Buying Advice Looking to buy

[vitreous7]

Greetings, I've been looking at compact tractors for ~6 months now for moving snow from driveway, office parking lot, landscape mulch, small garden. Had just about settled on Kubota, B2620 or B3200. dealer has them priced pretty close. Anyway, I've saw and ad by Artrac for a package deal where the tractor (25hp) 4wd, loader, trailer, and two implements are less than either kubota with a loader, box scrape. But the reviews on the chinese tractors show lots of issues that are probably out of my league to address. As the company, ARTRAC, is 14 hours away, I'm concerned about these potential problems. But, most of those threads are several years old. Have those been addressed/fixed by the company over the last sevearal yrs?
Thanks,
Mike

 

[greg_g]

You won't find a more honest dealer on these tractor sites than Chip. I was impressed enough to go back and buy a 2nd tractor from him. But I'm not sure he even sells Chinese anymore. His website is only showing 3 AgTracs, and they're not current models. the other stuff is Japanese or Korean. Not to worry though, he's good about maintaining a parts inventory for everything he's ever sold. His website is here.

//greg//

 

[vitreous7]

I have read good things about them. I spoke to Jason there and the Agtracs are now Artracs. One of the agtrac partners left and so they dissolved the agtrac name and are selling them now under their dealer name, artrac. I'm checking around to see if there is anyone who can work on the machine for me when it needs it. 14 hours is a long way. He old threads indicated there were problems you just shouldn't have on a new tractor.

 

[bluechip]

Thanks Greg. I am not aware of any threads with problems concerning the Agtrac/Artrac tractors which are manufactured for us by Dong Feng. We have found these tractors to be very good, with our only real issues being cosmetic, fading of fiberglass, etc and even that seems improved on the more recent shipments. I really like the Changchai engines we have been using. they are direct injection and start well in cooler weather without glow plugs (air box heater included for assist in colder weather but we don't need to use it in Arkansas). We didn't bring any tractors in the last several months due to the current economy. AgTrac was intended as a wholesale venture, selling to a network of dealers from our 2 distributors. Rising costs from China and lower costs on Korean tractors made the margins too skinny to maintain a distribution channel. We are able to maintain low prices now by selling direct to the end user. As Greg says, we continue to import parts for the KAMA brand tractors we sold previously, and if for some reason we stop importing tractors alltogether, we would hope to be allowed to do so for Dong Feng as well. The new DF 20 and 25HP tractors are scheduled to be at the national farm machinery show in KY and the Kansas City show in February.

 

[vitreous7]

The questions are not about artrac/agtrac machines specifically, but Chinese tractors in general. There are 132 pages of threads as owners are asking questions, offering advice, etc. Greg appears very courteous, knowledgeable and mechanically inclined and Chip, your reputation is solid as well. One recurring theme is that there aren't many service locations for these brands and many things must be repaired by the owners themselves. Many of these are several years old, but i am not one to be able to realign the clutch, fix a roller blade, flush the hydrolics with diesel fuel then replace the fluid, etc. So, given that these abilities are beyond my current skill set, if there aren't guys locally who can perform the repairs on these machines then these issues need to largely be resolved by the maker. If the lower price requires an understanding that more issues will need to be addressed by the owner, the lack of a close repair facility probably means I probably should buy from a local dealer. If I lived in close proximity to Chip, I would have already bought the package. But that is not the case. Working my day job while fathering, discipling and coaching five kids and officiating college football means I need a machine that is going to work when I need it to and have few maintenance/ repair issues. So, have the Chinese companies ironed out the bugs I have read about in these threads over the last few years? For example, are the hydrolic lines labeled such that repairs, replacement is not an issue?

 

[Gramps in NM]

I have a 2005 Taskmaster/DongFeng and have ordered parts for it from Chip. Good service and he has a supply of parts even for the older units. Don't be afraid of buying one of these especially the new machines.

