Splitter Build Begins

[165masseyky]

After several weeks of thought and research. Trial and error and more error and nearly a trial I have decided my 165 MF doesn't have quite the juice needed to do what I need from my splitter so I am gonna go another direction. Instead of relying on my tractor QD's I have decided to run from a gas engine with a shaft pump. After contacting Northern Tool(who btw has what I believe to be the best customer service in the free world) I have returned the unused belt driven pump that I had traded for and now have $530 to spend toward this project in the form of a Northern Tool gift card. I have located a twin cylinder 16.5hp Briggs engine that I can trade for with little to no money invested. I have chosen a 16 GPM 2 stage 3000psi pump that I will couple to the Briggs and also ordered a 20gal tank with large screw in screen along with a 5in x 2in x 24in Hadaven cylinder.
I do have a concern though. The pump doesn't list a return pressure so I don't know what PSI filter I need to purchase. It is a Haldex pump so maybe someone can help me with this.
The specs I got from my math for this set up should run a very satisfyingly productive system. I also have a Prince LSR 3060 detent valve that would make the extend very quick but could cause some serious hydraulic heat issues I fear.
(without LSR valve)
Push lbs -58905-29.45ton
pull lbs -49480-24.74ton
extend speed-7.7
retract-6.5
cycle-14.2

I know that isn't a blazing speed but with this much pressure and my 1/2in H beam I can make multi split passes with ease I believe as long as my Hydra. temps don't get to high. I was able to trade some with the local hydraulic shop and got the 5in bore for about $150 new. Not bad so I will pat myself on the back now. The H beam was a freebie...well sort of I got it by helping the local scrap yard guy load some steel on a trailer. Took about 3 hours. Built the pusher sled out of scrap I scrounged from the metal bin at work. My hoses I had made and were $227. To this point I have figured I have ruffly $550 in the same materials you would find in a $3000 splitter. Now the work starts. I have a 4x8 diamond plate decked trailer that is going to be sacrificed for the frame and transport unit.

So here is what I am thinking. How bought we do this as a group. Lets here suggestions of what would be a good thing to have engineered into a splitter and what things have been tried and were less than a good return. I want to finish this build and dub it "TBN1". So who is up for this the sky is the limit and no idea is too wild. All suggestions will be considered and in one week we should have enough of a design to start the build. Only restriction is the H beam is 6' 6" long and the rest is up to us.
Might be a good idea to set up a list of details.

.Safety
.Hydraulic
.Power
.Log Lift
.Log stabilizer
.Fuel capacity
.Wedge
.Transport
.Tools and Storage
.Spare Parts
.Paint scheme

After reading tons of posts from this site I think this could be an awesome endeavor an not to mention a lot of fun to see just how far the brilliant minds on TBN can push them selves.

 

[flatheadford]

Boom with winch, to drag in rounds too far and too big to roll to the log lift

 

[LD1]

I only have two suggestions

1st, (and JJ will probabally be along to clarify), but I do NOT think you can run that regen valve with the 2-stage pump. I think you need a standard logsplitter valve.

2nd, with the 16.5HP motor, and 5" cylinder, I'd seriously consider the 22GPM pump. It will make better use of your HP, and make the huge 5" cylinder blazing fast:thumbsup:

 

[J_J]

Yep, you are right about the fast extend valve. It does not work with two stage pumps, and it also only works with low GPM single stage hyd pumps .

The relationship about the GPM's between the two kind of pumps, is that the performance/speed is about equal. The fast extend/regen valve takes low GPM, and adds the fluid from the rod side to gain more GPM's.

Suggestions about the pump will have to be based on the HP you have available.

A 28 GPM two stage pump will need a 16 HP engine.

Surplus Center - 28 GPM DYNAMIC 2-STAGE PUMP

The Prince Auto valve

Surplus Center - 1 SPOOL PRINCE AUTO CYCLE LOG SPLITTER VALVE W/PB

Log lift, wedge or winch possible.

Surplus Center - 2 SPOOL 25 GPM PRINCE RD526GCGA5A4B1 OC VALVE W/FT

 

[plumbstraight]

flatheadford. Right on with the winch and boom. I have mine set up with an A frame over the splitter jaw. Sure takes the work out of moving the big ones around. The other thing is a T knife so the block stays whole while taking two pieces off the bottom with each stroke.

