Explain gold investing to me??

[grsthegreat]

ya, the majority of our national debt is pension and retirement for government employees. its the same reason the post office is going broke.

I cant see how anyone can rely on soc sec or other govt backed pensions to live on. their the first things that will disappear.

I have never counted on seeing 1 dime from soc sec when i reach retirement age. But were set to retire comfortably on what weve squirreled away. Im also debt free...100%, so that really helps.

Im one of those that will never use borrowed money...even if its 0% interest. if i dont have the funds, i dont purchase it. Thats not to mean i dont use credit cards. i use Am express and visa all the time, but pay 100% every month . I love getting the 1 and 2% refund checks every few months.

 

[joemd11]

A book that may be worth reading is " Surviving the economic collapse". It's written by an Argentinian that describes what happened there in 2001 when their economy collapsed. Might be some useful info in there for us to ponder.

Sent from my iPad using TractorByNet

 

[sd455dan]

I would never own paper gold or silver. I own only physical. I am true believer in that you truly only own what you can stand in front of and defend. I don't keep it at my house or in a bank....but it is very secure.

In every other case of fiat currency failure, the country has returned to a gold standard. IMO....the key is to have enough food, water, and ammunition to keep yourself and family safe until there is a currency reset.

Gold of course has value....it is the reason why kings owned it, and every central bank in the world covets it.

I have heard that there has been a tripling of the total paper currency in circulation- all since 2008.

Also that the price of gold has been artificially kept low so if this quantitative easing causes hyper inflation-some say by 2016, won't gold (real gold) not paper gold, be a great investment..??

 

[rmorey]

In Canada no income that you receive counts against your government pension. That of course is assuming that there will still be money left to pay government pensions when the time comes to collect it. Take for example the government workers in Detroit.

Whoa, that's not true. All earned and investment income over a threshold is used to calculate a "clawback" of the government pension plan.

 

[Kryton619]

Good point about money to pay government pensions.

In the USA should/when the US Dollar falls from its current position as the currency of the world I think one's retirement plans should only require 50% of any and all pensions and other retirement money sources. Not sure I will be able to do that but we know pensions, SS, etc are going to be cut over and over at some point in time so everyone gets something.

Living a simple home with low energy requirement, heating with wood, growing meat and other food stuffs may need to be considered in some cases. Over all we will adapt but should a 25% drop in standard of living come to many in the USA it is going to hurt those of us living on the edge today.

No debt will be a requirement if our retirement incomes drop like a rock. The retired person with welding skills and a little shop behind the house make look like a smart person. People with their own businesses can just keep working if they offer the right mix of services perhaps.

Personally I do not expect a total collapses but having a game plan in place if it did happen would make one look sharp.

I agree, having a trade will be a benefit as will be being prepared. It is scary that most people have no more than a weeks worth of groceries in their house.

A book that may be worth reading is " Surviving the economic collapse". It's written by an Argentinian that describes what happened there in 2001 when their economy collapsed. Might be some useful info in there for us to ponder.

Sent from my iPad using TractorByNet

Thanks...I haven't read that yet but certainly will. Here is a fictional account of what it may be like.

I have heard that there has been a tripling of the total paper currency in circulation- all since 2008.

Also that the price of gold has been artificially kept low so if this quantitative easing causes hyper inflation-some say by 2016, won't gold (real gold) not paper gold, be a great investment..??

Of course. There is no longer any free markets left...they are all manipulated. When interest rates are artificially held a at 0% how can there not be consequences? I have seen elderly people who have always had the attitude of spend less then what you earn and put the difference in the bank wiped out. These people are simple folks who have been doing the right thing, but unfortunately they have been slaughtered because inflation is running much higher then the interest that they are receiving. Historically the price of gold reacts inversely to the USD. If gold was allowed to rise without being manipulated, it would make people who typically don't follow such things to start asking questions about the true value of the dollar.

Whoa, that's not true. All earned and investment income over a threshold is used to calculate a "clawback" of the government pension plan.

I stand corrected. I was unaware that there is a threshold. I was under the impression that depending on what you paid into CPP over the course of your life determined what you would receive at retirement. But I guess it shouldn't surprise me. Governments have a way of taking away from people that have worked hard their whole life. Take from the many and give to a few.

 

[TnAndy]

tell me..what prevents the US govt from privatizing GOLD and making it illegal to use as a currency . They have done it before. IZf you believe they can seize our $$$ why not your gold.

They can seize anything you let them seize. That's the reason you hold it, and bury it someplace. Electronic digits in a bank account are real easy to grab....sending somebody out with a metal detector and shovel, not so much

The real reason for the illegal seizure in 1933 was two fold:

1. The planned to devalue the dollar by raising gold price from $20/oz to $35, and needed to make sure the people couldn't take advantage of that.

