Is my MF 231 running too hot??

[CalG]

Do you think there could be any harm done if I took the radiator off and had it looked at/tested/rodded out at a shop? I don't think it would be difficult to remove it off the tractor. I guess what I'm asking is if you think it's worth spending the money and time doing so. The reason I'm concerned is because the tractor is 16 years old and look what happened to the radiator cap. Also, would it be a good idea to have this done before I put the expensive $16 per gallon (x3) coolant in there?

Thanks

Having the radiator rebuilt will improve the cooling and lower the coolant temperature so low, the thermostat will be superfeluous.
That will be good for your peace of mind.

For me, The 62 year old Fordson uses whatever anti freeze concoction is drained from any of several other rigs are being serviced. You may not need such expensive antifreeze either.

What I don't get is how the low coolant temperature of <160 F suggests a deficiency in the cooling system components.
There is a disconnect there.

Unless ther are other symptoms not as questionable as the panel gauge.

Investigate! Don't speculate.

 

[Travis_R]

Having the radiator rebuilt will improve the cooling and lower the coolant temperature so low, the thermostat will be superfeluous. That will be good for your peace of mind. For me, The 62 year old Fordson uses whatever anti freeze concoction is drained from any of several other rigs are being serviced. You may not need such expensive antifreeze either. What I don't get is how the low coolant temperature of <160 F suggests a deficiency in the cooling system components. There is a disconnect there. Unless ther are other symptoms not as questionable as the panel gauge. Investigate! Don't speculate.

I agree. Especially when I took the last reading on the Tstat housing after the engine was under a load. The needle on the gauge was in the "high green" area not far from the white (which come to find out is a sun faded red). Maybe a defaulty gauge or temp sending unit? I'm not sure so yes this is surely speculation. For some reason, I'm thinking the gauge should be reading in the lower to mid green. Not on the high side. This is the reason I started this thread in the 1st place. Should I change the gauge? The temp sending unit? I'm not sure. Also, If I change the gauge would I have to change the wiring also, or plug the new gauge into the old wiring? Thanks

 

[Travis_R]

I also want to mention that as far back as I can remember, the radiator has never been "pressurized" as far as "hearing" the pressure relieved when removing the the radiator cap.

Is this normal?

I'm comparing it to a gasoline engine. When the engine is hot when the radiator cap is removed and you can"feel" and "hear" the pressure being released when you slowly turn the cap to remove it.
If it's supposed to be like this for the Diesel engine on my tractor, it's not doing so.

 

[murphy1244]

Travis, If it were overheating I would be worried about it, until then I would leave well enough alone.

 

[TomSeller]

I also want to mention that as far back as I can remember, the radiator has never been "pressurized" as far as "hearing" the pressure relieved when removing the the radiator cap.

Is this normal?

I'm comparing it to a gasoline engine. When the engine is hot when the radiator cap is removed and you can"feel" and "hear" the pressure being released when you slowly turn the cap to remove it.
If it's supposed to be like this for the Diesel engine on my tractor, it's not doing so.

It is not normal but it is not a problem. Since your radiator cap fell apart and you have ordered a new one, once you install it you will pressurize the system when the engine warms up and expands the coolant.

 

[buickanddeere]

Dude you need to chill out. Not everyone is a expert in tractors or whatever. People come to the forum looking for help. So lets try to help as best we can and do away with the negative comments. In this world of insanity tractor people are somewhat special so lets keep it that way. Lets help our brothers and stay positive.

Sent from my iPhone using TractorByNet

We have been telling the dude for 13 pages he is being overly concerned over nothing . He won't put a gauge on the tractor that will read in degrees either. He wants to keep worrying about the white zone when nobody even knows that the temp of the white zone is. The tractor isn't boiling either.
There are bigger fish to fry than this issue.

 

[buickanddeere]

, the thermostat will be superfeluous.
That will be good for your peace of mind.

Please explain how a clean rad makes a stat superfluous ?


