Could a Aussie tell us how your Government confiscated your guns?

[TripleR]

@ hchxoom:

It was not my intention to be condescending. The question was phrased from a point of view of someone that does not for a second understand the 2A and everything associated with it but it trying. I appreciate your response, it helped, Triple R: I know you were trying also.

Unfortunately, from an outsider's point of view there were many following comments that to me read (with a big puffy chest) "I'm an American and I can do what I want 'cause I say so". As someone else said, sanity is subjective. US (and others) are quick to label Middle Eastern views as "insane" yet heaven forbid ask a question about something American?

I'm not against gun ownership. I don't understand the needs or desires to have a loaded one in every room of the house. I'm certainly not so naive to think that gun control will eliminate crime. I do think that controlling/limiting access would significantly reduce the opportunity for someone to go on a killing spree with legal guns. A pistol for protection? I disagree but can accept. A handful of rifles for hunting? I'm good with that (different game needs different gun right?) A loaded assault rifle? You loose me there. More ammo on hand than the local PD? I don't get that either.

My original question still stands: Is there similar gun (un)regulation to the US and mass shootings anywhere else in the world? It's just a question about fact, nothing about beliefs or rights or anything else.

I had pretty much dropped out of this thread and even written a few fairly long responses then thought "Naw, not worth it", deleted and moved on to just reading, but you mentioned my name and feel compelled to post something even if it's not totally responsive.

I really don't know how to even address, "I'm an American and I can do what I want 'cause I say so", but if you can point to the genesis of this "impressions", I might be able to help. Taken by itself without qualification it sounds pretty offensive of an evaluation, so an explanation may be helpful. I suppose I could say from reading the posts from Australians and Canadians, "Well, I'm from Australia, Canada and we have fixed all of our problems and don't understand why you blood thirty, paranoid Americans are just too dumb to understand how wrong you are, all you have to do is be just like us."

I could not disagree more with "As someone else said, sanity is subjective." I have committed people for mental evaluations, attended competency hearings, administrated screening evaluations and read more psychiatric reports than you can imagine. I supervised people who worked with the mentally ill and worked with many myself. To be "insane" a person has to meet several legal criteria and is anything but a capricious designation. This whole thing has been the subject of legislative attempts in this country in the past and some legislators wanted to deny a large section of our population including veterans who were involved in group counseling from firearms ownership. There are of course legitimate concerns, but extreme caution must be used and blanket statements rarely are accurate.

"I don't understand the needs or desires to have a loaded one in every room of the house." I don't either and right now it would probably take me ten to twenty minutes to get to any kind of gun and would have to get into a safe to do it or travel to the other end of a fairly large home. It doesn't bother me however if someone else feels the need or has the desire. If I felt the need to have access to a gun which I did for many years, I just carried it on me. When I came home, I just didn't take my gun off and I always knew where it was.

"A loaded assault rifle" You are obviously not alone, but I have no problem with it and am use to it as they are so common where I live, no one really pays much attention to them, just a cultural thing. I lived many years without one and can do so again if necessary, I just feel neither I nor my weapons present a danger and will keep them. I my sons and grandson all enjoy shooting them, so that's enough for us. My sons have military experience and became use to using them there and my grandson is enlisted in the Army where he will go upon graduation from high school. They all hunt with bolt action rifles.

"More ammo on hand than the local PD" Many of us have found that buying in bulk is much cheaper and as a result may have quite a bit on hand. Some have also found that a group of people may just want to go shooting one day and you need ammo to do that. If you shoot for fun, competition or to maintain a certain level of proficiency, you are going to need ammo and we have pretty much all gone to the store and found they were out of ammo. I have over 600 gallons of diesel on hand at any one time and prefer not to buy "as needed", I see it no differently with ammo. Oh, I also try to keep a supply of food on hand as we live in an earthquake zone and have power outages with storms.

My original question still stands: Is there similar gun (un)regulation to the US and mass shootings anywhere else in the world? It's just a question about fact, nothing about beliefs or rights or anything else. No to be rude or dismissive, but I honestly don't care, I don't live anywhere else and as I have said, I really don't think you can compare countries. One of my deleted posts went into demographics, population densities, cultural differences etc., but I got bored, too much like work and if you read very much of this you will literally die of boredom.

