3 knive row grass mowing rotor and
it had no issues with 10 foot overgrown
pasture bringing it down to the sod.


For what you wish to accomplish and also
mow around your home a 7 or 8-foot flailmower
with two row rotor would work very well for you.

The types of knive available are the issue for you.

A scoop knive with a shackle mounting with a
three row rotor will give you good results
using a three row flail mower rotor.

A grass slicer Y blade with shackle mounting and hardened knives using
a two row rotor will also give you good results.

A grass slicer with the Y blades and a four knive row flail
mower will always give you excellent results and will make the
smallest clippings/shredded brush at all times.

There is no need to raise a flailmower unless
you are hacking and wacking heavy brush of the
type that our member Island Tractor has to deal with.


The "flail mower" will have four to six hieght adjustments
within its mowing range brackets for the hieght adjustment
depending upon the design of the manufacturer of the
flail mower.

The shroud of the flailmower that covers the rotor
helps to maintain the pressure gradient(suction)
developed by the spinning rotor and the knives to
lift the clippings up an over the rotor and back down
to the ground.


The nice thing about open acreage is you can save
time and fuel by mowing in a spiral which saves you from
stoping, braking and turning around which consumes
large amounts of time when you mow.

The flail mower will also shred the brush for you a
second time as the aerodynamic lift created by the
knives and the flail mower rotor will lift the clippings
a second time and shred them even finer for you if
you desire to do so.

Few people know this but the business of mowing started
around the farmstead home to keep the snakes away from the
home by eliminating the tall grass near the fram house.

Please contact Ken Sweet as he is a TractorByNet
forum sponsor in good standing and ask him about
his sicma and diamond lines of flail mowers
and he can help you with your purchase decision.

Ken also ships implements from his warehouse in
Kentucky as well.



The flail mower will also be a piece of machinery that
will have no issues being mounted on a larger prime mover/
tractor for you and it will not lose resale value as quickly
as a rotary cutter if you no longer wish to mow or move.


In our example we still have the same towed 4-foot finsh mower
with 30 years of use and except for main bearing changes/a new gas tank/
motor springs and throttle cable and new wheels and wheel bearings we
still have excellent results.

We also mow heavy brush with this same towed flail mower.


Please understand I only wish for you to be an informed
consumer of information and have no afilliation with any
sponsor or machinery manufacurer.

 

[Farmwithjunk]

Here we go again.....:>)


ONE MILE PER HOUR? My God man....I'd fall asleep and fall off the flippin' tractor going that slow!

You'd think going that slow, you'd find time to key the spell check

\To the OP....Use a 6' flail on a 245 in 3' tall fescue, and expect to go that slow and still have a distinct LACK of horsepower....(I've got an MF150...Same engine as a 245, only mine is turned up to 47hp on the pto. So I AM familiar with how a Perkins AD3-152 will put out) In my commercial mowing business, we demo-ed a 6' Alamo flail on a 61hp Deere. Used it in 2' to 2-1/2' fescue and had to go EXTREMELY slow...Still bogged the daylights out of the tractor. With an 8' rotary, I can take the SAME TRACTOR and run 5+mph with great results. Flails require more hp and (VERY) much less ground speed in heavy grass. They do a decent job, just pathetically slow. They're more at home mowing lawns.

 

[teg]

Here we go again.....:>)


ONE MILE PER HOUR? My God man....I'd fall asleep and fall off the flippin' tractor going that slow!

LOL... I used a Flail mower... I didn't link it. The belt smoked... and was happier with a bush hog/ shredder. If you really want / need a clean cut... I bush hog and then finish mow it... much better.

Edit, do yourself a favor and get a used bush hog and a used finish mower...

 

[tractorski]

I am going to dis agree with the majority here. i do alot of field mowing through the summer and have tried both flail and rotory. Last year I bought a brand new woods BB720(6 ft brush hog), very heavy duty, it worked great. or so I thought. This past spring I purchased a used Alamo 7 ft flail. yesterday I sold my woods brush bull. I fould that there was no difference in the speed at which I could go through thick grass, some over my head while I am on the tractor. with the extra foot of cutting surface I was able to finish mowing in a significantly shorter time.

I also found that the fields were much more apealing to look at when finished. Though both units were similar in weight, it was great being able to turn at will with the flail mower off the ground, I couldn't always do that with the Woods.

The drawback is price. Flails are usually more expensive. check ebay for used ones I made out pretty well.

Good luck!

 

[gwdixon]

Edit, do yourself a favor and get a used bush hog and a used finish mower...

I agree with the two mower (or more) system. You can see that from my signature.

