Ford F-450 with 6.4 diesel

[3930dave]

Sorry to hear about your problems.
I was a mechanic at a ford dealer during the beginning of 6.0 and later a field service engineer for ford during the end of 6.0 and beginning of 6.4.
6.4 Is just a 6.0 with extra head bolts to fix head bolt problems, 2 turbos to eliminate variable vanes, and too big a water pump to make up for too small of one in 6.0.
There are reasons that ford sued international and made their own engine.
A piston can be killed by a bad spray pattern from an injector.

tj - if I'm correct in saying that injector pattern was less of an issue with the 7.3, what changed starting with the 6.0 to make this a bigger issue ?

Rgds, D.

 

[3930dave]

I do add Power Service Diesel Kleen on occasion, but not regularly. I have used less than a gallon of it in 26k miles, so it's not very regular at all. :laughing:

I try to run a tank of biodiesel through it whenever I can (the nearest station is 35 miles away, but I do go by it every now and then). I seem to get 1+ MPG better on the tank AFTER a tank of bio for whatever reason.

Interesting. Cleaning action of the bioD perhaps ?

Unless you start using whatever that thing had for blood in the first Alien movie, it's hard to get injectors too clean, today. It's not easy (driving/load variations) to consistently check mileage, but I'd be tempted to regularily use an injector cleaner at recommended levels, and see if that mpg stabilizes higher.....

Edit - I think (?) fuel filter change intervals are now fairly short on these. Have you been changing the fuel filter at the factory interval tpw ?

Rgds, D.

 

[fordmantpw]

Interesting. Cleaning action of the bioD perhaps ?

Unless you start using whatever that thing had for blood in the first Alien movie, it's hard to get injectors too clean, today. It's not easy (driving/load variations) to consistently check mileage, but I'd be tempted to regularily use an injector cleaner at recommended levels, and see if that mpg stabilizes higher.....

Edit - I think (?) fuel filter change intervals are now fairly short on these. Have you been changing the fuel filter at the factory interval tpw ?

Rgds, D.

Yeah, I was thinking it may be the cleaning action of the bio. Yes, checking mileage is very difficult, and my driving is crappy for mileage anyway. I don't put many miles on either. I've only put 25k miles on in the 3+ years I've owned it. And yes, I change the fuel filter at the recommended interval. From what I understand, that is one of the most important things you can do for these trucks.

 

[3930dave]

Yeah, I was thinking it may be the cleaning action of the bio. Yes, checking mileage is very difficult, and my driving is crappy for mileage anyway. I don't put many miles on either. I've only put 25k miles on in the 3+ years I've owned it. And yes, I change the fuel filter at the recommended interval. From what I understand, that is one of the most important things you can do for these trucks.

I've seen fuel filters come out of 7.3s with a really stupid amount of (high) miles on them..... some older diesels could put up with that abuse. On any of the newer diesels, I definitely wouldn't go past the factory change interval. In fact I'd probably change a bit early, esp. if I wasn't always using a known and trusted diesel supplier.

Rgds, D.

 

[fordmantpw]

I've seen fuel filters come out of 7.3s with a really stupid amount of (high) miles on them..... some older diesels could put up with that abuse. On any of the newer diesels, I definitely wouldn't go past the factory change interval. In fact I'd probably change a bit early, esp. if I wasn't always using a known and trusted diesel supplier.

Rgds, D.

These high pressure injectors squirting fuel multiple times per combustion stroke need really clean fuel. That was one issue of the 6.0L when it first came out. When Ford tested it, they carried around most of their own fuel due to the fact that it wasn't readily available everywhere they were testing. Then when the engine made it to the public, the available fuel wasn't as high quality and clean as what was readily to everyone at the pump.

 

[3930dave]

These high pressure injectors squirting fuel multiple times per combustion stroke need really clean fuel. That was one issue of the 6.0L when it first came out. When Ford tested it, they carried around most of their own fuel due to the fact that it wasn't readily available everywhere they were testing. Then when the engine made it to the public, the available fuel wasn't as high quality and clean as what was readily to everyone at the pump.

I'm old enough to remember going through the same issues in Canada with gasoline fuel injectors, back in the 70s.

I've had an interesting private conversation with a knowledgeable TBN'er about the opposite approach to injector testing at the factory - they'll deliberately ADD calibrated (by particle size) contaminate material to fuel for acclerated life testing, and to somewhat mirror the lousy fuel that can be found in the wild.

Significant changes in technology often create bumpy (read - inconvenient and expensive) transitions, and serve as reminders to "experienced" (read - Why Should I Read That Manual) folks that sometimes the factory recommendations are there for really good reasons.

It's not always An Evil Plot Just to Sell More ____________ .

Rgds, D.

 

[fordmantpw]

I've had an interesting private conversation with a knowledgeable TBN'er about the opposite approach to injector testing at the factory - they'll deliberately ADD calibrated (by particle size) contaminate material to fuel for acclerated life testing, and to somewhat mirror the lousy fuel that can be found in the wild.

Yep, things have changed drastically to accommodate changes in technology and the ways that new technology is affected by things such as dirty fuel.

Significant changes in technology often create bumpy (read - inconvenient and expensive) transitions, and serve as reminders to "experienced" (read - Why Should I Read That Manual) folks that sometimes the factory recommendations are there for really good reasons.

It's not always An Evil Plot Just to Sell More ____________ .

Rgds, D.

Agreed!

 

[My Hoe]

Interesting thread. I'm sorry for the TBN'ers that have experienced these issues, but really appreciate them sharing. Subscribed.

 

[2458n]

Did my usual search of Gov Deals.com tonight. There is a fairly low mileage 6.4 in a F-250 Ford. Bidding was in the 300.00 dollar range. At 50-60 thousand miles the engine was in the bed of the truck. Front bumper was missing, but that should tell you about the cost of fixing one.

 

[tjkubota93]

tj - if I'm correct in saying that injector pattern was less of an issue with the 7.3, what changed starting with the 6.0 to make this a bigger issue ?

Rgds, D.

Im not sure on that.
I was just taught that a bad spray pattern would tear up stuff.
Most 6.0 problems were head gaskets/egr coolers/turbos/hp oil leaks.
Most 6.4 were cooling system related while I was there. The radiator would leak causing the water pump to cavitate and erode parts internally.