What I don't get is how the low coolant temperature of <160 F suggests a deficiency in the cooling system components.
There is a disconnect there.

Are you unaware of the engine damage caused by operating at coolant temps below 180F ?

.

160, 180 or 195

 

[pmsmechanic]

I've noticed over the years that temperature gauges are not accurate. All they do is give an indication of what the water temp is. So run the tractor up to 160F checked by your infrared on the thermostat and that on your gauge is 160F. Do the same when it's shows warmer on the gauge. Measure the temp on the thermostat with your infrared and note that point on your gauge. If your working the tractor hard measure the thermostat with you infrared. That is the temp your engine is running at. If you have good antifreeze and a rad cap that holds pressure you should be able to go to 220-230F without boiling over. By the sounds of these 13 pages you haven't been anywhere's close to that yet. I would have installed a 180F thermostat simply because the engine will burn all the fuel more efficiently at a hotter temp. You didn't do that and it's no big deal. The tractor has run umpteen years already with a 160F and to run a few more isn't going to kill anything. You'll just end up with a minuscule amount more of unburnt fuel in the oil vs a 180F thermostat. There is no need to open the rad cap to see if your engine is boiling over. You have an infrared thermometer. Check the temp of the thermostat and that is the temp that your engine is running at. If you can get the engine warm enough to cycle the thermostat you can even see when the thermostat opens and closes with the infrared. Hope this clears up a few things on this thread.

 

[Travis_R]

I've noticed over the years that temperature gauges are not accurate. All they do is give an indication of what the water temp is. So run the tractor up to 160F checked by your infrared on the thermostat and that on your gauge is 160F. Do the same when it's shows warmer on the gauge. Measure the temp on the thermostat with your infrared and note that point on your gauge. If your working the tractor hard measure the thermostat with you infrared. That is the temp your engine is running at. If you have good antifreeze and a rad cap that holds pressure you should be able to go to 220-230F without boiling over. By the sounds of these 13 pages you haven't been anywhere's close to that yet. I would have installed a 180F thermostat simply because the engine will burn all the fuel more efficiently at a hotter temp. You didn't do that and it's no big deal. The tractor has run umpteen years already with a 160F and to run a few more isn't going to kill anything. You'll just end up with a minuscule amount more of unburnt fuel in the oil vs a 180F thermostat. There is no need to open the rad cap to see if your engine is boiling over. You have an infrared thermometer. Check the temp of the thermostat and that is the temp that your engine is running at. If you can get the engine warm enough to cycle the thermostat you can even see when the thermostat opens and closes with the infrared. Hope this clears up a few things on this thread.

Thank You!
About the 180F Tstat, this engine came with a 160 and I'm almost positive it was in there for 16 years, the age of the tractor. The Massey Ferguson part number is a 160F Tstat. There is no indication there's even a 180F available, nor is there any indication that Massey Ferguson recommends it.
I think I will see some difference (or change) SOMEWHERE with the new radiator cap.

If the outside of the thermostat temp is 158 under engine load, the water inside has to be hotter, indicating to me the Tstat is opening?? Maybe I'm thinking wrong. Idk

 

[pmsmechanic]

I agree with you completely that there has been a 160F thermostat in that engine for years. That was the engineering at the time. As research showed that there was unburnt fuel running down the cylinder walls into the crankcase at lower engine temperatures the recommendations were changed to a higher temperature thermostat. I run a 190F in my 1998 Cummins year round with no ill effects. The truck has better heat in winter and it still doesn't overheat in summer even under a heavy load. Recommended thermostat is a 180F. The temperature that thermostat's open at is about as accurate as gauges so I'm thinking that if your infrared shows 158 that would be pretty close. If you hold the infrared steadily on the thermostat housing you should be able to see the temperature changes as the thermostat opens and closes. The ones that I have check usually change about 5-10 degrees F as they open and close. The range depends on the outside air and the engine temperatures. It is also quite normal on the rads that I have checked that the temp rises as the infrared measures temps closer to the top of the rad.