The large bush hog is used to knock down the tall stuff and the flail is used to clean things up and make the place look like a golf course. But my Alamo/Mott has finish blades. The rear roller on the flail will keep it from scalping.

Regular flail mowing around the house will work just fine if you don't care about playing croquet. It won't need a bush hog treatment if you flail mow before it gets a foot or so tall.

The second set of bush hog blades is completely unnecessary with an additional flail mower. They really are unnecessary anyway but do require occasional sharpening to make it easier on your tractor.

 

[Farmwithjunk]

I am going to dis agree with the majority here. i do alot of field mowing through the summer and have tried both flail and rotory. Last year I bought a brand new woods BB720(6 ft brush hog), very heavy duty, it worked great. or so I thought. This past spring I purchased a used Alamo 7 ft flail. yesterday I sold my woods brush bull. I fould that there was no difference in the speed at which I could go through thick grass, some over my head while I am on the tractor. with the extra foot of cutting surface I was able to finish mowing in a significantly shorter time.

I also found that the fields were much more apealing to look at when finished. Though both units were similar in weight, it was great being able to turn at will with the flail mower off the ground, I couldn't always do that with the Woods.

The drawback is price. Flails are usually more expensive. check ebay for used ones I made out pretty well.

Good luck!

Glad you're pleased with the results. However, I'm basing my opinions on a fleet of commercial mowing equipment that logged just over 7500 combined hours last year. Flail experience is based on roughly 300 collective hours of demo/owned time with 4 different VERY expensive commercial grade mowers, much of which was with a manufacturers rep on the job with us. We can really push the rotaries as far as ground speed. Flails will only go so fast before they choke the daylights out of the tractors. We used the 6' and 8' flails on everything from 61hp to 95hp. Even tried one 8'er with an 8' side mounted hydraulic flail. They just could not match the productivity of a good rotary in harsh conditions.

 

[foreman Etexas]

Is it good grass?If it is buy (finish mower for yard) then let the neighbor have the(big pasture)for a hay field(make him spray and fertilize)then set back and look at a nice hay meadow. Dont know if there is anyone interested in your area but alot of people around just let them have it aslong as it is well kept and that means( 0 maintance) for you.

 

[TDVT]

I almost didn't didn't respond as the flail/RC debate as pretty much gotten ridiculous but.......

My house is on one end of an old 4 acre pasture, no protruding rocks, somewhat uneven. What is now a pretty decent lawn (1/2 ac?) is just field that has been mowed for 25+ years & the rest I cut about twice a year. Sounds similar to your situation.

I own a sickle bar mower, a rotary cutter & a flail mower & have used all three to cut the same field at different times. The sickle bar is probably from the 70's, the other two I bought new. I almost exclusively use the flail mower these days. I have an L3400 & an 8N.

The sickle bar (7') leaves a nice cut, but is fussy & tended to clog if I didn't get to the mowing before the grass got too thick. But it was great for getting under the edge of the tree line & could cut slightly down the bank if I adjusted it lower. There were also alot of edges to keep sharp.

The rotary (5') cuts without complaint but typically leaves clumps & windrows that were pretty thick. You also had to back in to cut under the tree line, alot of forward & backward unless you didn't mind getting branches in the face & scraping the paint of the tractor. Since it IS so simple I still use it for rougher stuff & don't worry about it, but I don't expect it to look great.

I have found the flail (6') to be best suited to most of what I mow. It leaves a cut that looks almost like our lawn tractor (there are lines from the way the knives are shaped), stuff is totally mulched without any windrows & with the offset I can cut under things to a point (not as well as the sickle bar) without backing in. I also don't worry about flying sticks or rocks (or broken windows, don't ask) I don't cut down large saplings with it but it's not used only for grass. I also find the width a good balance between less passes & maneuverability.

As for maintenance, the sickle bar needed the most attention (needs a bearing right now), the bush hog needs a back corner welded where the housing tore & could use another sharpening & I just replaced 2 shackles on the flail after I put it up on a decent sized rock hidden in some tall weeds in an unfamiliar field. I usually sharpen the RC each season since it's so quick. The flail is in it's third season & I haven't sharpened the knives yet, partly because there are so many but they're also in way better shape than I would have expected. Other than that, no maintenance issues.

This pic is a few years old as there is now a large fenced garden about where the tractor is. I still cut the upper section with the lawn tractor but often cut the lower 60' or so of lawn beyond the garden with the flail as it's faster & it doesn't have to be "real" lawn.

Don't know if that helps or not, good luck!

TD

I meant to add that a neighbor has a higher end RC (a Landpride, I think) that leaves a nice finish on one of the fields he cuts for hire. I drive by there going to work & when he's mowing it looks like a similar ground speed to what I use with the flail.