I am retired and intend to stay that way, if you are all that interested in it then by all means have at it, do the research and educate us. In the end, it will not change my mind or I imagine many others.

As I have told other posters, we just seem to disagree and I can live with that.

No intention to be rude, dismissive or disrespectful and if I have come across that way, I apologize.

 

[tcartwri]

My original question still stands: Is there similar gun (un)regulation to the US and mass shootings anywhere else in the world? It's just a question about fact, nothing about beliefs or rights or anything else.

We have had our share, yes. Nothing compared to the US though.

The most infamous in recent times, Marc_Lépine

Another of significance, Mayerthorpe

The first being with a mini-14, the second with a koch 91.

 

[DieselnHooters]

Exactly my point, Diesel. The words we use can create a visceral response, so we need to consider how a post will be received and not be offended if the response we get seems over-the-top (usually it stems from the reader perceiving our comments differentlu than we intended). Your reaction to my post proves my point. You took the quoted comment as a statement if fact... I intended it as a sample of something that could be misconstrued as an affront.

OK gotcha, anywho dont try that 1812 skit again. I have a .22 and upward of 50 bullets...consider yourself warned lol

 

[hchxoom]

I don't know why you think this is a uniquely American thing.

I dont know whether it is or isn't. I was simply explaining why gun ownership is important to many Americans to someone who didn't understand, and why changing the landscape in the US is not a simple thing as it may be in other places where guns aren't a fond part of day-to-day lives. Perhaps in war-torn or high violence areas, the opposite is true... but those of us in more rural America don't associate guns at all with violence. If your experience is similar, great... we have something in common. I certainly didnt/dont mean to imply any exclusivity... indeed, a big part of the culture I'm describing is about sharing common experiences, so the more the merrier. I wish everyone could grow up with access to and respect for guns... I think the world would be much safer and more tolerant. Unfortunately, in manyparts of the world gun ownership is restricted to agencies of govt, the uberwealthy, and ruling classes... so John Q Public only knows of them through acts of aggression and violence and is fearful of them.

 

[hchxoom]

OK gotcha, anywho dont try that 1812 skit again. I have a .22 and upward of 50 bullets...consider yourself warned lol

In my best redneck rendition: "I ain't skeered!"

 

[crazyal]

A comment like this will lose Australian contribution to the debate.

Australia is close to the size of mainland USA.

Texas would be considered a SMALL state here..:laughing:

You have to work out your own method of gun control. As I said in one of my earlier posts I doubt an Australian style system would work or for that matter any "imported" method of gun control. You have to work out your own system.

The one thing that would worry as a parent is the thought of armed security guards at schools becoming involved with some crazy with a rifle resulting in a fire fight in school grounds.

Just remember, more people live in Texas than all of Australia.

 

[CDN Farm Boy]

I suppose I could say from reading the posts from Australians and Canadians, "Well, I'm from Australia, Canada and we have fixed all of our problems and don't understand why you blood thirty, paranoid Americans are just too dumb to understand how wrong you are, all you have to do is be just like us."

Certainly not my thought. Our Governments (all levels) and legal system are as screwed up as any other. And I would guess that by population we have as many nut-jobs as anywhere else. Post # 12/13 is a good example of what/why I don't understand. I'm the type of person to whom acceptance (even with disagreement) is much easier with understanding. Perhaps I don't know how to ask the questions to get the answers to help me with that.

 

[crazyal]

I've never been to Australia but it looks like a wonderful country. I have no issues what so ever with how they regulate guns. But they are a perfect example of why gun control laws aren't the solution. Gun violence has not dropped as was expected with the passing of gun control laws. Sure the US has a homicide rate of 4.8 people out of 100k while Australia is a little under 2. But that number has to be compared to historical data to get the big picture. Here's a few charts for Australia's government.


The second chart clearly shows that, as a culture, Australia's rate of using guns to commit homicide was falling long before the gun laws that passed after 1996. If anything the last couple of years the graph is flattening out where as if the gun control laws worked it should be dropping more. One would further need to look at places where the rates are high as well as who tends to commit the crimes to get an even clearer picture. You would then need to look at other factors like poverty and unemployment rates. Then. of course, you need to factor in population density figures.

