Which tow ratings are right?

[newbury]

Still have the problem of what's the correct tow ratings.

I'm looking at a 2002 Dodge 3500 SLT PLUS, QUAD CAB, 4WD, LWB Bed, Transmission - Four-Speed Automatic, 47RE, Engine - 5.9L 24-Valve Cummins Turbo Diesel.

On the Dodge web site it is only rated for towing 8,600 lbs even with the 4.1 axle.
Dodge Towing Guide - By Vehicle Results

In what I consider my usual look up for tow ratings, 2002 trailer life, it shows 12,000 lbs, but doesn't say if it's 5th wheel or BP.

Which is right?

The trucks I have looked at don't have GCVWR ratings on the door sticker, but rather GVWR. Do I have to figure out what the loaded truck weighs with the tongue weight?

 

[Dmace]

It's 12k, that Dodge Towing guide typically has some typos in different vehicles. For instance, that same truck with the 5 or 6 speed manual is rated for 12k to 14k and the manual transmission trucks are typically less in towing capacity. Even a RAM 1500 in 2002 was rated at over 8k lbs so there is no way that RAM 3500 dually is rated for 8,600 lbs. Also, those max tow capacities are typically 5th numbers.

 

[LD1]

I may be wrong but I have never seen a truck sticker that didnt have the GCWR:confused2:

Either way, there is a lot to sizing the load to actually be legal.

You must NOT go over the GCWR. That is the total weight of the truck, trailer, and load.

You must NOT go over the truck GVWR. That is the load on the truck plus the truck weight. This includes tongue weight.

You must NOT go over the trailer rating. This is the weight of the trailer PLUS the load on the trailer, MINUS the tongue weight.

You may have a configuration that meets one or two of the requirements but it must meet ALL THREE to be legal.

The actual "tow" rating of the truck is vague. It is basically the GCWR minus the curb weight of the truck. Passengers, things in the bed, tool boxes, etc all take away from the "tow" rating. When a MFG lists a tow rating, it is usually the MAX rating using the lightest truck in that class IE: 2wd, no extended cab etc. Those add weight to the tow vehichle and thus lower the legal tow capacity.

 

[77bronco]

None of the trucks I've had in the past have had a GCWR on the door sticker. Even with the International 4400 we had I had to contact IH to get the GCWR.
Most of the time you have to look at the towing guides or owners manual to find the combined ratings.
I think the reason most trucks are rated lower with a manual is that the companies didn't want to replace the clutch because the driver burnt it up trying to get a load moving.

 

[bcp]

Why should it be illegal (unsafe) to exceed the GCWR:

when the GCWR is lower due to transmission choice?

when the GCWR is lower due to gear ratio choice?

When the GCWR is lower due to engine choice?

These affect durability, etc, not safety.

There should be a "DO NOT EXCEED" rating for the vehicle based on the best towing options, then have "Recommended GCWR" for the lesser equipment options.

Bruce

 

[Verticaltrx]

I may be wrong but I have never seen a truck sticker that didnt have the GCWR:confused2:

I have to say I've never seen a truck that did have the GCWR listed on a door sticker, or anywhere on the truck for that matter. Everything from my little toyota up to our C60 dump truck the GCWR is never listed on the vehicle, only GVWR. There are so many combinations and options that affect GCWR that most manufacturers don't readily list it. Also, GCWR and trailer weight ratings have very little to do with what's legal, mostly only what the mfg. thinks is safe and reasonable to tow. Exceeding the GVWR of truck or trailer, or what your plates are for is where legal trouble starts.

For example, my '88 F-250 is only 'rated' to tow 7000lbs. It's 8800lb gvwr, 460, 5spd, 10.25 rear axle, Dana 50 front axle, heavy duty towing package, super cooling package, and factory overload rear springs. It is A LOT more truck than these new F-150's that are 'rated' to tow 11,000lbs. Both are completely legal to tow a 10K trailer, regardless of what the mfg rates them at.


As for the OP's question, my guess is the 8600lbs dodge lists if for bumper pull, or simply an error. Any 1-ton truck ever I've dealt with was rated to tow at least 10K.

 

[LD1]

Why should it be illegal (unsafe) to exceed the GCWR:

when the GCWR is lower due to transmission choice?

when the GCWR is lower due to gear ratio choice?

When the GCWR is lower due to engine choice?

These affect durability, etc, not safety.

There should be a "DO NOT EXCEED" rating for the vehicle based on the best towing options, then have "Recommended GCWR" for the lesser equipment options.

Bruce

Engine choice, gear ratio, and transmission DO effect saftey.

Engine braking down hills? Need a tough tranny for that. And a steeper rear gear helps too.

Or what about going up a steep hill? When the engine or transmission are inferior combined with not-so-great gears in the back; what about when they burn up the tranny and start going backwards down the hill??

Or what about the ones bringing the flow of traffic down to 35MPH on a slight grade?

 

[sandman2234]

Engineers design them, and draw a line in the sand, and the LEO use that line in the sand to pound it into your head that there is a limit. Otherwise, a "suggestive limit" would just be a place to start for a lot of haulers. Then somebody would bend that "suggestion" a little too far, and we would be back where we are, with rules.
David from jax

Why should it be illegal (unsafe) to exceed the GCWR:

when the GCWR is lower due to transmission choice?

when the GCWR is lower due to gear ratio choice?

When the GCWR is lower due to engine choice?

These affect durability, etc, not safety.

There should be a "DO NOT EXCEED" rating for the vehicle based on the best towing options, then have "Recommended GCWR" for the lesser equipment options.

Bruce

 

[schmism]

You must NOT go over the GCWR. That is the total weight of the truck, trailer, and load.

You must NOT go over the truck GVWR. That is the load on the truck plus the truck weight. This includes tongue weight.

You must NOT go over the trailer rating. This is the weight of the trailer PLUS the load on the trailer, MINUS the tongue weight.

Technically there is a 4th case also which is GAWR (gross axle weight rateing)

You can get your rear GAWR by pulling only the front axle of the loaded truck on the scale, take reading, then pull truck fully on, take reading. then subtract the first number from the second for the rear axle weight.

 

[Diamondpilot]

I have owned and maintained dozens of trucks and have never seen GCWR on the sticker, just GVWR. Only one true way to know a vehiceles real tow rating and that's to weigh it with you, fuel, and your junk then subtract that from the GCWR found in the manual.

Listed tow ratings are just a guess and are usually based on a light truck with no options.

Chris.