 

[165masseyky]

Yep, you are right about the fast extend valve. It does not work with two stage pumps, and it also only works with low GPM single stage hyd pumps .

The relationship about the GPM's between the two kind of pumps, is that the performance/speed is about equal. The fast extend/regen valve takes low GPM, and adds the fluid from the rod side to gain more GPM's.

Suggestions about the pump will have to be based on the HP you have available.

A 28 GPM two stage pump will need a 16 HP engine.

Surplus Center - 28 GPM DYNAMIC 2-STAGE PUMP

The Prince Auto valve

Surplus Center - 1 SPOOL PRINCE AUTO CYCLE LOG SPLITTER VALVE W/PB

Log lift, wedge or winch possible.

Surplus Center - 2 SPOOL 25 GPM PRINCE RD526GCGA5A4B1 OC VALVE W/FT

Thanks thats what I was thinking so I have already dug out the other 2 spool valve for the use of the 22gpm pump.

 

[165masseyky]

Yep, you are right about the fast extend valve. It does not work with two stage pumps, and it also only works with low GPM single stage hyd pumps .

The relationship about the GPM's between the two kind of pumps, is that the performance/speed is about equal. The fast extend/regen valve takes low GPM, and adds the fluid from the rod side to gain more GPM's.

Suggestions about the pump will have to be based on the HP you have available.

A 28 GPM two stage pump will need a 16 HP engine.

Surplus Center - 28 GPM DYNAMIC 2-STAGE PUMP

The Prince Auto valve

Surplus Center - 1 SPOOL PRINCE AUTO CYCLE LOG SPLITTER VALVE W/PB

Log lift, wedge or winch possible.

Surplus Center - 2 SPOOL 25 GPM PRINCE RD526GCGA5A4B1 OC VALVE W/FT

I am leaning towards the 22 gpm I think the big bore cylinder will give me plenty of speed and power now that I do the math so needing a downshift pump won't me needed what do you think? Is there a difference in performance that would make you pick the two stage over the straight 22 gpm? And I have a question about the 2 spool valve you mentioned are both spools auto or only the spool for the splitter and not the acc. spool?

 

[CRThomas]

Yep, you are right about the fast extend valve. It does not work with two stage pumps, and it also only works with low GPM single stage hyd pumps .

The relationship about the GPM's between the two kind of pumps, is that the performance/speed is about equal. The fast extend/regen valve takes low GPM, and adds the fluid from the rod side to gain more GPM's.

Suggestions about the pump will have to be based on the HP you have available.

A 28 GPM two stage pump will need a 16 HP engine.

Surplus Center - 28 GPM DYNAMIC 2-STAGE PUMP

The Prince Auto valve

Surplus Center - 1 SPOOL PRINCE AUTO CYCLE LOG SPLITTER VALVE W/PB

Log lift, wedge or winch possible.

Surplus Center - 2 SPOOL 25 GPM PRINCE RD526GCGA5A4B1 OC VALVE W/FT

J J wood splitting is a never end learning process CRThomas

 

[J_J]

I am leaning towards the 22 gpm I think the big bore cylinder will give me plenty of speed and power now that I do the math so needing a downshift pump won't me needed what do you think? Is there a difference in performance that would make you pick the two stage over the straight 22 gpm? And I have a question about the 2 spool valve you mentioned are both spools auto or only the spool for the splitter and not the acc. spool?

Auto-Cycle valve allows operator to completely cycle (out and back) a double acting cylinder by only one handle movement. It uses two spools to operate one cyl. Accessories valve is separate valve for things like log lift and wedge lift. The pump will shift speed as necessary based on pressure.

The 2 stage pump definitely has a speed advantage in the extend mode. Most people do not have wood that is always tough to split.

 

[Chilly807]

The 3060 valve is designed for single stage pumps with relatively low flow rates. It adds the return fluid to the volume going to the extend side of the cylinder. They list it as boosting the speed by a factor of six times, or 4 gpm turns into 24 gpm, although how they arrive at that number escapes me.

You hold it in one position until the splitter starts to labour, then move it one notch further to eliminate the multiplying device and just get normal flow to finish the split. Return is auto kick-off at the end of stroke.

How much extra heat this valve creates is a debatable question. I've never seen one, although there's been lots of talk. If it were me, I'd talk with Prince's customer service folks and ask that question. I'll probably buy one myself in a couple years, since the hyd flow on my Kubota would make for slow splitting otherwise.

Sean