Day Time Running Lights!

[Domush]

should be the law EVERYWHERE. Wish it was here as well.

I [have] no problem with "YOU" running all-season (summer) tires in winter so long as you can guarantee me that you wont take me out as a result of your cheapness/stupidity when winter comes and you shoot off into the ditch. We all know that is an impossible guarantee to make, therefore legislation is required to force you to have at least the proper tires to be somewhat safe.

And you cannot guarantee me even driving a tank will keep you from running into me when you hit black ice. So maybe we should ban driving altogether. After all, that is the only way to GUARANTEE no auto accidents. All of these silly fear mongering arguments are the same. "Oh, think of the children!" "500 people PER YEAR die from this and such!" (when hundreds of thousands die from smoking and diabetes every year, yet junk food and cigarettes are legal). If you hate the "ra ra freedom" types, there are plenty of theocracies and dictatorships to live under. Better yet, buy everyone you see winter tires if you see bald tires, then it'll be just like you live in that dictatorship you always wanted.

Several years ago there was a young girl that went off the road here killing her 2 children.. the cause? worn, "all season" tires on a slushy day. Im sure she would gladly give the several hundred dollars for winters if she could have her kids back today.

And? So, everyone should be required to own two sets of tires because some idiot refuses to drive safely? Nice slippery slope argument. What about slip and fall injuries? Should everyone be mandated to wear cleats in winter? How about helmets when walking? There are thousands of deaths and head injuries every year from simple slip and fall accidents. Don't forget your helmet when you leave the house (or we'll imprison you)!

There are laws against endangering others on the books today. Making redundant laws which only serve to add costs to otherwise safe drivers is exactly what the government is not for.

 

[Scooby074]

Its not a slippery slope argument to have certain minimum requirements to drive a vehicle on public highways.

Do you have MVI's in Kentucky? If so, the Government (oooh boogeyman) has set a minimum set of requirements for a vehicle to be allowed on the road. Would you like to be on the roads with guys running their cars minus the front brakes? Or perhaps ones with broken steering?

Winter tires.. for WINTER.. is just part of these rules. Makes sense dont it? Snow tires for snow?

Remember driving isnt a right.. and the government is well within their powers to set the rules we citizens have to abide by to travel the roads. Be it in licensing, health requirements or vehicle safety equipment.

 

[JasG]

Lots of claims thrown out but I have seen little in the way of facts. Below is what I have found and I see little harm in having a set of lights on. Around here so many hills and road lined with trees I over time have gotten to a point I run with lights on all the time. I feel there have been fewer times some one pulls out and created a near miss. Still have people who will cut you off, or not stop, they tend to not even look. I just took a trip with the family and did most of my driving around dusk and the number of people running with no lights even after dark is amazing.

It just makes you stand out that little extra IMO that can make a difference.

http://www-nrd.nhtsa.dot.gov/pdf/esv/esv19/05-0178-W.pdf

In Australia bright yellow DRLs should be permitted
on motorcycles but should continue to be disallowed
on other vehicles. These would be far more effective
as DRLs than headlights and have the potential to
reduce fatal motorcycle crashes by more than 13%.

http://www-nrd.nhtsa.dot.gov/Pubs/811029.pdf


http://www-nrd.nhtsa.dot.gov/Pubs/809760.pdf

Conclusions
The effectiveness of daytime running lamps, based on the simple odds, was analyzed in the preceding
sections using data from FARS and NASS/GES from calendar years 1995 to 2001. FARS and
NASS/GES data show that during the period of the study 1995 to 2001, DRLs reduced daylight two
passenger vehicle opposite-direction crashes by about 5 percent. DRLs have also been shown to
reduce fatal opposite direction crashes between a motorcycle and a passenger vehicle by 23 percent.
The results for two-vehicle daytime opposite-direction crashes are statistically significant at the p < 0.10
level, although one would prefer a statistical level of

 

[Domush]

Its not a slippery slope argument to have certain minimum requirements to drive a vehicle on public highways.

Wrong, it is, because the 'minimum' can be expanded infinitely up to not allowing any vehicles on the roads, no matter how slow, equipped and fluffy it is.

Do you have MVI's in Kentucky?

No, we don't, because there are already laws which hold those who get into accidents responsible for them. It is the driver's responsibility to ensure they do not get into an accident. If they do, they are held accountable. You know, that icky freedom and personal responsibility thing you want abolished.

Would you like to be on the roads with guys running their cars minus the front brakes? Or perhaps ones with broken steering?

If they are driving to their equipment's abilities I have no issue with it. If they are endangering others by driving beyond the abilities of the car, then it is already illegal, and they will be cited/arrested accordingly, under already existing laws. Bald tires during rain/snow are already covered under these laws.

