Supercut50/Forcecut50D vs PowerPlasma50/Forcecut50i

[Sublifer]

I'm thinking about getting myself a Supercut50 or Forcecut50D plasma cutter. I am not going to run it commercially but I do think that between myself and my brother-in-law that we could certainly put it to use.

So, what is the big difference between the 50D and 50i and the supercut vs powerplasma. I see the infineon inverter in the more expensive models. Do the others not run on inverters? Or is it a cheaper inverter? Looking them back up it does look like they are all inverter models... So is an infineon inverter worth that much more?

I see on longevity that the 50D can run from a 5000watt generator and that is very appealing. Not sure exactly why a 50amp Infineon inverter model is rated to use 6500watts vs the less expensive 50amp model? :confused2:

 

[jimcolt]

These units are all inverters.....some use FET's (field effect transistors) and some use IGBT's (insulated gat bipolar transistors) as the high speed switching devices in the inverter circuitry. These import systems have had issues with reliability....and so most of the importers are mentioning the brand names of the IGBT's or FET's that their supplier is building the power supplies with....trying to improve their reliability image. These units are built by various factories in China....and to keep costs procure components from a variety of sources. Generally these units will cut metal.....but from a cut quality, operating cost (cheap torch consumables....but the consumables wear much faster) and reliability perspective they are not comparable with the major brand (more expensive) plasma systems. If you need a plasma cutter...and your budget fits....then they may be worth the risk.

Keep in mind that there are many used major brand plasma systems on the market (craigslist, ebay, local classifieds) that can be bought for the same price...and have factory tech service and parts support that is second to none! Look for 40 amp major brand units....such as the Hypertherm Powermax600....they will cut circles around the imports of 50 and 60 amp output, are more reliable, cheaper to operate. A used Powermax600 can often be found in the $500 to $800 range.


Jim

I'm thinking about getting myself a Supercut50 or Forcecut50D plasma cutter. I am not going to run it commercially but I do think that between myself and my brother-in-law that we could certainly put it to use.

So, what is the big difference between the 50D and 50i and the supercut vs powerplasma. I see the infineon inverter in the more expensive models. Do the others not run on inverters? Or is it a cheaper inverter? Looking them back up it does look like they are all inverter models... So is an infineon inverter worth that much more?

I see on longevity that the 50D can run from a 5000watt generator and that is very appealing. Not sure exactly why a 50amp Infineon inverter model is rated to use 6500watts vs the less expensive 50amp model? :confused2:

 

[Sublifer]

These units are all inverters.....some use FET's (field effect transistors) and some use IGBT's (insulated gat bipolar transistors) as the high speed switching devices in the inverter circuitry. These import systems have had issues with reliability....and so most of the importers are mentioning the brand names of the IGBT's or FET's that their supplier is building the power supplies with....trying to improve their reliability image. These units are built by various factories in China....and to keep costs procure components from a variety of sources. Generally these units will cut metal.....but from a cut quality, operating cost (cheap torch consumables....but the consumables wear much faster) and reliability perspective they are not comparable with the major brand (more expensive) plasma systems. If you need a plasma cutter...and your budget fits....then they may be worth the risk.

Keep in mind that there are many used major brand plasma systems on the market (craigslist, ebay, local classifieds) that can be bought for the same price...and have factory tech service and parts support that is second to none! Look for 40 amp major brand units....such as the Hypertherm Powermax600....they will cut circles around the imports of 50 and 60 amp output, are more reliable, cheaper to operate. A used Powermax600 can often be found in the $500 to $800 range.
Jim

Good info there. The explanation ofr FET vs IGBT helped a lot. I do have some electronics experience so I recognize gated transistors as the newer and I guess better, technology. Not that I really know how and why but I'll leave that for electronics engineers. Consumables would be a good thing to check. Hopefully the everlast and longevity units share consumables with the major brands.
As much as I'd like to buy a used major brand unit, people around here aren't selling or are plain retarded. First finding a unit for sale is few and far between. Second, most of the time they are trying to sell them at new or higher than new prices (e.g. a hypertherm 1250 for $2900). So it really seems I'm going to be limited to an off-brand unit.

 

[crazyal]

I have the powerplasma 60 and while it would have been nice to buy an American made model there are just too many other things that I wanted before I could commit to spending the extra money. I did look used but all I found were units that had been in the shop of a welding company and showed it.

