"Powersafe" clutch on BCS

skyborne98 · Jan 30, 2012

Per the new literature, here is the stated ground speeds
732 - 0.7/ 1.7/ 8.3mph
740 - 0.8/ 1.8/ 2.7 mph
750 - 0.6/ 1.4/ 2.1 mph

farmerboybill · Feb 1, 2012

Hey all,

Just got the poo on the powersafe clutch -

It will indeed be available in April of this year. BUT the only machine to get it is the 853 AND in limited quantities. Price increase is around $300 + or - to get it into the market, but will creep up to full price of $5-600 over a cone clutch machine if it's accepted.

BCS America is not rebadging the machines this year. Everyone on here knows that European machines are badged 600 (front attachments only) and 700 series (front and rear attachments) with NO 800 or 900 series machines. The 853 is actually the 740 around the rest of the world . The 948 is the 746 around the rest of the world. BCS is seriously considering rebadging here to match the rest of the world, but it won't be this year.

So there it is. I was wrong about it not coming here. I'm very surprised they're introducing it. I would bet that BCS Italy is pushing it on BCS America so they can stop producing the cone clutch machines. If they have to produce the cone clutch machine here and the powersafe clutch in Europe, it doubles their inventory. Corporations hate inventory.

TimberXX · Feb 1, 2012

Is the warranty still lifetime for homeowners with the powersafe? I would imagine yes.

Any negatives to the powersafe? Is it more maintenance, can a shadetree mechanic still change out the clutch?

oldmech · Feb 1, 2012

HI. New Powersafe clutch are 5 years warranty. Probably you cannot burnt this clutch. Because multidisc run in oil. But You have a pump a valve a piston . A lot of oil seals . May be with time can need some repair.
Bad things! New powersafe 740 are 3+3 gears No more 4+3 as the 853. I like the road speed on my Grillo 107d . Good luck! Oldmech

TimberXX · Feb 2, 2012

I know people here like the Grillo tractors, I just saw that they reduced their product offering (not tractors).

Are they commited to the US market? How long have they been here for?

Sorry to sound like a debbie downer, but I don't want to be left with a tractor that I can't get parts for.

farmerboybill · Feb 2, 2012

Where did you see this information?

BCSSHOP · Feb 9, 2012

The BCS 740 and 750 PowerSafe Tractors are here and in stock. At our store the BCS 740PS sells for $255 more than the BCS 853. The hydraulic clutch on the new PowerSafe units is designed to handle the heavy starting torques of mowers with blade brakes and high inertial loads. This clutch as the 5-year warranty. It was tested to 20,000 cycles starting a heavy load at which point they stopped testing has there were no failures. The PowerSafe units have been sold in Europe for a couple years so its not so new it is likely to have early life design problems.

Operating the 740 and 750 PowerSafe is different from the standard friction clutches. The clutch is pulled in first, then the red stop lever is squeezed then the clutch is released while holding down the red lever to engage power to the wheels and attachment. The clutch lever has a lighter feel than the friction clutches on the 732 and 853 as it is actuating a valve not squeezing and releasing a strong spring.

Releasing the red handle (it a much stronger handle than the old red motor stop lever) immediately disengages the clutch stopping forward motion very quickly while keeping the engine running. The tractor stops so fast that the high speed transport speed could not be retained. Stopping from 7+ mph so quickly would likely cause the operator great pain.

The stopping of the engine is done by a switch in the left hand handle with quick flip of the lever. The switch is very close to the red lever and clutch.

The 740 and 750 are also fitted with a full parking brake also on the left hand handle. It applies the brake independently of the steering brakes. This will be great for hauling the BCS in your truck.

The 740 and 853 PowerSafe units will very likely replace the 853 and 948. The robustness of the clutch will make them the machines of choice for heavy users. The lighter effort clutch lever will be enjoyed by anyone who stops and starts a lot. Not having to restart an engine when you forget to hold down the old red motor stop lever will be plus for the more occasional user.

The 740 was on display at NOFA-NY winter conference, the Empire State Fruit and Vegetable Growers conference It will be shown at the NY State Farm Show in Syracuse. Let us know what you think. If you like it like I do consider it when you need a new two-wheel tractor. If you don't like it get your new 732 or 853 while they are still available.

farmerboybill · Feb 9, 2012

Hey John,

Really? I had it on the best authority that they were gonna call them the 853. You have them as the 740 and 750?

BCSSHOP · Feb 9, 2012

Yes, I have two BCS 740s both with recoil start Honda GX390. If they called it an 853 folks would forever be getting controls mixed up. Its different but makes sense when you use it. From the European brochure I expect all of the tractors to get the hydraulic clutch. If it is considered safer than the previous models BCS and the other brands on the market I think you have to use the system. Try selling something you think is good but is "less safe" in consumers minds.

