Cutter pump C140/FTX140

[tonyoz]

Has anyone had a problem with the cutterpump on these machines and what was the diagnosis? Yesterday I got a bad rattle and lost flow and pressure in mine.:mur:

 

[WestshoreConstruction]

Has anyone had a problem with the cutterpump on these machines and what was the diagnosis? Yesterday I got a bad rattle and lost flow and pressure in mine.:mur:

Might want to check the pump drive. Any noise and subsequent loss of anything usually isn't good on a mulcher.

 

[cat 297c]

This may or may not be your problem but last year I was on a job when my pump started loosen flow then spiking back up an kept doing this over an over also creating an rattle, then all the sudden had nothing going to the head. Got out expecting the worst, checked an found there was a safety switch going to the cutter pump that must have vibrated lose then feel out put it back in an, back to normal. Hope this helps

 

[tonyoz]

Well I've talked to some hydraulic people today and the consensus of opinion is to change the filters then pressure and flow test. Fair go, it would be just about easier to find rockinghorse poo than get these filters,got to be air freighted in. Cat, tried your suggestion and that plug is all good,thanks.

 

[tonyoz]

Well I found why the pump was rattling.:smiley_aafz: Its the 4th 140 thats done this that I know about and all near the same hrs

 

[APSmulching]

Hard to tell, but looks like a roller bearing failure. How many hours are on your 140?

 

[DIRTROAD]

Looks expensive!!!! How many hours?

 

[tonyoz]

Looks expensive!!!! How many hours?

Just on 3000hrs, expensive? **** yer been told to budget $20,000 for new pump and labor. Bloody heartbreaking I can tell you. It's just as well for some people I don't live near Ohio.

 

[tonyoz]

Hard to tell, but looks like a roller bearing failure. How many hours are on your 140?

I would be pure speculation to the cause, the rotating group is so smashed up we cannot pin point to any one thing.
It's the 4th one of these to do this in Australia that I know about ,all about the same hours

 

[oldnslo]

Have you ever changed the filters on this unit? I presume their are charge pump filters and if they start to plug it can cause this type of damage. Suspect one of the slippers failed and scrapped the rest of the unit.

You will also have to inspect and probably replace all of the hydraulic motors on this unit also. All that debris went somewhere.

Roy

 

[tonyoz]

Have you ever changed the filters on this unit? I presume their are charge pump filters and if they start to plug it can cause this type of damage. Suspect one of the slippers failed and scrapped the rest of the unit.

You will also have to inspect and probably replace all of the hydraulic motors on this unit also. All that debris went somewhere.

Roy

This machine has been meticulously maintained with all filter changes done on time.Roy this is 1 of 5 pumps and is on a closed loop curcuit. We have checked the rest of the machine and it looks like all the debrie has been contained in the filters and pump

 

[cat 297c]

Sorry to hear that bud, maybe u need to get that awi rt 200. That u have been telling me bout

 

[tonyoz]

To dam broke to think of any thing else but getting what we got working. Had time to think of a new name it. Now called BOHICA which stands for
Bend Over Here It Comes Again

 

[DIRTROAD]

Now called BOHICA which stands for
Bend Over Here It Comes Again

I Love it!!! I have two or three things that will have a new name now!!!

 

[oldnslo]

This machine has been meticulously maintained with all filter changes done on time.Roy this is 1 of 5 pumps and is on a closed loop curcuit. We have checked the rest of the machine and it looks like all the debrie has been contained in the filters and pump

Tony,Glad to hear the ret of the machine is OK. All to often one unit fails and it wipes out all of them.

Hard to tell from the pictures but do the slippers have rolled edges Vs being smooth wear they contact the swash plate.

Do the slippers have wear on the underside where they contact the slipper retaining plate.

If yes to the above it sounds like you may be experiencing slipper lift under certain conditions. This can be from excessive speed, cold oil, weakening load springs, or a combination of factors. This will cause the slippers to wear unevenly, puts extra stress on the retaining plate.

I f you know of 4 machines that have failed with similar hours and the same exact failure, I would looking at trying to determine why.

Out of curiosity do you know what brand of pump this is? I.e. Sauer Danfoss, Rexroth, Parker, etc.
Model number of pump:
what the operating conditions are? Operating speed in RPM, Operating pressure, Oil type and weight.
is this closed loop hydrostatic drive to cutter head.

With this info, someone might be able to provide you with a possible cause of failure.

Roy

 

[tonyoz]

Tony,Glad to hear the ret of the machine is OK. All to often one unit fails and it wipes out all of them.

Hard to tell from the pictures but do the slippers have rolled edges Vs being smooth wear they contact the swash plate.

Do the slippers have wear on the underside where they contact the slipper retaining plate.

If yes to the above it sounds like you may be experiencing slipper lift under certain conditions. This can be from excessive speed, cold oil, weakening load springs, or a combination of factors. This will cause the slippers to wear unevenly, puts extra stress on the retaining plate.

I f you know of 4 machines that have failed with similar hours and the same exact failure, I would looking at trying to determine why.

Out of curiosity do you know what brand of pump this is? I.e. Sauer Danfoss, Rexroth, Parker, etc.
Model number of pump:
what the operating conditions are? Operating speed in RPM, Operating pressure, Oil type and weight.
is this closed loop hydrostatic drive to cutter head.

With this info, someone might be able to provide you with a possible cause of failure.

Roy

It is an Eaton 6422, max RPM 2500,oil Castrol AWH68,pressure was reset to 3800psi down form 5800psi on delivery, and closed loop to cutter head.

 

[oldnslo]

Tony,
I looked at the specs on this pump and the only thing that is even borderline is the pressure setting. The catalog spec is 240 bar (3480 PSI) continuos. Input speed and oil are both fine.

Without putting transducers on your machine while in service, it would be pure guess work as to what is causing the failures.

best of luck

Roy

 

[tonyoz]

Tony,
I looked at the specs on this pump and the only thing that is even borderline is the pressure setting. The catalog spec is 240 bar (3480 PSI) continuous. Input speed and oil are both fine.

Without putting transducers on your machine while in service, it would be pure guess work as to what is causing the failures.

best of luck

Roy

Roy, it is my intention to hire a Hydac computer mapping system to find exactly what is going on in the closed loop circuit.I take it from your last post is that this pump should not have been fitted as part of the OEM package!

 

[cat 297c]

Love the new name tonyoz, but I think that stands off all Equipment now don't think there is any manufacturers out there who give a rip anymore. All they care bout is getting it off the assembly line a fast as possible an on the lots to sell an sick it to folks. Last year I talked to a bobcat mechanic who told me its not uncommon to get brand new machines in that are pouring oil, not functional at all then they have to go threw it in order to get them running.

 

[oldnslo]

Roy, it is my intention to hire a Hydac computer mapping system to find exactly what is going on in the closed loop circuit.I take it from your last post is that this pump should not have been fitted as part of the OEM package!

Tony,
Intermittent pressure rating on that pump is 5000 PSI or more. I am not saying the pump was incorrectly applied I am saying some operating feature seems to be causing premature failure. The fact that four of these have failed with similar hours makes me question what is causing this. Most pumps use 10,000 hours as a design point for their bearing life. So if you are only getting 3000, this again points to some application or operation feature that is causing premature failures.

I suspect Eaton has 1,000's of these units in the field so if they where junk there would more than four failures being reported.

Roy