Consumable life isn't too much of an issue for me since I don't use it that much. The quality of the cut also means little to me. If free hand cutting my hand is the weak link and if I use a guide for cutting it's my ability to drag the cutter and a steady pace that effects the cut the most.

I can't say anything about the Longevity units but there are plenty of us here on TBN who own Everlast units and I don't think I've heard of anyone having a problem with one.

 

[evo803]

I have a power plasma 50 and can say nothing bad about it. I made a pantograph for it and the cut quality is excellent ,hardly ever need to hit it with a grinder. It is not in a commercial setting but it has had some long days of use cutting up thick plate ( 1/4" to 1/2" thick) for projects. Even if I spent more money for it I would still be just as happy with it .

 

[Sublifer]

Good to hear the power plasmas are liked. Has anyone tried a Supercut 50 or forcecut 50D? Or the 40 amp versions?

 

[jimcolt]

The imported units generally use torches that are copies of older technology....such as the 30 year old Esab PT31 torch design, as well as newer Italian built Trafimet torches. The consumables are quite different from the latest torch technology. Good consumable life is about 50% torch technology and 50% power supply technology...so while low cost plasma systems cut metal....don't expect cut quality, cut speed or consumable life to match the more costly major brand units.

Still....if you want a low cost plasma....these units and the used market are good places to look.

The Powermax1250's sold for over $4k new....and hold their value very well. It is an 80 amp unit made in the US by Hypertherm...operates on any voltage between 190 and 600, single or three phase. I have seen a few used ones in the $1800 range....but usually are higher.


Jim

Good info there. The explanation ofr FET vs IGBT helped a lot. I do have some electronics experience so I recognize gated transistors as the newer and I guess better, technology. Not that I really know how and why but I'll leave that for electronics engineers. Consumables would be a good thing to check. Hopefully the everlast and longevity units share consumables with the major brands.
As much as I'd like to buy a used major brand unit, people around here aren't selling or are plain retarded. First finding a unit for sale is few and far between. Second, most of the time they are trying to sell them at new or higher than new prices (e.g. a hypertherm 1250 for $2900). So it really seems I'm going to be limited to an off-brand unit.

 

[jake98]

With my Everlast Power Plasma 70, I'm on my second or third nozzle. First one I didn't have a good water separator and just made about a hundred short 2" cuts in some rusty angle for practice (and amazement..). Then I cut a channel out of my dump trailer and cut the pieces to replace it, plus some other small cuts and a cast iron wood stove door just for fun. Not to mention turning it on and off fifty times before I heard that was bad for it. The big box of consumables cost me around a hundred, looks like it should be more than I'll ever need.

 

[eastexan]

These units are all inverters.....some use FET's (field effect transistors) and some use IGBT's (insulated gat bipolar transistors) as the high speed switching devices in the inverter circuitry. These import systems have had issues with reliability....and so most of the importers are mentioning the brand names of the IGBT's or FET's that their supplier is building the power supplies with....trying to improve their reliability image. These units are built by various factories in China....and to keep costs procure components from a variety of sources. Generally these units will cut metal.....but from a cut quality, operating cost (cheap torch consumables....but the consumables wear much faster) and reliability perspective they are not comparable with the major brand (more expensive) plasma systems. If you need a plasma cutter...and your budget fits....then they may be worth the risk.

Keep in mind that there are many used major brand plasma systems on the market (craigslist, ebay, local classifieds) that can be bought for the same price...and have factory tech service and parts support that is second to none! Look for 40 amp major brand units....such as the Hypertherm Powermax600....they will cut circles around the imports of 50 and 60 amp output, are more reliable, cheaper to operate. A used Powermax600 can often be found in the $500 to $800 range.


Jim

Jim, is the FET's the same as MOSFET's?
If they are, I think I would avoid getting a machine with those.

Seems like I've heard that the MOSFET's were an older technology in the imports and were far more unreliable than the IGBT's. I've heard that most of the new machines have the IGBT's.

 

[crazyal]

Jim, is the FET's the same as MOSFET's?
If they are, I think I would avoid getting a machine with those.

Seems like I've heard that the MOSFET's were an older technology in the imports and were far more unreliable than the IGBT's. I've heard that most of the new machines have the IGBT's.

Actually IGBT (Insulated Gate Bipolar Transistors) are just one type of FET, MOSFET (metal Oxide Semiconductor Field Effect Transistors) are another type. IGBT is a newer invention than MOSFET and can handle high power better. They are fast becoming the replacement for the old stand by iron core copper wound transformer in power supplies.