Winter tires.. for WINTER.. is just part of these rules. Makes sense [doesn't] it? Snow tires for snow?

Wow, what logic.. Mandating something by calling it the same name as the season. So, are you also for mandating mud tires on all dirt roads during and after rain? MUD tires for MUD! Should make for quite the garage full of tires. What about OFF-ROAD tires for entering and exiting your driveway, which is OFF THE ROAD? Then there are ALL-SEASON tires for.. wait for it.. ALL SEASONS. I may be mistaken, but I think winter is a season. But that doesn't fit your dictatorship argument, so we'll just pretend that one doesn't exist. BUT THINK OF THE CHILDREN! Phew, people almost realized how empty your argument was for a second there.

Remember driving isn't a right.. and the government is well within their powers to set the rules we citizens have to abide by to travel the roads. Be it in licensing, health requirements or vehicle safety equipment.

The government is well within its powers to imprison you without trial, jury, legal counsel or even a hearing, indefinitely. I have the ABILITY to do many things I would be an absolute jerk in doing. So, what's your point? Are you honestly condoning people to do anything they are legally allowed to do? This is your argument? "They should because they can"?

 

[Scooby074]

If you have no issues with people driving on the same highways as you without proper brakes / safety equipment.. etc etc. then your a bigger man than me.. I have all kinds of problems with that, both for my safety and the safety of my kids, whether in my car or walking the sidewalk.

To say they'll be held accountable for their vehicles deficiencies AFTER they kill me or my children wont do much to bring either of us back, now will it?

MVI's ensuring that vehicles are safe is the bare minimum, cops (and the DoT) here also have the ability to impound and inspect vehicles for deficiencies, which they do, but their numbers and time are limited, garage MVI's take most of the load off. I dont know how your local authorities can possible notice and inspect all the defective vehicles in your area.

 

[WilliamBos]

It makes total sense. But for folks that may not see much snow, it is real easy to argue against it.

Its not a slippery slope argument to have certain minimum requirements to drive a vehicle on public highways.

Do you have MVI's in Kentucky? If so, the Government (oooh boogeyman) has set a minimum set of requirements for a vehicle to be allowed on the road. Would you like to be on the roads with guys running their cars minus the front brakes? Or perhaps ones with broken steering?

Winter tires.. for WINTER.. is just part of these rules. Makes sense dont it? Snow tires for snow?

Remember driving isnt a right.. and the government is well within their powers to set the rules we citizens have to abide by to travel the roads. Be it in licensing, health requirements or vehicle safety equipment.

 

[Domush]

Not that I care one way or the other on DRL, so long as I can override them when desired, the studies people are quoting are all older and less complete than the most recent NTSB study (included as a link by JasG, but interestingly left out of the quotes):

The analysis found that DRLs have no statistically significant overall effects on the three target crashes. When combining
these three target crashes into one target crash, the DRL effects were also not statistically significant. When examined
separately for passenger cars and light trucks/vans (LTVs), DRLs in LTVs significantly reduced LTVs’ involvements in the
target two-vehicle crashes by 5.7 percent. However, the remaining DRL effects on these three target crashes were not
statistically significant. Although not statistically significant, DRLs might have unintended consequences for pedestrians and
motorcyclists. Particularly, the estimated negative effects for LTVs were relatively large and cannot be completely ignored.

Emphasis is mine, but clearly shows not everything is rainbows and laughing babies with DRL mandates.

 

[JasG]

Not that I care one way or the other on DRL, so long as I can override them when desired, the studies people are quoting are all older and less complete than the most recent NTSB study (included as a link by JasG, but interestingly left out of the quotes):



Emphasis is mine, but clearly shows not everything is rainbows and laughing babies with DRL mandates.

I don't think anyone is saying they are a perfect solution or have an effect in all condtions, yet in many cases they do have a positive effect.

 

[oldyellr]

Winter tires.. for WINTER.. is just part of these rules. Makes sense [doesn't] it? Snow tires for snow?

Wow, what logic.. Mandating something by calling it the same name as the season. So, are you also for mandating mud tires on all dirt roads during and after rain? MUD tires for MUD! Should make for quite the garage full of tires.

No, "winter tires" are a specific tread and rubber designed for snow and ice and cold temperatures. They carry this symbol:

Many people used to think that so-called "all season" tires were okay for year 'round use, but they're quite dangerous in winter conditions. We call them "no season" tires. But you'll always get people who try to circumvent safety regulations such as DRLs and winter tires just to assert their "freedom".

 

[cqaigy2]

This isn't about DRL, but i hate it that i turn on my defrost and my air conditioner turns on. Was that the government that did that?