Bentleg · Feb 12, 2012

Thanks so much BCSSHOP.

clytle374 · Feb 13, 2012

Minus paying more for more things I don't really need and can break, the removal of transport gear would be a deal breaker if I was shopping for a new tractor. I'd hate to have to buy a 4 wheeled tractor and trailer just so I can get the BCS ' on the scene'

Cory

farmerboybill · Feb 23, 2012

Hey All,

I'm off to what is considered by some to be "the" organic farming conference - MOSES Organic Farming Conference in la Crosse, WI February 23, 24, and 25th. BCS usually shows up with 5 or 6 machines with various attachments to represent their line. I hope to see a 740 powersafe there and give a report on what I think when I get home. They don't give demonstrations, but maybe I can ask to be allowed to drive it back to the truck when the conference is over...

If anyone is going, I hope to see you there.

Bill in WI

farmerboybill · Feb 23, 2012

BCSSHOP said:
Yes, I have two BCS 740s both with recoil start Honda GX390. If they called it an 853 folks would forever be getting controls mixed up. Its different but makes sense when you use it. From the European brochure I expect all of the tractors to get the hydraulic clutch. If it is considered safer than the previous models BCS and the other brands on the market I think you have to use the system. Try selling something you think is good but is "less safe" in consumers minds.

Hey John,

When has that ever stopped BCS? Do you stock the new 710? How much is it like the old 710, made less than 10 years ago? They easily could have called it the 716, which is what it is...

TimberXX · Feb 23, 2012

farmerboybill said:
Hey All,

I'm off to what is considered by some to be "the" organic farming conference - MOSES Organic Farming Conference in la Crosse, WI February 23, 24, and 25th. BCS usually shows up with 5 or 6 machines with various attachments to represent their line. I hope to see a 740 powersafe there and give a report on what I think when I get home. They don't give demonstrations, but maybe I can ask to be allowed to drive it back to the truck when the conference is over...

If anyone is going, I hope to see you there.

Bill in WI

Looking forward to your report back.

I saw a BCS youtube video and there was a quick reverse lever on the handle bars (it was red). Does the new powersafe model have this feature?

BCSSHOP · Feb 23, 2012

The red handle in the right hand handle is the same quick reverse control as on the current BCS 732 and 853. The lever is gated so the lever cannot mistakenly go from forward to reverse without intentionally moving the control. The black handle on the right hand side is the differential lock control. The black handle on the left hand side is the parking brake.

BCSSHOP · Feb 23, 2012

farmerboybill said:
Hey John,

When has that ever stopped BCS? Do you stock the new 710? How much is it like the old 710, made less than 10 years ago? They easily could have called it the 716, which is what it is...

Hello Bill,

I think the performance of the new 710 is another topic not related to Powersafe discussion. Who cares what it is called if if performs well. Enjoy your show. The New York State Farm show has great attendance the first day and all the BCS's are on display. Any one who wants to study the new models is welcome to come by the NY State Fairgrounds at the International Pavilion and to run any model when we load up Saturday at 4PM. Informed customers and users is always our #1 goal.

Bentleg · Feb 24, 2012

I kinda think BCS calls it a 710 to fit in their new lineup....710, 720, 730, 740, etc.
Let me repeat an earlier question....with a diesel, how long do they run on after you release the red lever? I'm asking about the current non hydraulic clutch models.

BCSSHOP · Feb 24, 2012

The BCS 853 model with the diesel engine runs only as long as the engine takes to stop turning when the fuel is shutoff. This about one second if the engine is at idle and 4 to 5 seconds if the engine is at full speed. The engine will stop quicker if there is a load on the engine by the attachment. Also the engine will take longer to stop when running the chipper/shredder as the 37lb flywheel in the chipper must be stopped by the engine as well as just the engine, unless the clutch is squeezed.

1903 island · Feb 25, 2012

Hi. would the new 730 powersafe ED mod. be here this year

farmerboybill · Feb 26, 2012

Hey All,

They did not have a powersafe at the MOSES show. Last year, they had 6 or 7 machines - including the 948 and new-for-2011 710 (716 from 8 years ago) - with various attachments - including the new woodsplitter. It was a very nice display and a good opportunity to see what they had to offer. This years display was a couple smaller machines plus a 732 and 853 with tiller and rotary plow. They had very little information on the powersafe clutch.

I have to say that I am certainly against these completely taking the place of the cone clutch currently offered. The cone clutch could stand to be re-engineered (15 years overdue) to eliminate the troublesome sticking issue, but it is a proven, durable, excellent quality clutch.

The new powersafe clutch was only brought into production to comply with EU safety standards and one reason for them to bring it here could be to eliminate having two product lines. It needlessly complicates the machine. As Clytle said, it makes the machine less functional due to the loss of transport gear. I use transport gear all the time on my 850 to get from point A to point B, even without a sulky trailer - just set the throttle at idle and brisk walk behind it. The warranty on the clutch is 5 years. The clutch itself is NONserviceable (like the current cone clutch), so you'll be buying a complete clutch if this one fails after 5 years. The simple and proven cone clutch is around $200. I can't imagine how expensive the powersafe clutch will be. Also, BCS America is eating several hundred dollars of the cost of the new 740 and 750. Next year, I doubt they will continue to do so.

If you agree with me, you should call or email BCS America right now and voice your concerns. Once they drop the cone clutch and offer only the powersafe clutch, it'll be too late. I may be wrong (as I have been on this thread a couple times already), but I think they plan on dropping the cone clutch completely on the new machines. A bunch of calls and emails could prevent this from happening.