2. They needed to get rid of the concept of what money really is, thus gold had to go. They did a wonderful job of it.....99% of folks today have no concept of what actual money is, and thus, the govt is free to print the heck out of currency and tax/steal from the people via inflation.

One other point: Gold contracts were also banned by the 1933 law. Mid 19th century, legal tender laws were passed that required the owner of a debt to be forced to take ANY type of legal tender.....and both gold and paper were legal tender. Thus, a person could settle a debt in paper if they chose to do so. (Goggle: Juilliard v. Greenman court case for a good understanding of this) People starting writing contracts that could ONLY be settled in gold coin.....so called "gold contracts". By making gold illegal to hold/use, it nullified all those in one fell swoop.


The vast majority of the gold they did get was already in banks. Folks with real amounts of gold were "in the know" and simply moved it offshore.

Today, there would be almost no reason to ban gold again.....since the banks have none, there is none in common circulation, and only tiny percentage of 'gold nuts' own any.

Silver, on the other hand, could quite easily come under some kind of "in the national interest" ban, since silver is a critical metal in many industrial and military applications....and the world supply of silver has shrunk considerably in the last 50 years. It takes 2/3oz of silver to make the average solar panel, and I've read every cruise missile blows a couple hundred ounces to smithereens. The USGS estimates there are 85 million ounces of silver sitting around in old cell phones, unrecoverable at today's price of silver. Care to venture a guess at the amount of silver on light switch contacts in the wall of your home.....then multiply that by the number of homes in the world ? Ball bearings: they use silver to coat the steel balls to give the bearing some cushion and longer life. Old bearing goes in the dump most of the time.....silver lost. Silver has a million uses other than money.

Most of the gold ever mined is still around where most of the silver ever mined is scattered to the winds.

 

[darsstars]

Everyone seems to have their own reason for owning PMs....or , NOT " investing" in same. The best you can do is listen to what comes across these posts, and other threads, then find your own reason or justification, and stick too it.

In my case I started collecting PMs 30 years ago, on a small scale , but just the same I always knew it was there in my safe deposit box. In good times I bought more, mostly gold, in poor times I forgot about it ! My thoughts were always centered around never cashing in , until the day came when I no longer had any ability to make money, to work as I always had , ( 7 days a week ) , It was an insurance policy for me.

During the height of the last recession ( I had already retired ) I started building my own retirement home on Lake Superior. When I went to secure a construction loan , to my surprise it was no money for no body, especially for a person like me who now was not gainfully employed , was old , was building as my own General contractor and doing a lot of the work myself. About halfway through the build, I ran out of cash , building stopped until I could "refund" the project . It was then , that I turned to my PMs in waiting . I started selling , one coin or bar at a time on eBay when I needed to pay contractors or buy more material. The end of the story , I now have a new paid for dream retirement home on a Mt. Top with a million dollar view ! The PMs are gone, now 5 years later I do not regret selling off my hard money , but I do miss it just the same !

 

[Kryton619]

Silver, on the other hand, could quite easily come under some kind of "in the national interest" ban, since silver is a critical metal in many industrial and military applications....and the world supply of silver has shrunk considerably in the last 50 years. It takes 2/3oz of silver to make the average solar panel, and I've read every cruise missile blows a couple hundred ounces to smithereens. The USGS estimates there are 85 million ounces of silver sitting around in old cell phones, unrecoverable at today's price of silver. Care to venture a guess at the amount of silver on light switch contacts in the wall of your home.....then multiply that by the number of homes in the world ? Ball bearings: they use silver to coat the steel balls to give the bearing some cushion and longer life. Old bearing goes in the dump most of the time.....silver lost. Silver has a million uses other than money.

Most of the gold ever mined is still around where most of the silver ever mined is scattered to the winds.

Very true....silver is a screaming deal right now. As you mentioned there is very little above ground silver. In the ground the ratio is approximately 15 ounces of silver for every ounce of gold, yet the gold to silver price ratio is over 60 - 1.

The end of the story , I now have a new paid for dream retirement home on a Mt. Top with a million dollar view ! The PMs are gone, now 5 years later I do not regret selling off my hard money , but I do miss it just the same !

Congratulations on building your dream home!!! You could always start a new stack 1 or 2 ounces of silver at a time.

 

[Larry Caldwell]

Just be aware that gold is a commodity that goes up and down, and selling it will require a hefty broker fee. If you bought gold at $1700, you already have lost 20% of your money, and by the time you get it sold you will lose another 10%.

If you are going to buy gold, wear it.

 

[houstonscott]

Don't think of gold or silver as an investment. It's a way of preserving or hiding wealth. It's closer to insurance. It's a way of reconstituting your wealth in a collapse. It's a great way to hide your wealth for investment in the future under better governmental, economic or political or tax circumstances. Over time the goods and services that gold buys has not changed. If you are looking to make money buying and selling gold you are probably in the wrong investment. HS