 

[bluechip]

When we started selling chinese tractors in 2003, one of my typical buyer qualification questions was "do you own a set of tools" followd by "do you know how to use them". It has become much less important, especially with these new DF tractors. However, that said, anything is subject to need repair at some point. These tractors are pretty basic and so far, all of our long distance issues have been resolved by sending a part in a brown van. Compared to the models of Kubota you are looking at, this tractor is larger, heavier and will have more power. The synchro shuttle trans is comparable to more expensive makes. A lot of the issues (flushing and clutch adjusting) have more to do with setup of a crated chinese tractor. DF tractors are not sold in crates and so are set up by skilled dealer personel. Typically our buyers compare these tractors to buying used. either way, if something breaks, someone will have to fix it. There is the added security that if a major malfunction occured, the worst case is it has to be shipped back to us for repair (you don't get that with used). I can understand if you prefer to buy from a local dealer, our local customers do that too .

 

[Rich Waugh]

Anyone who buys a piece of heavy equipment like a tractor is going to experience a need for repairs or maintenance at some point - period. The nature of the beast is such that it is used where it will be subjected to doing hard work. It isn't a golf cart, for cryin' out loud! If you are unable/unwilling to do some maintenance and/or small repairs yourself, the you should definitely buy a machine from a dealer local to you, regardless of the cost. No matter what brand you buy, unless you buy a machine that is twice as big as you need, you're going to be working it hard and it will need service. Actually, even an over-sized machine is going to need service if you don't want to be replacing it soon.

Buy a machine from your neighborhood dealer - you'll be happier and won't later be knocking Chinese tractors because they couldn't live up to your unreasonable expectations.

Please note: This is not a criticism of you at all. Your position is a fairly common one and there's nothing wrong with it. I just think you've set the bar too high for any compact utility tractor to meet, so you need a local service center.

 

[Bob Rooks]

Anyone who buys a piece of heavy equipment like a tractor is going to experience a need for repairs or maintenance at some point - period. The nature of the beast is such that it is used where it will be subjected to doing hard work. It isn't a golf cart, for cryin' out loud! If you are unable/unwilling to do some maintenance and/or small repairs yourself, the you should definitely buy a machine from a dealer local to you, regardless of the cost. No matter what brand you buy, unless you buy a machine that is twice as big as you need, you're going to be working it hard and it will need service. Actually, even an over-sized machine is going to need service if you don't want to be replacing it soon.

Buy a machine from your neighborhood dealer - you'll be happier and won't later be knocking Chinese tractors because they couldn't live up to your unreasonable expectations.

Please note: This is not a criticism of you at all. Your position is a fairly common one and there's nothing wrong with it. I just think you've set the bar too high for any compact utility tractor to meet, so you need a local service center.

AMEN! :thumbsup:

 

[vitreous7]

Chip, I appreciate your response. I would like to give you a call and ask some questions if that would be possible. Would Wednesday or Thursday work for you? I will have a light schedule at work and should be able to call during the day. Thanks for addressing some of the concerns succinctly.

Rich, Bob: scheduled changing of fluids, replacing/repairing a flat tire, changing of filters are to be expected. I do that on my vehicles and commercial mowers sometimes. I am aware this is not a golf cart. From the past threads I have read, my hope/expectation is that say the hydraulic hoses are now easily repaired/replaced by easily accessible US parts or that the manuf. has made the replacements easily accessible; or that a hydraulic pump can be easily delivered and installed by a local mechanic, etc.. is not "setting the bar too high" nor is it an unreasonable expectation. As recommended by knowlegeable individuals such as Greg and Chip, I have endeavored to take the time and effort to research the various products and make as wise a decision as possible. I have read many threads on the brands I am looking at on the website. As an observation, Greg id's himself as a 'former Chinese tractor owner, current John Deere owner' and Chip writes that they 'hope' to able to maintain a parts supply should they stop selling these machines.

Rich, If your intent was only what you wrote in your last paragraph, then it would have sufficed too only have written the last paragraph and forgone the condescention and sarcasm in the previous section. All your last paragraph did was repeat my and Chip's statements that my situation may indicate paying a little more and buying from a local dealer. No contribution to helping in the decision process.
Bob, copying Rich and adding 'amen' really did nothing to help me gather useful information either.

I guess each of you will reply with scathing if not threatening replies, but that is one of the weaknesses with internet communications. If you must reply as such and validate the initial impression, I guess that is the way it has to be. You guys have a Merry Christmas either way.

Chip, Greg and Gramps: thank you for your time and observations. Chip, I look forward to speaking to you later in the week if that is acceptable to you.
Mike