 

[bobm6996]

I have read all of the posts on this thread and it is needless to say there are many opinions. When it comes to gun control the point that should be made is never mentioned. How does a crazy person get a gun to do horrible things to innocent people? The most recent shooting in the US was carried out by a kid who was not mentally stable, his parent knew that and yet he was able to access guns. The most important factor in having the right to own a weapon or weapons is being responsible. I have many guns, strongly support my right and the rights of others to have them, but I solely own the responsibility for the ownership. I no longer have children at home, but I do have grandchildren here quite often, so my guns are secure in a gun safe (not a gun cabinet) that only my wife and I have access to open. I also have a small bio-metric pistol safe in the bedroom for quick access in the event we need to protect ourselves from an invader, but again only my wife and I can open it.

I don't know where things are going in this country regarding gun laws, but if they try to control guns then we will go back to the prohibition days when alcohol was not legal; organized crime will buy guns illegally and sell them to anyone who has the money to buy them. And if you go to that much trouble to find a way to buy one and have the money to do it, you are more than likely buying it for a reason other than hunting or target practice.

I served this great nation for 26 years in the military and from that and the manner in which I was raised on the farm I fully understand how to be a responsible gun owner and DO NOT WANT TO GIVE UP THAT RIGHT! There are many dangers in our lives each and every day and we can't outlaw everything in life that causes bad outcomes.

Parents need to be parents again like my generation was raised, we got our butt whooped when we deserved it and my parents did not have to worry about government child services showing up at the door to charge them with child abuse. We learned respect and right from wrong very quickly at a very young age and no matter how many times I got my butt whooped I still respected my parents and would rather take another beating than disappoint them. Today parents give timeouts and try to use their college psychology class notes to raise kids, use the book on their butt and you will see a difference. A large number of kids today do not have the level of respect they should (OK, don't start beating me up over that statement, it is my opinion).

Movies and video games have young kids thinking it is cool to see someone get shot or get their face kicked in and it is not. There are no winners in any kind of a violent situation. And a man can not get punched in the face multiple times and keep getting up, nor can he take multiple bullets and keep getting up (they do not understand reality). The kids have become numb to violence.

And finally parents today are too busy working and worrying about what their friends and neighbors think of how they are living their lives than raising their kids. It does not matter how big your house is, how cool your car is or how much money you want people to think you are making. And while the parent is doing all that is important to them the kids are running wild.

Just my two cents worth, but the things going on today are in part because progress can be good and bad along with the parenting methods have changed dramatically and IMHO not for the good.

 

[Gunny]

It would see that at least the posters on here from Australia and Canada all assume that the vast majority of US citizens have loaded weapons with them at all times, with loaded weapons in every room, just in case. Yes, there are a lot of weapons in the US, but then again, our population is much larger than those two countries. Figures lie and liars figure, you can skew numbers based on this and that, but figure the numbers per 1000 people, not just what pops up on the news. Yes, we've had some horrific shootings, but in this day and age with instant worldwide coverage, it appears that we're still in the wild wild west, but, if anyone would take the time to think about it, they don't occur that often. One is too many, I agree, but the whole thing is overblown. As so having an armed person inside a school, even if it was another idiot with a machete hacking up kids, I wouldn't mind having someone with a firearm stopping them. I seriously doubt that anyone here has ever had to go up against someone swinging a machete, I have and there is no doubt in my mind that if I didn't have my service pistol, I wouldn't be alive to be posting this now.
RE the supposed and waited upon gun controls, what do you think the members of our government think about the recent (unheard of) spikes in gun sales? Do they really think all these people are buying up all those firearms and ammo (after paying around twice the usual retail value) just so they can turn them in when asked to do so?
Right now, the LIBs are running on their emotions and that's the wrong frame of mind to be in when you're attempting to institute new laws. Every other part of the constitution has to be ratified before change, yet they just seem to think the 2nd amendment can be changed as easily as a city code.

I realize that this thread asked for information about their gun control and no disrespect to our northern friends or our island allies, but they ain't got no dogs in this fight. They wouldn't appreciate us chipping in on one of theirs.